Yahoo! Message number: 3000
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2015 11:22:43 -0700
From: Ian Finder
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Compass-II 1129 SPOC (1984) System Build
text/plain; charset=utf-8 

Oh so you're the guy who bought the one listed at $500.00 on eBay and resisted it two days later $35,000.00?

Cool beans!

Yahoo! Message number: 3001
Date: 15 Jul 2015 16:22:01 -0700
From: pullin_gs@...
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Compass-II 1129 SPOC (1984) System Build
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Yes, that is my Grid.
The high-profile (high-price) add has already paid dividends.
I got a message from the folks over at Johnson Space Center in Houston and also received a message yesterday from the current SPoC Team Lead (SPoC not same as SPOC).
He shared a few thoughts and observations regarding how things have evolved of the years.  I was given a glimpse of what his team has been working on which will travel on their next manned mission.  My how things have changed!

I still have not heard from anyone who worked the original program in the early eighties (they would be in their 60's now?).  I'll let the add run for a few more weeks before I pull it.  Hopefully I get some more messages, and maybe even a contact who would like to discuss SPOC from the old days.

Yahoo! Message number: 3003
Date: 18 Jul 2015 09:53:47 -0700
From: klyball@...
Subject: Re: Compass-II 1129 SPOC (1984) System Build
text/plain; charset=utf-8 

That a great computer you have, is the spoc software on the roms? I would assume its in the bubble memory it would be great if it could get backed up in case the bubble starts failing, do you have the floppy drive for the compass. Does it have modem software on it, might be able to back it up that way . 
 

 Grant

Yahoo! Message number: 3004
Date: 18 Jul 2015 11:40:20 -0700
From: pullin_gs@...
Subject: Re: Compass-II 1129 SPOC (1984) System Build
text/plain; charset=utf-8 

Thanks for the note Grant. 
I thought SPOC software was on ROMs.  I was wrong.
When I backed up the GRID-OS EPROM.....I did a HEX inspection it was clear that the ROMs are standard GRID-OS ROMs. :-(
I did not back up the GRID-UTILITIES ROM (not EPROM) because I am unsure as to how to do this with my SUPERPROO-III EPROM burner. 

This Grid has a custom BIOS I think.
The Compass boots straight to SPOC bypassing GRID-OS boot messages or GRID-OS operations menus.
When I boot it, the screen stays blank for a few seconds and then displays the "51-I Mission" welcome boot-splash screen.
This displays for about 15 seconds and then goes directly the "Enter GMT Time" screen and awaits input.
When I press CODE-U or any other CODE sequence they are ignored.  It only accepts CODE commands that are displayed (CODE-RETURN or CODE-ESC) for the input screen.

One of the ROM chips is the GRID-UTILITIES ROM.....I think this includes GRID-DUMP (or whatever its called) that allows you to do an INTEL-HEX formatted dump of memory contents out the RS232 port.

Can you share any insight as to how to access the GRID-OS-Utilities?  Maybe an escape sequence or CODE-command that I have missed?

Yahoo! Message number: 3005
Date: 18 Jul 2015 15:32:42 -0700
From: klyball@...
Subject: Re: Compass-II 1129 SPOC (1984) System Build
text/plain; charset=utf-8 

I have my 1139 apart right now as im working on another project , the 1139 is basically the same as a 1129 but with a bigger screen I do have a 1129 motherboard and they are the same the bios roms will probably be a tad different i did unsolder and dump the 1139 bios but have not dumped the 1129/ guess i should do that and compare them
 The compass will default to the bubble if there is a bootable media on there, which would be your case
 Ok if memory serves me you hold F or D for floppy R for rom or D or B or maybe H for bubble when power on
 it will boot from rom or disk or bubble , But mines apart at the moment to test
 let me know if that get you anywhere, i had 1 bubble fail in my 1139 and are not easy to find

Yahoo! Message number: 3006
Date: 12 Aug 2015 14:27:41 -0700
From: ianfinder@...
Subject: Looking for a GRiD Compass 1XXX Power Supply!
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Hi folks,
 

 I recently came into a Compass 1101. I'd like to get it running. Imagine my surprise when I took it apart and found it complete except for no power supply or modem.
 

 If anyone has a donor power supply from an 1101, 1129 (or a modem for that matter)-- or a complete parts machine-- in any condition PLEASE (!!!) get in touch with me.
 

 I will pay good money. I'd really like to get this machine going again.
 

 As always, I'm looking for other compass systems as well, as I've begun undertaking a reverse engineering project based around CCOS.
 

 I'm also still looking for a GRIDCASE 15XX series plasma inverter.
 

 I can be reached at <ian.finder@gmail.com>.
 

 Cheers,
 

 - Ian

Yahoo! Message number: 3007
Date: 23 Aug 2015 13:47:23 -0700
From: klyball@...
Subject: GRiDMAN

Going through my compass disks and found this gem

This is part 2 of a multi-part message.

Attached image/jpeg file not shown; stay tuned!

Yahoo! Message number: 3008
Date: Mon, 24 Aug 2015 01:28:30 +0000 (UTC)
From: Shawnerz
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GRiDMAN [1 Attachment]
text/plain; charset=UTF-8 

Klyball,That is AWESOME!Very impressive!-Shawn
      From: "klyball@hotmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Sunday, August 23, 2015 4:47 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GRiDMAN [1 Attachment]

<!--#yiv2759713493 #yiv2759713493 .yiv2759713493ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv2759713493 div.yiv2759713493ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv2759713493 div.yiv2759713493photo-title a, #yiv2759713493 div.yiv2759713493photo-title a:active, #yiv2759713493 div.yiv2759713493photo-title a:hover, #yiv2759713493 div.yiv2759713493photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv2759713493 div.yiv2759713493attach-table div.yiv2759713493attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv2759713493 div.yiv2759713493attach-table div.yiv2759713493attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv2759713493 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv2759713493 div.yiv2759713493ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv2759713493 div.yiv2759713493attach-table div.yiv2759713493attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv2759713493 div.yiv2759713493attach-table div.yiv2759713493attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv2759713493 div.yiv2759713493ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv2759713493 --> <!--#yiv2759713493 #yiv2759713493ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv2759713493 #yiv2759713493ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv2759713493 #yiv2759713493ygrp-mkp #yiv2759713493hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv2759713493 #yiv2759713493ygrp-mkp #yiv2759713493ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv2759713493 #yiv2759713493ygrp-mkp .yiv2759713493ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv2759713493 #yiv2759713493ygrp-mkp .yiv2759713493ad p {margin:0;}#yiv2759713493 #yiv2759713493ygrp-mkp .yiv2759713493ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}-->[Attachment(s) from klyball@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] included below]

Going through my compass disks and found this gem

Yahoo! Message number: 3009
Date: 29 Aug 2015 11:21:04 -0700
From: ianfinder@...
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GRiDMAN [1 Attachment]

Are you planning to start imaging and posting the disks? It would be really nice and helpful, and I want to play PacMan. ;)

I can help image and pay shipping for disks if you need but we should get this stuff preserved  and online if possible.

Yahoo! Message number: 3010
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 2015 02:54:17 GMT
From: "uncle_fred1@..."
Subject: New member testing

Greetings fellow GRiD owners.

  I have a GRiDCASE 1530 (really a friends) and a "straight" GRiDCASE.  Having trouble with the 1530 serial port.  I have yet to download any configuration software as the files section for this group is grayed out.

  This message is a quick info post and to see if I am really subscribed!

  My/our main use for these computers will be for RTTY terminals.  I have a Dovetron and a HAL ST-8000 among others.  Also use the GRiDCASE to program radios that "require" DOS (it's serial port works FB).

  More "profile" to follow if this goes through.

Thanks,

Fred Sell
WA7OBB
Riverton, Oregon (Near Coquille)
____________________________________________________________
Meet the Graviteers: Ezekiel Victor
My name is Zeke! I find it hard to pick favorites because I get sick of too much of one thing.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/5611e69d1c72669c2e40st03duc

Yahoo! Message number: 3011
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 2015 01:24:18 +0000 (UTC)
From: Shawnerz
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] New member testing
text/plain; charset=UTF-8 

Hello there, Fred.Welcome to the group.I do not know why the Files section is grayed out. I see you are a member. As a member, you should have access to the Files section. I have no explanation as to why it's not working for you.I will say that your email ended up in my Spam folder. My guess the reason is the juno hyperlink that Juno inserts in to every email.
Back to your question, I'm not an expert on the 1530. In DOS, you might want to try the MODE command to turn on the serial port. On the 1520 and 1550, there is a file called conf1520.exe (or conf1550.exe). It allows you to enable or disable the serial port. Perhaps that is the problem. You might want to look for a conf1530.exe file.
Wow! The HAL ST-8000. I remember when I would have just about killed for one of those! Nowadays, it's all SDR tuners and software. Progress, eh?73,-Shawn
      From: "'uncle_fred1@...' uncle_fred1@juno.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: rugrid-laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Sunday, October 4, 2015 10:54 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] New member testing

Greetings fellow GRiD owners.

  I have a GRiDCASE 1530 (really a friends) and a "straight" GRiDCASE.  Having trouble with the 1530 serial port.  I have yet to download any configuration software as the files section for this group is grayed out.

  This message is a quick info post and to see if I am really subscribed!

  My/our main use for these computers will be for RTTY terminals.  I have a Dovetron and a HAL ST-8000 among others.  Also use the GRiDCASE to program radios that "require" DOS (it's serial port works FB).

  More "profile" to follow if this goes through.

Thanks,

Fred Sell
WA7OBB
Riverton, Oregon (Near Coquille)
____________________________________________________________
Meet the Graviteers: Ezekiel Victor
My name is Zeke! I find it hard to pick favorites because I get sick of too much of one thing.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/5611e69d1c72669c2e40st03duc

Yahoo! Message number: 3012
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 2015 03:48:16 GMT
From: "uncle_fred1@..."
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] New member testing

Shawn,

  Maybe it's a login thing, I will try again and maybe contact Yahoo as a last resort!

  I tried the mode thing, used the boot disk that works with the other machine.  Not the same I know but was worth a try.  I thought I had a 1500 series config program but not so sure now.

  Other things in the way right now so will try again in a few days.

  Yes, the ST-8000 is trick. I won the chance to purchase it in a lottery, got it for $175 delivered.

Fred
____________________________________________________________
Meet the Graviteers: Ezekiel Victor
My name is Zeke! I find it hard to pick favorites because I get sick of too much of one thing.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/561344dcbf57144dc0eb1st02duc

Yahoo! Message number: 3013
Date: 06 Nov 2015 12:27:13 -0800
From: joshuaparkour@...
Subject: External Numberpad
text/plain; charset=utf-8 

I recently bought a external grid numberpad for my gridcase 1520.
 

 It uses the keyboard port and is model 32160
 

 The problem is every time I plug it in and press a key, my gridcase beeps like crazy and displays a =
 every time I press a key. I think there must be a driver I have to load into ram first but I am unable to find one.
 The plug is intact and in very good condition. 
 

 Do you guys think that the numberpad is broken or is it a software problem?

Yahoo! Message number: 3014
Date: Sat, 7 Nov 2015 04:23:07 +0000 (UTC)
From: Shawnerz
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] External Numberpad
text/plain; charset=UTF-8 

I will pull mine from storage this weekend and see what happens.I'll let you know.-Shawn
      From: "joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Friday, November 6, 2015 3:27 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] External Numberpad

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I recently bought a external grid numberpad for my gridcase 1520.
It uses the keyboard port and is model 32160
The problem is every time I plug it in and press a key, my gridcase beeps like crazy and displays a =every time I press a key. I think there must be a driver I have to load into ram first but I am unable to find one.The plug is intact and in very good condition.
Do you guys think that the numberpad is broken or is it a software problem?

Yahoo! Message number: 3015
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 2015 15:49:16 +0000
From: Guillaume Le Saint
Subject: Gridcase 3 - ROMs and software
text/plain; charset=UTF-8 

Hello everyone,

I finally got my hands on a GRiD laptop, a Gridcase 3.
It came without any ROM, with a 3.5" drive and just a "travel disk" that's
loaded with MSDOS 2.11.
Can it run GRiD OS? I'd like to try it.
Can you guys let me know how to get my hands on software or ROM?

Thanks!
Guillaume

Yahoo! Message number: 3016
Date: Tue, 17 Nov 2015 17:59:44 +0000 (UTC)
From: Shawnerz
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Gridcase 3 - ROMs and software
text/plain; charset=UTF-8 

Hello Guillaume and welcome to the group! :)Please take a look in the Files area to see if the files you need are there.If not feel free to email the group again.Glad to have you here,-Shawn

      From: "Guillaume Le Saint glesaint@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Tuesday, November 17, 2015 10:49 AM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Gridcase 3 - ROMs and software

<!--#yiv3513682685 #yiv3513682685 .yiv3513682685ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv3513682685 div.yiv3513682685ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv3513682685 div.yiv3513682685photo-title a, #yiv3513682685 div.yiv3513682685photo-title a:active, #yiv3513682685 div.yiv3513682685photo-title a:hover, #yiv3513682685 div.yiv3513682685photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv3513682685 div.yiv3513682685attach-table div.yiv3513682685attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv3513682685 div.yiv3513682685attach-table div.yiv3513682685attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv3513682685 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv3513682685 div.yiv3513682685ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv3513682685 div.yiv3513682685attach-table div.yiv3513682685attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv3513682685 div.yiv3513682685attach-table div.yiv3513682685attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv3513682685 div.yiv3513682685ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv3513682685 --> <!--#yiv3513682685 #yiv3513682685ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv3513682685 #yiv3513682685ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv3513682685 #yiv3513682685ygrp-mkp #yiv3513682685hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv3513682685 #yiv3513682685ygrp-mkp #yiv3513682685ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv3513682685 #yiv3513682685ygrp-mkp .yiv3513682685ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv3513682685 #yiv3513682685ygrp-mkp .yiv3513682685ad p {margin:0;}#yiv3513682685 #yiv3513682685ygrp-mkp .yiv3513682685ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}-->

Hello everyone,

I finally got my hands on a GRiD laptop, a Gridcase 3.
It came without any ROM, with a 3.5" drive and just a "travel disk" that's loaded with MSDOS 2.11.
Can it run GRiD OS? I'd like to try it.
Can you guys let me know how to get my hands on software or ROM?

Thanks!
Guillaume

Yahoo! Message number: 3017
Date: 28 Nov 2015 16:42:49 -0800
From: asajay@...
Subject: Is there a way to get software out of the ROM?
text/plain; charset=utf-8 

Brand new member here.

I have a few GRiDcase units, but not exactly sure of the models.

The one I'm currently concerned with has a 720K floppy, a parallel port, two serial ports and an IEEE port.  The unit appears to operate fine; however, it has a radio control program built-in to the ROM (boots directly to it) and I would very much like to get it off the GRiD and working on another computer (non-GRiD) in a DOS window.  I've managed to get most files copied off the ROM; those I can "see" at the prompt.  But when I go to run the application in a DOS window on another machine, I get an error that it can't access the ROM drive though parts of the application do run.

I think there are some other files hidden from view and unfortunately ATTRIB is not included in the DOS utilities already on the system.  Either that or the application is hard-coded to look at a specific part of the ROM, I don't know for certain.  I also do not have a copy of GRiD DOS 3.2.

I do have a copy of GRiD DOS 5.0 on three 1.4M floppies but they don't work in the 720K drive.

So is there a way for me to get more off this machine?  It's running DOS 3.2 according to the decal on the ROM chip above the keyboard.

I can probably supply photos if it would help.
Thank you,
Asa Jay

Yahoo! Message number: 3018
Date: Sun, 29 Nov 2015 04:58:07 +0000 (UTC)
From: Shawnerz
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Is there a way to get software out of the ROM?
text/plain; charset=UTF-8 

Hello there, Asa Jay and welcome to the group! :)The model type of your Grid units will be on the bottom of the unit. It also could be on the back, but most are on the bottom. It should be an 1520 or 1184 or 1180 or something like that. From your description, it sounds like you have a 1520 without a hard drive.  It is possible that there is a hard drive, but it has died and it is not responding.I am not familiar with the radio control program. I do not know why the program is looking for the ROM when it is run. I think here is a DOS command to redirect the a drive to another drive letter. It's odd that 1.44 floppies don't work in the 720K drive. My 1520's will read both.You might try pressing the 'f' key during boot to see if you can get the Grid to boot from floppy. If it does boot, the the MS-DOS 5 installer will probably be looking a hard drive to install to. But, it would test if the drive can read 1.44 floppies.Good luck and please tell us your results,-Shawn

      From: "asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Saturday, November 28, 2015 7:42 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Is there a way to get software out of the ROM?

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Brand new member here.

I have a few GRiDcase units, but not exactly sure of the models.

The one I'm currently concerned with has a 720K floppy, a parallel port, two serial ports and an IEEE port.  The unit appears to operate fine; however, it has a radio control program built-in to the ROM (boots directly to it) and I would very much like to get it off the GRiD and working on another computer (non-GRiD) in a DOS window.  I've managed to get most files copied off the ROM; those I can "see" at the prompt.  But when I go to run the application in a DOS window on another machine, I get an error that it can't access the ROM drive though parts of the application do run.

I think there are some other files hidden from view and unfortunately ATTRIB is not included in the DOS utilities already on the system.  Either that or the application is hard-coded to look at a specific part of the ROM, I don't know for certain.  I also do not have a copy of GRiD DOS 3.2.

I do have a copy of GRiD DOS 5.0 on three 1.4M floppies but they don't work in the 720K drive.

So is there a way for me to get more off this machine?  It's running DOS 3.2 according to the decal on the ROM chip above the keyboard.

I can probably supply photos if it would help.
Thank you,
Asa Jay

Yahoo! Message number: 3019
Date: Sun, 29 Nov 2015 21:25:54 -0800
From: Asa Jay Laughton
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Is there a way to get software out of the ROM?

Thank you for the warm welcome. :)
I can't find any model numbers on this unit at all. Please check out the photos here:
http://asajay.com/TSC-60/V9GRiD/

I've not opened the case to see if it has a hard drive, but I doubt that it does. I've worked with those that have hard drives and this one seems to be an earlier model. I could still be wrong though but might have to take it apart to know for certain.

Since all the files appear on A: even when a floppy is not installed, I doubt there is a hard drive. When a floppy is inserted, the files on the floppy will appear on the same A: in addition to those not on the floppy.

Example:
Without floppy installed, a DIR listing will show (note this is not a complete listing)
command.com
autoexec.bat

Install the floppy with two programs and now the A: listing will show
command.com
autoexec.bat
program1.exe (from floppy)
program2.exe (from floppy)

So that's a bit weird but okay.
To copy those files from A: to a floppy, I use copy A: B: and the system expects me to swap floppies, which works, I just insert the B: floppy when it wants it and don't insert one when it wants A:

This is an ex-military model used with an old HF radio facility. The radio control program is in ROM. The laptop boots straight into the app via the autoexec.bat file. The only way I can interrupt it is by constantly pressing Ctrl+C while the autoexec is running and before it starts the program. Normally, a person with this problem would simply want to get a ROM set with a standard OS and typical applications. However, in my case, I'd like to get the radio control program OFF the ROM in order to work with it on a modern computer. The software still controls the radios quite well but I'd like to get it working on a modern computer in order to do some additional things with it.

An early 720K floppy drive will ONLY read 1.4M floppies formatted to "look" like 720K floppies. The GRiD DOS 5.0 disks are formatted as 1.4M and they read just fine in my desktop but NOT on the GRiD. If I put that floppy into the drive, the laptop attempts to boot to it, but it can't find any files on it, so I have to remove the floppy and do a Ctrl+Alt+Delete. Interesting enough, I'm using 1.4M floppies (formatted as 720K) to transfer files and I have to tape over the extra hole in the floppy in order to get my desktop to read them as a 720K floppy, though on the GRiD it doesn't care about the extra hole.

In short, it all works fine and as-designed. I would simply like to get -everything- off the ROM, but can't "see" everything that's on it. Perhaps if I could get the entire suite of DOS 3.2 files I could use the ATTRIB command to view whatever is hidden. Unfortunately, the DIR command does not recognize the switch a:h and trying to copy anything that might be hidden is impossible at the moment.

What would really do it is some program that I could run from floppy that would walk through the ROM and copy it's entire contents out to floppy. Is there such an animal?

Please review the photos linked at the beginning of this email and see if you can tell exactly what model it is.

Thank you,
Asa Jay

Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
On 11/28/2015 8:58 PM, Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
Hello there, Asa Jay and welcome to the group! :)
The model type of your Grid units will be on the bottom of the unit. It also could be on the back, but most are on the bottom. It should be an 1520 or 1184 or 1180 or something like that. From your description, it sounds like you have a 1520 without a hard drive. It is possible that there is a hard drive, but it has died and it is not responding.
I am not familiar with the radio control program. I do not know why the program is looking for the ROM when it is run. I think here is a DOS command to redirect the a drive to another drive letter. It's odd that 1.44 floppies don't work in the 720K drive. My 1520's will read both.
You might try pressing the 'f' key during boot to see if you can get the Grid to boot from floppy. If it does boot, the the MS-DOS 5 installer will probably be looking a hard drive to install to. But, it would test if the drive can read 1.44 floppies.
Good luck and please tell us your results,
-Shawn


From: "asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"
To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, November 28, 2015 7:42 PM
Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Is there a way to get software out of the ROM?



Brand new member here.

I have a few GRiDcase units, but not exactly sure of the models.

The one I'm currently concerned with has a 720K floppy, a parallel port, two serial ports and an IEEE port. The unit appears to operate fine; however, it has a radio control program built-in to the ROM (boots directly to it) and I would very much like to get it off the GRiD and working on another computer (non-GRiD) in a DOS window. I've managed to get most files copied off the ROM; those I can "see" at the prompt. But when I go to run the application in a DOS window on another machine, I get an error that it can't access the ROM drive though parts of the application do run.

I think there are some other files hidden from view and unfortunately ATTRIB is not included in the DOS utilities already on the system. Either that or the application is hard-coded to look at a specific part of the ROM, I don't know for certain. I also do not have a c opy of GRiD DOS 3.2.

I do have a copy of GRiD DOS 5.0 on three 1.4M floppies but they don't work in the 720K drive.

So is there a way for me to get more off this machine? It's running DOS 3.2 according to the decal on the ROM chip above the keyboard.

I can probably supply photos if it would help.
Thank you,
Asa Jay





No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.7227 / Virus Database: 4477/11083 - Release Date: 11/28/15

Yahoo! Message number: 3020
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2015 08:10:52 +0000 (UTC)
From: =?UTF-8?B?0K7RgNC40Lkg0JvQtdGB0LrQvtCy0LXRhg==?=
Subject: =?UTF-8?Q?=D0=9E=D1=82=D0=B2:_[RuGRiD-Laptop]_Is_there_a_w?= =?UTF-8?Q?ay_to_get_software_out_of_the_ROM=3F?=
text/plain; charset=UTF-8 

Hello, Asa Jay!
This is GRiDCase Model IV.
If you want to sell it, we can buy.
Yuri, Director of Computer Museum.


    понедельник, 30 ноября 2015 10:26 "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> писал(а):


      Thank you for the warm welcome.  :)
 I can't find any model numbers on this unit at all.  Please check out the photos here:
 http://asajay.com/TSC-60/V9GRiD/

 I've not opened the case to see if it has a hard drive, but I doubt that it does.  I've worked with those that have hard drives and this one seems to be an earlier model.  I could still be wrong though but might have to take it apart to know for certain.

 Since all the files appear on A: even when a floppy is not installed, I doubt there is a hard drive.  When a floppy is inserted, the files on the floppy will appear on the same A: in addition to those not on the floppy.
 
 Example:
 Without floppy installed, a DIR listing will show (note this is not a complete listing)
 command.com
 autoexec.bat

 Install the floppy with two programs and now the A: listing will show
 command.com
 autoexec.bat
 program1.exe (from floppy)
 program2.exe (from floppy)

 So that's a bit weird but okay.
 To copy those files from A: to a floppy, I use copy A: B: and the system expects me to swap floppies, which works, I just insert the B: floppy when it wants it and don't insert one when it wants A:

 This is an ex-military model used with an old HF radio facility.  The radio control program is in ROM.  The laptop boots straight into the app via the autoexec.bat file.  The only way I can interrupt it is by constantly pressing Ctrl+C while the autoexec is running and before it starts the program.  Normally, a person with this problem would simply want to get a ROM set with a standard OS and typical applications.  However, in my case, I'd like to get the radio control program OFF the ROM in order to work with it on a modern computer.  The software still controls the radios quite well but I'd like to get it working on a modern computer in order to do some additional things with it.

 An early 720K floppy drive will ONLY read 1.4M floppies formatted to "look" like 720K floppies.  The GRiD DOS 5.0 disks are formatted as 1.4M and they read just fine in my desktop but NOT on the GRiD.  If I put that floppy into the drive, the laptop attempts to boot to it, but it can't find any files on it, so I have to remove the floppy and do a Ctrl+Alt+Delete.  Interesting enough, I'm using 1.4M floppies (formatted as 720K) to transfer files and I have to tape over the extra hole in the floppy in order to get my desktop to read them as a 720K floppy, though on the GRiD it doesn't care about the extra hole.

 In short, it all works fine and as-designed.  I would simply like to get -everything- off the ROM, but can't "see" everything that's on it.  Perhaps if I could get the entire suite of DOS 3.2 files I could use the ATTRIB command to view whatever is hidden.  Unfortunately, the DIR command does not recognize the switch a:h and trying to copy anything that might be hidden is impossible at the moment.

 What would really do it is some program that I could run from floppy that would walk through the ROM and copy it's entire contents out to floppy.  Is there such an animal?

 Please review the photos linked at the beginning of this email and see if you can tell exactly what model it is.

 Thank you,
 Asa  Jay

 Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
 On 11/28/2015 8:58 PM, Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
     Hello there, Asa Jay and welcome to the group! :) The model type of your Grid units will be on the bottom of the unit. It also could be on the back, but most are on the bottom.  It should be an 1520 or 1184 or 1180 or something like that. From your description, it sounds like you have a 1520 without a hard drive.  It is possible that there is a hard drive, but it has died and it is not responding. I am not familiar with the radio control program. I do not know why the program is looking for the ROM when it is run. I think  here is a DOS command to redirect the a drive to another drive letter. It's odd that 1.44 floppies don't work in the 720K drive. My 1520's will read both. You might try pressing the 'f' key during boot to see if you can get the Grid to boot from floppy. If it does boot, the the MS-DOS 5 installer will probably be looking a hard drive to install to. But, it would test if the drive can read 1.44 floppies. Good luck and please tell us your results, -Shawn

      From: "asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Saturday, November 28, 2015 7:42 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Is there a way to get software out of the ROM?



 Brand new member here.

 I have a few GRiDcase units, but not exactly sure of the models.

 The one I'm currently concerned with has a 720K floppy, a parallel port, two serial ports and an IEEE port.  The unit appears to operate fine; however, it has a radio control program built-in to the ROM (boots directly to it) and I would  very much like to get it off the GRiD and working on another computer (non-GRiD) in a DOS window.  I've managed to get most files copied off the ROM; those I can "see" at the prompt.  But when I go to run the application in a DOS window on another machine, I get an error that it can't access the ROM drive though parts of the application do run.

 I think there are some other files hidden from view and unfortunately ATTRIB is not included in the DOS utilities already on the system.  Either that or the application is hard-coded to look at a specific part of the ROM, I don't know for certain.  I also do not have a c opy of GRiD DOS 3.2.

 I do have a copy of GRiD DOS 5.0 on three 1.4M floppies but they don't work in the 720K drive.
 
 So is there a way for me to get more off this machine?  It's running DOS 3.2 according to the decal on the ROM chip above the keyboard.

 I can probably supply photos if it would help.
 Thank you,
 Asa Jay




 
       No virus found in this message.
 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
 Version: 2016.0.7227 / Virus Database: 4477/11083 - Release Date: 11/28/15
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Yahoo! Message number: 3021
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2015 09:55:57 +0000
From: David Walton
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Is there a way to get software out of the ROM?
text/plain; charset=utf-8 

Hi, It's a gridcase Tempest model 1307. I have one. Sorry but I unable to help you further with your queries. Where did you get it from? Do you have the user manual for it, as I could scan for others to use if you are willing to post it.

Regards

David Walton

On 30 Nov 2015, at 05:25, "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

> Thank you for the warm welcome.  :)
> I can't find any model numbers on this unit at all.  Please check out the photos here:
> http://asajay.com/TSC-60/V9GRiD/
>
> I've not opened the case to see if it has a hard drive, but I doubt that it does.  I've worked with those that have hard drives and this one seems to be an earlier model.  I could still be wrong though but might have to take it apart to know for certain.
>
> Since all the files appear on A: even when a floppy is not installed, I doubt there is a hard drive.  When a floppy is inserted, the files on the floppy will appear on the same A: in addition to those not on the floppy.
>
> Example:
> Without floppy installed, a DIR listing will show (note this is not a complete listing)
> command.com
> autoexec.bat
>
> Install the floppy with two programs and now the A: listing will show
> command.com
> autoexec.bat
> program1.exe (from floppy)
> program2.exe (from floppy)
>
> So that's a bit weird but okay.
> To copy those files from A: to a floppy, I use copy A: B: and the system expects me to swap floppies, which works, I just insert the B: floppy when it wants it and don't insert one when it wants A:
>
> This is an ex-military model used with an old HF radio facility.  The radio control program is in ROM.  The laptop boots straight into the app via the autoexec.bat file.  The only way I can interrupt it is by constantly pressing Ctrl+C while the autoexec is running and before it starts the program.  Normally, a person with this problem would simply want to get a ROM set with a standard OS and typical applications.  However, in my case, I'd like to get the radio control program OFF the ROM in order to work with it on a modern computer.  The software still controls the radios quite well but I'd like to get it working on a modern computer in order to do some additional things with it.
>
> An early 720K floppy drive will ONLY read 1.4M floppies formatted to "look" like 720K floppies.  The GRiD DOS 5.0 disks are formatted as 1.4M and they read just fine in my desktop but NOT on the GRiD.  If I put that floppy into the drive, the laptop attempts to boot to it, but it can't find any files on it, so I have to remove the floppy and do a Ctrl+Alt+Delete.  Interesting enough, I'm using 1.4M floppies (formatted as 720K) to transfer files and I have to tape over the extra hole in the floppy in order to get my desktop to read them as a 720K floppy, though on the GRiD it doesn't care about the extra hole.
>
> In short, it all works fine and as-designed.  I would simply like to get -everything- off the ROM, but can't "see" everything that's on it.  Perhaps if I could get the entire suite of DOS 3.2 files I could use the ATTRIB command to view whatever is hidden.  Unfortunately, the DIR command does not recognize the switch a:h and trying to copy anything that might be hidden is impossible at the moment.
>
> What would really do it is some program that I could run from floppy that would walk through the ROM and copy it's entire contents out to floppy.  Is there such an animal?
>
> Please review the photos linked at the beginning of this email and see if you can tell exactly what model it is.
>
> Thank you,
> Asa  Jay
>
> Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
> On 11/28/2015 8:58 PM, Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
>>
>>
>> Hello there, Asa Jay and welcome to the group! :)
>> The model type of your Grid units will be on the bottom of the unit. It also could be on the back, but most are on the bottom. It should be an 1520 or 1184 or 1180 or something like that. From your description, it sounds like you have a 1520 without a hard drive.  It is possible that there is a hard drive, but it has died and it is not responding.
>> I am not familiar with the radio control program. I do not know why the program is looking for the ROM when it is run. I think here is a DOS command to redirect the a drive to another drive letter. It's odd that 1.44 floppies don't work in the 720K drive. My 1520's will read both.
>> You might try pressing the 'f' key during boot to see if you can get the Grid to boot from floppy. If it does boot, the the MS-DOS 5 installer will probably be looking a hard drive to install to. But, it would test if the drive can read 1.44 floppies.
>> Good luck and please tell us your results,
>> -Shawn
>>
>>
>> From: "asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
>> To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
>> Sent: Saturday, November 28, 2015 7:42 PM
>> Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Is there a way to get software out of the ROM?
>>
>>
>>
>> Brand new member here.
>>
>> I have a few GRiDcase units, but not exactly sure of the models.
>>
>> The one I'm currently concerned with has a 720K floppy, a parallel port, two serial ports and an IEEE port.  The unit appears to operate fine; however, it has a radio control program built-in to the ROM (boots directly to it) and I would very much like to get it off the GRiD and working on another computer (non-GRiD) in a DOS window.  I've managed to get most files copied off the ROM; those I can "see" at the prompt.  But when I go to run the application in a DOS window on another machine, I get an error that it can't access the ROM drive though parts of the application do run.
>>
>> I think there are some other files hidden from view and unfortunately ATTRIB is not included in the DOS utilities already on the system.  Either that or the application is hard-coded to look at a specific part of the ROM, I don't know for certain.  I also do not have a c opy of GRiD DOS 3.2.
>>
>> I do have a copy of GRiD DOS 5.0 on three 1.4M floppies but they don't work in the 720K drive.
>>
>> So is there a way for me to get more off this machine?  It's running DOS 3.2 according to the decal on the ROM chip above the keyboard.
>>
>> I can probably supply photos if it would help.
>> Thank you,
>> Asa Jay
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>> Version: 2016.0.7227 / Virus Database: 4477/11083 - Release Date: 11/28/15
>>
>
>

Yahoo! Message number: 3022
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2015 06:36:08 -0800
From: Asa Jay Laughton
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Is there a way to get software out of the ROM?

Thank you. I don't have a specific manual for it. I do have the military Technical Order that explains it's use with the radios it is supposed to control; it goes through the various screens of the radio control application and what they do. It was obtained as surplus equipment.

And I'm sorry, but it is NOT for sale. At least not yet.

Asa Jay

Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired

On 11/30/2015 1:55 AM, David Walton walton.david@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
Hi,It's a gridcase Tempest model 1307. I have one.Sorry but I unable to help you further with your queries. Where did you get it from? Do you have the user manual for it, as I could scan for others to use if you are willing to post it.

Regards

David Walton

On 30 Nov 2015, at 05:25, "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Thank you for the warm welcome. :)
I can't find any model numbers on this unit at all. Please check out the photos here:
http://asajay.com/TSC-60/V9GRiD/

I've not opened the case to see if it has a hard drive, but I doubt that it does. I've worked with those that have hard drives and this one seems to be an earlier model. I could still be wrong though but might have to take it apart to know for certain.

Since all the files appear on A: even when a floppy is not installed, I doubt there is a hard drive. When a floppy is inserted, the files on the floppy will appear on the same A: in addition to those not on the floppy.

Example:
Without floppy installed, a DIR listing will show (note this is not a complete listing)
command.com
autoexec.bat

Install the floppy with two programs and now the A: listing will show
command.com
autoexec.bat
program1.exe (from floppy)
program2.exe (from floppy)

So that's a bit weird but okay.
To copy those files from A: to a floppy, I use copy A: B: and the system expects me to swap floppies, which works, I just insert the B: floppy when it wants it and don't insert one when it wants A:

This is an ex-military model used with an old HF radio facility. The radio control program is in ROM. The laptop boots straight into the app via the autoexec.bat file. The only way I can interrupt it is by constantly pressing Ctrl+C while the autoexec is running and before it starts the program. Normally, a person with this problem would simply want to get a ROM set with a standard OS and typical applications. However, in my case, I'd like to get the radio control program OFF the ROM in order to work with it on a modern computer. The software still controls the radios quite well but I'd like to get it working on a modern computer in order to do some additional things with it.

An early 720K floppy drive will ONLY read 1.4M floppies formatted to "look" like 720K floppies. The GRiD DOS 5.0 disks are formatted as 1.4M and they read just fine in my desktop but NOT on the GRiD. If I put that floppy into the drive, the laptop attempts to boot to it, but it can't find any files on it, so I have to remove the floppy and do a Ctrl+Alt+Delete. Interesting enough, I'm using 1.4M floppies (formatted as 720K) to transfer files and I have to tape over the extra hole in the floppy in order to get my desktop to read them as a 720K floppy, though on the GRiD it doesn't care about the extra hole.

In short, it all works fine and as-designed. I would simply like to get -everything- off the ROM, but can't "see" everything that's on it. Perhaps if I could get the entire suite of DOS 3.2 files I could use the ATTRIB command to view whatever is hidden. Unfortunately, the DIR command does not recognize the switch a:h and trying to copy anything that might be hidden is impossible at the moment.

What would really do it is some program that I could run from floppy that would walk through the ROM and copy it's entire contents out to floppy. Is there such an animal?

Please review the photos linked at the beginning of this email and see if you can tell exactly what model it is.

Thank you,
Asa Jay

Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
On 11/28/2015 8:58 PM, Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
Hello there, Asa Jay and welcome to the group! :)
The model type of your Grid units will be on the bottom of the unit. It also could be on the back, but most are on the bottom. It should be an 1520 or 1184 or 1180 or something like that. From your description, it sounds like you have a 1520 without a hard drive. It is possible that there is a hard drive, but it has died and it is not responding.
I am not familiar with the radio control program. I do not know why the program is looking for the ROM when it is run. I think here is a DOS command to redirect the a drive to another drive letter. It's odd that 1.44 floppies don't work in the 720K drive. My 1520's will read both.
You might try pressing the 'f' key during boot to see if you can get the Grid to boot from floppy. If it does boot, the the MS-DOS 5 installer will probably be looking a hard drive to install to. But, it would test if the drive can read 1.44 floppies.
Good luck and please tell us your results,
-Shawn


From: "asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"
To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, November 28, 2015 7:42 PM
Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Is there a way to get software out of the ROM?



Brand new member here.

I have a few GRiDcase units, but not exactly sure of the models.

The one I'm currently concerned with has a 720K floppy, a parallel port, two serial ports and an IEEE port. The unit appears to operate fine; however, it has a radio control program built-in to the ROM (boots directly to it) and I would very much like to get it off the GRiD and working on another computer (non-GRiD) in a DOS window. I've managed to get most files copied off the ROM; those I can "see" at the prompt. But when I go to run the application in a DOS window on another machine, I get an error that it can't access the ROM drive though parts of the application do run.

I think there are some other files hidden from view and unfortunately ATTRIB is not included in the DOS utilities already on the system. Either that or the application is hard-coded to look at a specific part of the ROM, I don't know for certain. I also do not have a c opy of GRiD DOS 3.2.

I do have a copy of GRiD DOS 5.0 on three 1.4M floppies but they don't work in the 720K drive.

So is there a way for me to get more off this machine? It's running DOS 3.2 according to the decal on the ROM chip above the keyboard.

I can probably supply photos if it would help.
Thank you,
Asa Jay





No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.7227 / Virus Database: 4477/11083 - Release Date: 11/28/15

No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.7227 / Virus Database: 4477/11091 - Release Date: 11/29/15

Yahoo! Message number: 3023
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2015 16:52:46 +0000 (UTC)
From: =?UTF-8?B?0K7RgNC40Lkg0JvQtdGB0LrQvtCy0LXRhg==?=
Subject: =?UTF-8?Q?=D0=9E=D1=82=D0=B2:_[RuGRiD-Laptop]_Is_there_a_w?= =?UTF-8?Q?ay_to_get_software_out_of_the_ROM=3F?=
text/plain; charset=UTF-8 

There is an opportunity for an exchange, I sent to you on your mail.
Yuri


    понедельник, 30 ноября 2015 19:36 "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@asajay.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> писал(а):


      Thank you.  I don't have a specific manual for it.  I do have the military Technical Order that explains it's use with the radios it is supposed to control; it goes through the various screens of the radio control application and what they do.  It was obtained as surplus equipment.

 And I'm sorry, but it is NOT for sale.  At least not yet.

 Asa  Jay
 Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired


 On 11/30/2015 1:55 AM, David Walton walton.david@sky.com [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
    Hi, It's a gridcase Tempest model 1307. I have one. Sorry but I unable to help you further with your queries. Where did you get it from? Do you have the user manual for it, as I could  scan for others to use if you are willing to post it.
  Regards
  David Walton

 On 30 Nov 2015, at 05:25, "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@asajay.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


      Thank you for the warm welcome.  :)
 I can't find any model numbers on this unit at all.  Please check out the photos here:
 http://asajay.com/TSC-60/V9GRiD/

 I've not opened the case to see if it has a hard drive, but I doubt that it does.  I've worked with those that have hard drives and this one seems to be an earlier model.  I could still be wrong though but might have to take it apart to know for certain.

 Since all the files appear on A: even when a floppy is not installed, I doubt there is a hard drive.  When a floppy is inserted, the files on the floppy will appear on the same A: in addition to those not on the floppy.

 Example:
 Without floppy installed, a DIR listing will show (note this is not a complete listing)
 command.com
 autoexec.bat

 Install the floppy with two programs and now the A: listing will show
 command.com
 autoexec.bat
 program1.exe (from floppy)
 program2.exe (from floppy)

 So that's a bit weird but okay.
 To copy those files from A: to a floppy, I use copy A: B: and the system expects me to swap floppies, which works, I just insert the B: floppy when it wants it and don't insert one when it wants A:

 This is an ex-military model used with an old HF radio facility.  The radio control program is in ROM.  The laptop boots straight into the app via the autoexec.bat file.  The only way I can interrupt it is by constantly pressing Ctrl+C while the autoexec is running and before it starts the program.  Normally, a person with this problem would simply want to get a ROM set with a standard OS and typical applications.  However, in my case, I'd like to get the radio control program OFF the ROM in order to work with it on a modern computer.  The software still controls the radios quite well but I'd like to get it working on a modern computer in order to do some additional things with it.

 An early 720K floppy drive will ONLY read 1.4M floppies formatted to "look" like 720K floppies.  The GRiD DOS 5.0 disks are formatted as 1.4M and they read just fine in my desktop but NOT on the GRiD.  If I put that floppy into the drive, the laptop attempts to boot to it, but it can't find any files on it, so I have to remove the floppy and do a Ctrl+Alt+Delete.  Interesting enough, I'm using 1.4M floppies (formatted as 720K) to transfer files and I have to tape over the extra hole in the floppy in order to get my desktop to read them as a 720K floppy, though on the GRiD it doesn't care about the extra hole.

 In short, it all works fine and as-designed.  I would simply like to get -everything- off the ROM, but can't "see" everything that's on it.  Perhaps if I could get the entire suite of DOS 3.2 files I could use the ATTRIB command to view whatever is hidden.  Unfortunately, the DIR command does not recognize the switch a:h and trying to copy anything that might be hidden is impossible at the moment.

 What would really do it is some program that I could run from floppy that would walk through the ROM and copy it's entire contents out to floppy.  Is there such an animal?

 Please review the photos linked at the beginning of this email and see if you can tell exactly what model it is.

 Thank you,
 Asa  Jay

  Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
 On 11/28/2015 8:58 PM, Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
     Hello there, Asa Jay and welcome to the group! :) The model type of your Grid units will be on the bottom of the unit. It also could be on the back, but most are on the bottom. It should be an 1520 or 1184 or 1180 or something like that. From your description, it sounds like you have a 1520 without a hard drive.  It is possible that there is a hard drive, but it has died and it is not responding. I am not familiar with the radio control program. I do not know why the program is looking for the ROM when it is run. I think here is a DOS command to redirect the a drive to another drive letter. It's odd that 1.44  floppies don't work in the 720K drive. My 1520's will read both. You might try pressing the 'f' key during boot to see if you can get the Grid to boot from floppy. If it does boot,  the the MS-DOS 5 installer will probably be looking a hard drive to install to. But, it would test if the drive can read 1.44 floppies. Good luck and please tell us your results, -Shawn

      From: "asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Saturday, November 28, 2015 7:42 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Is there a way to get software out of the ROM?



 Brand new member here.

 I have a few GRiDcase units, but not exactly sure of the models.

 The one I'm currently concerned with has a 720K floppy, a parallel port, two serial ports and an IEEE port.  The unit appears to operate fine; however, it has a radio control program built-in to the ROM (boots directly to it) and I would very much like to get it off the GRiD and  working on another computer (non-GRiD) in a DOS window.  I've managed to get most files copied off the ROM; those I can "see" at the prompt.  But when I go to run the application in a DOS window on another machine, I get an  error that it can't access the ROM drive though parts of the application do run.

 I think there are some other files hidden from view and unfortunately ATTRIB is not included in the DOS utilities already on the system.  Either that or the application is hard-coded to look at a specific part of the ROM, I don't know for certain.  I also do not have a c opy of GRiD DOS 3.2.

 I do have a copy of GRiD DOS 5.0 on three 1.4M floppies but they don't work in the 720K drive.

 So is there a way for me to get more off this machine?  It's running DOS 3.2 according to the decal on the ROM chip above the keyboard.

 I can probably supply photos if it would help.
 Thank you,
 Asa Jay





       No virus found in this message.
 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
 Version: 2016.0.7227 / Virus Database: 4477/11083 - Release Date: 11/28/15

  No virus found in this message.
 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
 Version: 2016.0.7227 / Virus Database: 4477/11091 - Release Date: 11/29/15
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Yahoo! Message number: 3024
Date: 01 Dec 2015 19:22:29 -0800
From: wd8cyv@...
Subject: =?UTF-8?Q?Re=3A_=D0=9E=D1=82=D0=B2=3A_=5BRuGRiD-Laptop=5D_Is_there_a_?= =?UTF-8?Q?w_ay_to_get_software_out_of_the_ROM=3F?=
text/plain; charset=utf-8 

i have a version of dos 6.0 and 6.22 that have been edited and combined  with all the good stuff still in it and all the stuff that causes problems removed
 

 will try to find the super tools disk i save it all to ..if it will help 
 this looks like my 1520 but sounds a bit weird  
 dave wd8cyv   (at) Y     DOOT COM
 

 once its built it will run from a flopy 
 and has a file manager simular to later windows programs
 

 its image files that build disks to do an install

Yahoo! Message number: 3025
Date: Tue, 01 Dec 2015 20:55:09 -0800
From: Asa Jay Laughton
Subject: Re: =?UTF-8?B?0J7RgtCyOiBbUnVHUmlELUxhcHRvcF0gSXMgdGhlcmUgYSB3IGE=?= =?UTF-8?B?eSB0byBnZXQgc29mdHdhcmUgb3V0IG9mIHRoZSBST00/?=

Interesting. If it can be built onto a 720K floppy, I would enjoy looking it over to see if there are any tools that might help. I will try a direct contact.

Asa Jay

Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired

On 12/1/2015 7:22 PM, wd8cyv@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:

i have a version of dos 6.0 and 6.22 that have been edited and combined

with all the good stuff still in it and all the stuff that causes problems removed

will try to find the super tools disk i save it all to ..if it will help
this looks like my 1520 but sounds a bit weird
dave wd8cyv (at) Y DOOT COM

once its built it will run from a flopy
and has a file manager simular to later windows programs

its image files that build disks to do an install

No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.7227 / Virus Database: 4477/11099 - Release Date: 12/01/15

Yahoo! Message number: 3026
Date: 17 Dec 2015 06:59:56 -0800
From: yodazworld@...
Subject: Re: Gridcase 3 - ROMs and software
text/plain; charset=utf-8 

Hello and thanks for the welcome! 

 I've downloaded the gridcase3.rar archive shared by klyball (thanks!) and need help from you guys.
 It's really fun and exciting working with this machine, but I guess I'm doing something wrong.
 

 Here's what I've tried:
 - format a floppy using MSDOS FAT
 - extract gridcase3, copy GRIDOS, GRIDMASTER to the floppy
 - use some tape to set the floppy as 720k
 - boot the GRiDCase 3, holding F to boot on floppy
 

 On boot I see:
 Phoenix ROM BIOS Vers 2.03, 10/03/86

 Floppy Disk Boot Failure

 (the message is repeated repeats itself until shutdown)

 On the laptop itself, it's a GRiDCASE3, came with a floppy drive, and a floppy disk. There are no ROM chips at all above the keyboard.
 The floppy reads

 GRiD

 -Travel diskette only-

 Do not use for data

 Install for travel only

 I want to make an image of the floppy for you guys but it doesn't mount (OSX). 
 Any tips?
 

 Cheers,
 Guillaume

Yahoo! Message number: 3028
Date: 20 Dec 2015 09:03:01 -0800
From: klyball@...
Subject: Re: Gridcase 3 - ROMs and software
text/plain; charset=utf-8 

Hi, Those files are Rom images and won't work on a floppy, they need to be burned to a rom and installed in the gridcase 3, i'll see if i have a bootable image for gridOS for the 3


GridOS is its own operating system and is not compatable with Dos the disk system is different there are a couple of utilities to move files between the two operating systems

interGrid in the file section is a GridOs like system that runs on top of dos , but am not sure if it will run on the 3, put Grid.exe on a dos floppy and the programs folder on it also  and try and run it, the spoc program in the files section is also a Gridos version written to run on top of dos. the orginal spoc software is gridOS only

Grant

Yahoo! Message number: 3029
Date: Wed, 06 Jan 2016 21:55:17 -0800
From: Asa Jay Laughton
Subject: RS-232 serial port

Hi all,
I've pretty much succeeded in getting the program off the GRiD laptop I have and being able to run it from floppy drive on another computer. I'd like to thank Dave, WD8CYV for sending me his tools disk. I'm still working out some details behind it working 100% because the laptop must be -boot- to the floppy, apparently there is some hard coding looking for specific files on the Boot drive and it wanting the Boot drive to be A.

Anyway, the question I have for you today is this:

Is there anything special about the RS-232 serial port on the back (the standard one, not the funky one)? Is it a standard serial port or does it have some special signaling capabilities that a like-port on another laptop wouldn't have?

I get that it might be TEMPEST but that shouldn't affect standard serial signaling. This becomes important because if it's not standard RS-232, then the program might not work on another laptop with a standard RS-232 port and another intermediate box might have to be built to do the proper signaling.

I'm guessing it's standard, but the question came up from a friend so I need to ask.
Thank you,
Asa Jay

Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired

Yahoo! Message number: 3030
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2016 01:28:55 -0800
From: Jim Stephens
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port
text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed 


On 1/6/2016 9:55 PM, Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] 
wrote:
>
>
> Hi all,
> I've pretty much succeeded in getting the program off the GRiD laptop 
> I have and being able to run it from floppy drive on another 
> computer.  I'd like to thank Dave, WD8CYV for sending me his tools 
> disk.  I'm still working out some details behind it working 100% 
> because the laptop must be -boot- to the floppy, apparently there is 
> some hard coding looking for specific files on the Boot drive and it 
> wanting the Boot drive to be A.
>
> Anyway, the question I have for you today is this:
>
> Is there anything special about the RS-232 serial port on the back 
> (the standard one, not the funky one)?  Is it a standard serial port 
> or does it have some special signaling capabilities that a like-port 
> on another laptop wouldn't have?
>
> I get that it might be TEMPEST but that shouldn't affect standard 
> serial signaling.  This becomes important because if it's not standard 
> RS-232, then the program might not work on another laptop with a 
> standard RS-232 port and another intermediate box might have to be 
> built to do the proper signaling.
>
> I'm guessing it's standard, but the question came up from a friend so 
> I need to ask.
> Thank you,
> Asa  Jay
> Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
>
If you have binary editing skills, look for the address of the port in 
the code you recovered.  It is 0x03f8.  Look for 0xf803 which will be 
intel order in the instructions.  What I've done is dump the whole 
program image as binary into memory (rename the .com or .exe to .bin) 
and bring it in with debug command.

Then go to the offset of the 0xf803 and disassemble around it.  If you 
see an OB or IB instruction soon after you will know for sure.

This only suggests that the serial port is at the usual hardware address.

is it possible that the port is accessed thru the MSDOS COM1 port? That 
is worth considering too, as that will abstract the serial I/O so you 
don't have to worry about the physical port address.

thanks
Jim

Yahoo! Message number: 3031
Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2016 06:35:57 -0800
From: Asa Jay Laughton
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port

Jim,
Interesting thoughts. I would think it's addressing the com port as com1 but it might be nice to validate that. I think your instructions are clear enough I can try this. I do have a binary editor called UltraEdit32 I'll take a look at as well as another binary decompiler. This may work, I'll have a look. :)

Still unanswered, is there anything special "electrically" about the RS-232 serial port?

Asa Jay


On 1/7/2016 1:28 AM, Jim Stephens jws@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:

If you have binary editing skills, look for the address of the port in the code you recovered. It is 0x03f8. Look for 0xf803 which will be intel order in the instructions. What I've done is dump the whole program image as binary into memory (rename the .com or .exe to .bin) and bring it in with debug command.

Then go to the offset of the 0xf803 and disassemble around it. If you see an OB or IB instruction soon after you will know for sure.

This only suggests that the serial port is at the usual hardware address.

is it possible that the port is accessed thru the MSDOS COM1 port? That is worth considering too, as that will abstract the serial I/O so you don't have to worry about the physical port address.

thanks
Jim

Yahoo! Message number: 3032
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2016 17:13:13 +0000 (UTC)
From: Shawnerz
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port
text/plain; charset=UTF-8 

As far as I know, its a standard serial port.However, the internal modem (if installed) uses a COM port. You can define which COM port the modem will use in the conf15X0.exe program.

The "funky one" I think you're referring to is the 25 pin D-SUB with a plastic pin in one of the pins. If that is the port you're talking about, that is a port for an external floppy drive.I hope that helps,-Shawn

      From: "Jim Stephens jws@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Thursday, January 7, 2016 4:28 AM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port

#yiv2967750279 #yiv2967750279 -- #yiv2967750279 .yiv2967750279ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279photo-title a, #yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279photo-title a:active, #yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279photo-title a:hover, #yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279attach-table div.yiv2967750279attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279attach-table div.yiv2967750279attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv2967750279 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279attach-table div.yiv2967750279attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279attach-table div.yiv2967750279attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv2967750279 #yiv2967750279



 On 1/6/2016 9:55 PM, Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:

 #yiv2967750279 #yiv2967750279 -- #yiv2967750279 .yiv2967750279ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279photo-title a, #yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279photo-title a:active, #yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279photo-title a:hover, #yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279attach-table div.yiv2967750279attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279attach-table div.yiv2967750279attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv2967750279 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279attach-table div.yiv2967750279attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279attach-table div.yiv2967750279attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv2967750279 div.yiv2967750279ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv2967750279 #yiv2967750279
 Hi all,
 I've pretty much succeeded in getting the program off the GRiD laptop I have and being able to run it from floppy drive on another computer.  I'd like to thank Dave, WD8CYV for sending me his tools disk.  I'm still working out some details behind it working 100% because the laptop must be -boot- to the floppy, apparently there is some hard coding looking for specific files on the Boot drive and it wanting the Boot drive to be A.

 Anyway, the question I have for you today is this:

 Is there anything special about the RS-232 serial port on the back (the standard one, not the funky one)?  Is it a standard serial port or does it have some special signaling capabilities that a like-port on another laptop wouldn't have?

 I get that it might be TEMPEST but that shouldn't affect standard serial signaling.  This becomes important because if it's not standard RS-232, then the program might not work on another laptop with a standard RS-232 port and another intermediate box might have to be built to do the proper signaling.

 I'm guessing it's standard, but the question came up from a friend so I need to ask.
 Thank you,
 Asa  Jay
 Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired

 If you have binary editing skills, look for the address of the port in the code you recovered.  It is 0x03f8.  Look for 0xf803 which will be intel order in the instructions.  What I've done is dump the whole program image as binary into memory (rename the .com or .exe to .bin) and bring it in with debug command.

 Then go to the offset of the 0xf803 and disassemble around it.  If you see an OB or IB instruction soon after you will know for sure.

 This only suggests that the serial port is at the usual hardware address.

 is it possible that the port is accessed thru the MSDOS COM1 port?  That is worth considering too, as that will abstract the serial I/O so you don't have to worry about the physical port address.

 thanks
 Jim

Yahoo! Message number: 3033
Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2016 20:54:07 -0800
From: Asa Jay Laughton
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port

My apologies, I should have done this in my first post. Please refer to the following photo:
http://asajay.com/TSC-60/V9GRiD/GRiD_Port_ID.JPG

Port 3 (upper left) is the parallel port
Port 4 (upper right) is the RS-232 serial port the computer uses to talk to the radios
Port 5 (lower left) GPIB and not used in my case
Port 6 (lower right) is the "funky" RS-232/RS-422 serial (19-pin) which I have no idea what might be used for.

I've heard there might be some "special" electronics built around this port that might make the port "non-standard." From what I've been able to research so far and with some opinions for those here, I believe there isn't anything special about it and should act just like a normal serial port.

And here is the port Shawn spoke of, on the side of the unit:, though I honestly don't know what it's for. If Shawn is correct, and it makes sense especially with a plugged pin in order not to mix it up with a port on the back, it's probably for an additional external floppy port.
http://asajay.com/TSC-60/V9GRiD/GRiD_Right.JPG

Asa Jay

Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired

On 1/7/2016 9:13 AM, Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
As far as I know, its a standard serial port.
However, the internal modem (if installed) uses a COM port. You can define which COM port the modem will use in the conf15X0.exe program.

The "funky one" I think you're referring to is the 25 pin D-SUB with a plastic pin in one of the pins. If that is the port you're talking about, that is a port for an external floppy drive.
I hope that helps,
-Shawn


From: "Jim Stephens jws@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"
To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, January 7, 2016 4:28 AM
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port





On 1/6/2016 9:55 PM, Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
Hi all,
I've pretty much succeeded in getting the program off the GRiD laptop I have and being able to run it from floppy drive on another computer. I'd like to thank Dave, WD8CYV for sending me his tools disk. I'm still working out some details behind it working 100% because the laptop must be -boot- to the floppy, apparently there is some hard coding looking for specific files on the Boot drive and it wanting the Boot drive to be A.

Anyway, the question I have for you today is this:

Is there anything special about the RS-232 serial port on the back (the standard one, not the funky one)? Is it a standard serial port or does it have some special signaling capabilities that a like-port on another laptop wouldn't have?

I get that it might be TEMPEST but that shouldn't affect standard serial signaling. This becomes important because if it's not standard RS-232, then the program might not work on another laptop with a standard RS-232 port and another intermediate box might have to be built to do the proper signaling.

I'm guessing it's standard, but the question came up from a friend so I need to ask.
Thank you,
Asa Jay
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
If you have binary editing skills, look for the address of the port in the code you recovered. It is 0x03f8. Look for 0xf803 which will be intel order in the instructions. What I've done is dump the whole program image as binary into memory (rename the .com or .exe to .bin) and bring it in with debug command.

Then go to the offset of the 0xf803 and disassemble around it. If you see an OB or IB instruction soon after you will know for sure.

This only suggests that the serial port is at the usual hardware address.

is it possible that the port is accessed thru the MSDOS COM1 port? That is worth considering too, as that will abstract the serial I/O so you don't have to worry about the physical port address.

thanks
Jim





No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.7294 / Virus Database: 4492/11351 - Release Date: 01/08/16

Yahoo! Message number: 3034
Date: Thu, 07 Jan 2016 21:33:25 -0800
From: Asa Jay Laughton
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port

.. and I did it -again-. The Port I want to talk about is number 4 (not 6).

Asa 


    

    On 1/7/2016 8:54 PM, Asa Jay Laughton asajay@...
    [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
    

      
      
          

            
 My apologies, I should have done this in my first post.
              Please refer to the following photo:

              http://asajay.com/TSC-60/V9GRiD/GRiD_Port_ID.JPG

              

              Port 3 (upper left) is the parallel port

              Port 4 (upper right) is the RS-232 serial port the
              computer uses to talk to the radios

              Port 5 (lower left) GPIB and not used in my case

              Port 6 (lower right) is the "funky" RS-232/RS-422 serial
              (19-pin) which I have no idea what might be used for.

              

              I've heard there might be some "special" electronics built
              around this port that might make the port "non-standard."
              From what I've been able to research so far and with some
              opinions for those here, I believe there isn't anything
              special about it and should act just like a normal serial
              port.

              

              And here is the port Shawn spoke of, on the side of the
              unit:, though I honestly don't know what it's for. If
              Shawn is correct, and it makes sense especially with a
              plugged pin in order not to mix it up with a port on the
              back, it's probably for an additional external floppy
              port.

              http://asajay.com/TSC-60/V9GRiD/GRiD_Right.JPG

              

              Asa Jay

            

            
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired



            

            On 1/7/2016 9:13 AM, Shawnerz shawnerz@...
            [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
            
 
              

                

                  
As
                    far as I know, its a standard serial port.

                  
However,

                    the internal modem (if installed) uses a COM port.
                    You can define which COM port the modem will use in
                    the conf15X0.exe program.

                  

                  


                  

                  
The

                    "funky one" I think you're referring to is the 25
                    pin D-SUB with a plastic pin in one of the pins. If
                    that is the port you're talking about, that is a
                    port for an external floppy drive.

                  
I
                    hope that helps,

                  
-Shawn

                  


                    

                  

                  

                    

                      

                        
  
                          
 From:
                            "Jim Stephens jws@...
                            [RuGRiD-Laptop]" 

                            To:
                            RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
                            

                            Sent:
                            Thursday, January 7, 2016 4:28 AM

                            Subject:
                            Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port

                           

                        


                          

                            
 

                              

                              

                              

                              
On
                                1/6/2016 9:55 PM, Asa Jay Laughton asajay@...
                                [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:

                              

                              
 

                            

                            
                            

                              Hi all,

                              I've pretty much succeeded in getting the
                              program off the GRiD laptop I have and
                              being able to run it from floppy drive on
                              another computer. I'd like to thank Dave,
                              WD8CYV for sending me his tools disk. I'm
                              still working out some details behind it
                              working 100% because the laptop must be
                              -boot- to the floppy, apparently there is
                              some hard coding looking for specific
                              files on the Boot drive and it wanting the
                              Boot drive to be A.

                              

                              Anyway, the question I have for you today
                              is this:

                              

                              Is there anything special about the RS-232
                              serial port on the back (the standard one,
                              not the funky one)? Is it a standard
                              serial port or does it have some special
                              signaling capabilities that a like-port on
                              another laptop wouldn't have?

                              

                              I get that it might be TEMPEST but that
                              shouldn't affect standard serial
                              signaling. This becomes important because
                              if it's not standard RS-232, then the
                              program might not work on another laptop
                              with a standard RS-232 port and another
                              intermediate box might have to be built to
                              do the proper signaling.

                              

                              I'm guessing it's standard, but the
                              question came up from a friend so I need
                              to ask.

                              Thank you,

                              Asa Jay

                              
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired



                              If you have binary editing skills, look
                              for the address of the port in the code
                              you recovered. It is 0x03f8. Look for
                              0xf803 which will be intel order in the
                              instructions. What I've done is dump the
                              whole program image as binary into memory
                              (rename the .com or .exe to .bin) and
                              bring it in with debug command.

                              

                              Then go to the offset of the 0xf803 and
                              disassemble around it. If you see an OB
                              or IB instruction soon after you will know
                              for sure.

                              

                              This only suggests that the serial port is
                              at the usual hardware address. 

                              

                              is it possible that the port is accessed
                              thru the MSDOS COM1 port? That is worth
                              considering too, as that will abstract the
                              serial I/O so you don't have to worry
                              about the physical port address.

                              

                              thanks

                              Jim

                              

                              

                              

                            

                          

                        

                        

                        

                      

                    

                  

                

              

              
No
                virus found in this message.

                Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

                Version: 2016.0.7294 / Virus Database: 4492/11351 -
                Release Date: 01/08/16

               

          

          
      
      
No virus found
        in this message.

        Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

        Version: 2016.0.7294 / Virus Database: 4492/11351 - Release
        Date: 01/08/16

      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3035
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2016 06:03:27 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



I am not aware of any non-standard RS-232 interface on the Grid. I see it is RS-232C. If i remember correctly, RS-232C has 0/5V transitions, where RS-232 has -12/+12V transitions.I'm no expert and I could be wrong.Good luck.-ShawnP.S. The 19 pin connector has me curious. I assume that was some proprietary RS-422 connection. Very interesting.


      From: "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Friday, January 8, 2016 12:33 AM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port

#yiv7461387808 #yiv7461387808 -- #yiv7461387808 .yiv7461387808ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv7461387808 div.yiv7461387808ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv7461387808 div.yiv7461387808photo-title a, #yiv7461387808 div.yiv7461387808photo-title a:active, #yiv7461387808 div.yiv7461387808photo-title a:hover, #yiv7461387808 div.yiv7461387808photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv7461387808 div.yiv7461387808attach-table div.yiv7461387808attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv7461387808 div.yiv7461387808attach-table div.yiv7461387808attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv7461387808 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv7461387808 div.yiv7461387808ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv7461387808 div.yiv7461387808attach-table div.yiv7461387808attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv7461387808 div.yiv7461387808attach-table div.yiv7461387808attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv7461387808 div.yiv7461387808ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv7461387808 #yiv7461387808

 .. and I did it -again-.  The Port I want to talk about is number 4 (not 6).

 Asa

 On 1/7/2016 8:54 PM, Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
     My apologies, I should have done this in my first post.  Please refer to the following photo:
 http://asajay.com/TSC-60/V9GRiD/GRiD_Port_ID.JPG

 Port 3 (upper left) is the parallel port
 Port 4 (upper right) is the RS-232 serial port the computer uses to talk to the radios
 Port 5 (lower left) GPIB and not used in my case
 Port 6 (lower right) is the "funky" RS-232/RS-422 serial (19-pin) which I have no idea what might be used for.

 I've heard there might be some "special" electronics built around this port that might make the port "non-standard."  From what I've been able to research so far and with some opinions for those here, I believe there isn't anything special about it and should act just like a normal serial port.

 And here is the port Shawn spoke of, on the side of the unit:, though I honestly don't know what it's for.  If Shawn is correct, and it makes sense especially with a plugged pin in order not to mix it up with a port on the back, it's probably for an additional external floppy port.
 http://asajay.com/TSC-60/V9GRiD/GRiD_Right.JPG

 Asa Jay
  Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired


 On 1/7/2016 9:13 AM, Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
     As far as I know, its a standard serial port. However, the internal modem (if installed) uses a COM port. You can define which COM port the modem will use in the conf15X0.exe program.

  The "funky one" I think you're referring to is the 25 pin D-SUB with a plastic pin in one of the pins. If that is the port you're talking about, that is a port for an external floppy drive. I hope that helps, -Shawn

         From: "Jim Stephens jws@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Thursday, January 7, 2016 4:28 AM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port





 On 1/6/2016 9:55 PM, Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:




 Hi all,
 I've pretty much succeeded in getting the program off the GRiD laptop I have and being able to run it from floppy drive on another computer.  I'd like to thank Dave, WD8CYV for sending me his tools disk.  I'm still working out some details behind it working 100% because the laptop must be -boot- to the floppy, apparently there is some hard coding looking for specific files on the Boot drive and it wanting the Boot drive to be A.

 Anyway, the question I have for you today is this:

 Is there anything special about the RS-232 serial port on the back (the standard one, not the funky one)?  Is it a standard serial port or does it have some special signaling capabilities that a like-port on  another laptop wouldn't have?

 I get that it might be TEMPEST but that shouldn't affect standard serial signaling.  This becomes important because if it's not standard RS-232, then the program might not work on another laptop  with a standard RS-232 port and another intermediate box might have to be built to do the proper signaling.

 I'm guessing it's standard, but the question came up from a friend so I need to ask.
 Thank you,
 Asa  Jay
 Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired

 If you have binary editing skills, look for the address of the port in the code you recovered.  It is 0x03f8.  Look for 0xf803 which will be intel order in the instructions.  What I've done is dump the whole program image as binary into memory (rename the .com or .exe to .bin) and  bring it in with debug command.

 Then go to the offset of the 0xf803 and disassemble around it.  If you see an OB or IB instruction soon after you will know for sure.

 This only suggests that the serial port is at the usual hardware address.

 is it possible that the port is accessed thru the MSDOS COM1 port?  That is worth considering too, as that will abstract the serial I/O so you don't have to worry  about the physical port address.

 thanks
 Jim





 No virus found in this message.
 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
 Version: 2016.0.7294 / Virus Database: 4492/11351 - Release Date: 01/08/16 No virus found in this message.
 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
 Version: 2016.0.7294 / Virus Database: 4492/11351 - Release Date: 01/08/16








Yahoo! Message number: 3036
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2016 23:01:57 -0800

From: Jim Stephens 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port




I have a printed version of the RS-232-C Standard, and I'm not aware of 
an RS-232 standard.

The google for "rs-232c vs. rs-232" immediately turned up a Honeywell 
web page saying what you said.  If this had not been proprietary, I 
suspect there would not be so much "information" out there about it.

I looked at a bunch of references and they all have things that are at 
variance with what I recall.  I've not seen an electrical spec with an 
official 0-5 volt inteface, and anything that comes out to a connector 
better have a negative electrical transition, if they want to work.

TI voltage shift parts actually do handle 0-5, but the TI SN75154 for 
example can be set up to operate above ground 0-5.

The Grid receiver may be a 1488 as well, and they do require a zero 
transition.  Since you have to assume that these will be out there, you 
better handle at in your design.

TI receiver chip SN75154
http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/sn75154.pdf

TI receiver chip DS1489
http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/ds1489.pdf

If you can find a photo, or have one skinned, perhaps someone can look.
thanks
Jim


On 1/7/2016 10:03 PM, Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
> I see it is RS-232C. If i remember correctly, RS-232C has 0/5V 
> transitions, where RS-232 has -12/+12V transitions.






Yahoo! Message number: 3037
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2016 14:14:57 +0100

From: Andrea Michele Cane 

Subject: Gridare 1530 ram expansion

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Hi,
I'm still trying expand the memory of my gridcase 1530 to the actual
2mbyte  8x 256k to 8 mbyte.My last attempt to adapt simm memory module to
sipp failed probably because  I used different module speed. After post the
memory check Washington ok buttare After few minuts sistema hang. Could
you remember the schematics for upgrading the memory. I don't remember the
order of the slot for fitting the memory in order of two. Sipp/simm have a
8 bit data bus so for 8 mb i have to fit 8 1mb ram module. It's right? I' m
looking to adapt a so- dimm  72 pin 8 mbyte fpm ram to the slot soldering
each data and adress bus to the slot. Andrea





Yahoo! Message number: 3038
Date: Fri, 08 Jan 2016 06:49:39 -0800

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port





  
    
  
  
    Interesting, I had failed to note the "C" and thus did some Googling
    myself and found this:

    

    The RS-232 Standard has gone through several revisions through the
    years. In the original RS-232, the signal would flip between
    positive and negative 25 volts. There were then three revisions,
    RS-232A, RS-232B, and RS-232C, which lowered the acceptable voltage
    from 25 to 12 to 5 volts. In 1969, the Electronic Industries
    Association Standards Committee adopted RS-232C, as a standard for
    computer manufacturers. Because this adoption date was so long ago,
    most manufacturers, including National Instruments, have dropped the
    "C" from the name and simply refer to the protocol as RS-232. In
    common, modern usage, there is no difference
    between RS-232 and RS-232C, protocol.

    

    from here:

http://digital.ni.com/public.nsf/allkb/1C8F13D0806056F886256FAC00649176

    

    If the final statement is correct, then there shouldn't be any
    difference between the RS-232C signaling from the GRiD and that on
    any other modern laptop that still has a serial port.

    

    Thanks all for the help, :)

    Asa Jay

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired



    

    On 1/7/2016 11:01 PM, Jim Stephens jws@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]
    wrote:
    

      
      
          

            
I have a printed version of the RS-232-C Standard, and
              I'm not aware of 

              an RS-232 standard.

              

              The google for "rs-232c vs. rs-232" immediately turned up
              a Honeywell 

              web page saying what you said. If this had not been
              proprietary, I 

              suspect there would not be so much "information" out there
              about it.

              

              I looked at a bunch of references and they all have things
              that are at 

              variance with what I recall. I've not seen an electrical
              spec with an 

              official 0-5 volt inteface, and anything that comes out to
              a connector 

              better have a negative electrical transition, if they want
              to work.

              

              TI voltage shift parts actually do handle 0-5, but the TI
              SN75154 for 

              example can be set up to operate above ground 0-5.

              

              The Grid receiver may be a 1488 as well, and they do
              require a zero 

              transition. Since you have to assume that these will be
              out there, you 

              better handle at in your design.

              

              TI receiver chip SN75154

              http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/sn75154.pdf

              

              TI receiver chip DS1489

              http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/ds1489.pdf

              

              If you can find a photo, or have one skinned, perhaps
              someone can look.

              thanks

              Jim

              

              On 1/7/2016 10:03 PM, Shawnerz shawnerz@...
              [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:

              > I see it is RS-232C. If i remember correctly, RS-232C
              has 0/5V 

              > transitions, where RS-232 has -12/+12V transitions.

              

            

          

          
      
      
No virus found
        in this message.

        Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

        Version: 2016.0.7294 / Virus Database: 4492/11351 - Release
        Date: 01/08/16

      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3039
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2016 23:01:39 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



I could be wrong and spreading rumors here. But, I though I had read somewhere that the "RS" in RS-232 meant "Recommended Standard." I thought I had read that it was never adopted. If it had been adopted, it would be "IS-232."
The article was saying that RS-232 was originally intended to work for a distance of 50 feet (~16 meters). But because the standard was never formally adopted, you will probably not get that much distance.
Perhaps this is just a rumor.   I don't know.  I thought I'd pass it on. :)-Shawn

      From: "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
Cc: "JONES, RANDY (DNR)" <RANDY.JONES@...>
 Sent: Friday, January 8, 2016 9:49 AM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port

<!--#yiv7134528742 #yiv7134528742 .yiv7134528742ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv7134528742 div.yiv7134528742ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv7134528742 div.yiv7134528742photo-title a, #yiv7134528742 div.yiv7134528742photo-title a:active, #yiv7134528742 div.yiv7134528742photo-title a:hover, #yiv7134528742 div.yiv7134528742photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv7134528742 div.yiv7134528742attach-table div.yiv7134528742attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv7134528742 div.yiv7134528742attach-table div.yiv7134528742attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv7134528742 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv7134528742 div.yiv7134528742ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv7134528742 div.yiv7134528742attach-table div.yiv7134528742attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv7134528742 div.yiv7134528742attach-table div.yiv7134528742attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv7134528742 div.yiv7134528742ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv7134528742 -->

 Interesting, I had failed to note the "C" and thus did some Googling myself and found this:

 The RS-232 Standard has gone through several revisions through the years. In the original RS-232, the signal would flip between positive and negative 25 volts. There were then three revisions, RS-232A, RS-232B, and RS-232C, which lowered the acceptable voltage from 25 to 12 to 5 volts. In 1969, the Electronic Industries Association Standards Committee adopted RS-232C, as a standard for computer manufacturers. Because this adoption date was so long ago, most manufacturers, including National Instruments, have dropped the "C" from the name and simply refer to the protocol as RS-232. In common, modern usage, there is no difference between RS-232 and RS-232C, protocol.

 from here:
http://digital.ni.com/public.nsf/allkb/1C8F13D0806056F886256FAC00649176

 If the final statement is correct, then there shouldn't be any difference between the RS-232C signaling from the GRiD and that on any other modern laptop that still has a serial port.

 Thanks all for the help,  :)
 Asa  Jay







Yahoo! Message number: 3040
Date: Fri, 08 Jan 2016 18:54:20 -0800

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port





  
    
  
  
    Shawn,

    You are correct. The "standard" was never formally ratified (?) but
    in general it's been adopted by pretty much all manufactures.
    However, that doesn't mean any one manufacturer will adhere strictly
    to the standard as currently published. I think for our purposes,
    if GRiD labeled the port as RS232-C, it probably meets the C
    standard, otherwise they could have just left the suffix off.

    

    Asa Jay

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired



    

    On 1/8/2016 3:01 PM, Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]
    wrote:
    

      
      
          

            

              
I
                could be wrong and spreading rumors here. But, I though
                I had read somewhere that the "RS" in RS-232 meant
                "Recommended Standard." I thought I had read that it was
                never adopted. If it had been adopted, it would be
                "IS-232."

              


              

              
The
                article was saying that RS-232 was originally intended
                to work for a distance of 50 feet (~16 meters). But
                because the standard was never formally adopted, you
                will probably not get that much distance.

              


              

              
Perhaps this is
                just a rumor. 

              
 I
                don't know. I thought I'd pass it on. : )

              
-Shawn

              

              


              

              

                

                  

                    

                      
                        
 From: "Asa Jay Laughton
                        asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"
                        

                        To:
                        RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com 

                        Cc:
                        "JONES, RANDY (DNR)"
                        

                        Sent:
                        Friday, January 8, 2016 9:49 AM

                        Subject:
                        Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port

                       

                    


                      

                        

                          

                          

                          Interesting, I had failed to note the "C" and
                          thus did some Googling myself and found this:

                          

                          The RS-232 Standard has gone through several
                          revisions through the years. In the original
                          RS-232, the signal would flip between positive
                          and negative 25 volts. There were then three
                          revisions, RS-232A, RS-232B, and RS-232C,
                          which lowered the acceptable voltage from 25
                          to 12 to 5 volts. In 1969, the Electronic
                          Industries Association Standards Committee
                          adopted RS-232C, as a standard for computer
                          manufacturers. Because this adoption date was
                          so long ago, most manufacturers, including
                          National Instruments, have dropped the "C"
                          from the name and simply refer to the protocol
                          as RS-232. In common, modern usage, there is no
                            difference between RS-232 and
                          RS-232C, protocol.

                          

                          from here:

                          http://digital.ni.com/public.nsf/allkb/1C8F13D0806056F886256FAC00649176

                          

                          If the final statement is correct, then there
                          shouldn't be any difference between the
                          RS-232C signaling from the GRiD and that on
                          any other modern laptop that still has a
                          serial port.

                          

                          Thanks all for the help, :)

                          Asa Jay

                        

                      

                      

                      

                    

                  

                

              

            

          

          
      
      
No virus found
        in this message.

        Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

        Version: 2016.0.7294 / Virus Database: 4492/11354 - Release
        Date: 01/08/16

      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3041
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 2016 04:44:31 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Gridare 1530 ram expansion

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



I am sorry, Andrea.I do not have the information you are looking for.I do know that it is 70 mS, 30 pin RAM. Trying to adapt 72 pin RAM sounds very difficult. I am guessing that 72 pin is 16 bit RAM and you will use the low bytes for 1 bank, and the high byte for another bank.If that is correct, I would be concerned about the timing. It would be very interesting if this works. :)Good luck,-Shawn


      From: "Andrea Michele Cane zentaro.cane@gmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Friday, January 8, 2016 8:14 AM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Gridare 1530 ram expansion

<!--#yiv8502681777 #yiv8502681777 .yiv8502681777ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv8502681777 div.yiv8502681777ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv8502681777 div.yiv8502681777photo-title a, #yiv8502681777 div.yiv8502681777photo-title a:active, #yiv8502681777 div.yiv8502681777photo-title a:hover, #yiv8502681777 div.yiv8502681777photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv8502681777 div.yiv8502681777attach-table div.yiv8502681777attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv8502681777 div.yiv8502681777attach-table div.yiv8502681777attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv8502681777 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv8502681777 div.yiv8502681777ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv8502681777 div.yiv8502681777attach-table div.yiv8502681777attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv8502681777 div.yiv8502681777attach-table div.yiv8502681777attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv8502681777 div.yiv8502681777ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv8502681777 --> <!--#yiv8502681777 #yiv8502681777ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv8502681777 #yiv8502681777ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv8502681777 #yiv8502681777ygrp-mkp #yiv8502681777hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv8502681777 #yiv8502681777ygrp-mkp #yiv8502681777ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv8502681777 #yiv8502681777ygrp-mkp .yiv8502681777ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv8502681777 #yiv8502681777ygrp-mkp .yiv8502681777ad p {margin:0;}#yiv8502681777 #yiv8502681777ygrp-mkp .yiv8502681777ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}-->

Hi,
I'm still trying expand the memory of my gridcase 1530 to the actual 2mbyte  8x 256k to 8 mbyte.My last attempt to adapt simm memory module to sipp failed probably because  I used different module speed. After post the memory check Washington ok buttare After few minuts sistema hang. Could   you remember the schematics for upgrading the memory. I don't remember the order of the slot for fitting the memory in order of two. Sipp/simm have a 8 bit data bus so for 8 mb i have to fit 8 1mb ram module. It's right? I' m looking to adapt a so- dimm  72 pin 8 mbyte fpm ram to the slot soldering each data and adress bus to the slot. Andrea








Yahoo! Message number: 3042
Date: 09 Jan 2016 16:32:34 -0800

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port




Here is the pin out for the 19 pin serial connector
This is part 2 of a multi-part message.




Attached image/jpeg file not shown; stay tuned!


This is part 3 of a multi-part message.




Attached image/jpeg file not shown; stay tuned!





Yahoo! Message number: 3043
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 2016 00:45:58 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port [2 Attachments]

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



That's for posting! :)-Shawn


      From: "klyball@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Saturday, January 9, 2016 7:32 PM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port [2 Attachments]

#yiv3211703398 #yiv3211703398 -- #yiv3211703398 .yiv3211703398ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv3211703398 div.yiv3211703398ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv3211703398 div.yiv3211703398photo-title a, #yiv3211703398 div.yiv3211703398photo-title a:active, #yiv3211703398 div.yiv3211703398photo-title a:hover, #yiv3211703398 div.yiv3211703398photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv3211703398 div.yiv3211703398attach-table div.yiv3211703398attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv3211703398 div.yiv3211703398attach-table div.yiv3211703398attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv3211703398 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv3211703398 div.yiv3211703398ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv3211703398 div.yiv3211703398attach-table div.yiv3211703398attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv3211703398 div.yiv3211703398attach-table div.yiv3211703398attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv3211703398 div.yiv3211703398ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv3211703398 #yiv3211703398 #yiv3211703398 #yiv3211703398 --#yiv3211703398ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv3211703398 #yiv3211703398ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv3211703398 #yiv3211703398ygrp-mkp #yiv3211703398hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv3211703398 #yiv3211703398ygrp-mkp #yiv3211703398ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv3211703398 #yiv3211703398ygrp-mkp .yiv3211703398ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv3211703398 #yiv3211703398ygrp-mkp .yiv3211703398ad p {margin:0;}#yiv3211703398 #yiv3211703398ygrp-mkp .yiv3211703398ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}#yiv3211703398 [Attachment(s) from klyball@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] included below]

Here is the pin out for the 19 pin serial connector








Yahoo! Message number: 3044
Date: 10 Jan 2016 09:22:41 -0800

From: klyball@...

Subject: Cool original Doc




Found this in my Grid Pile
 


This is part 2 of a multi-part message.




Attached image/jpeg file not shown; stay tuned!


This is part 3 of a multi-part message.




Attached image/jpeg file not shown; stay tuned!





Yahoo! Message number: 3045
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 2016 17:46:00 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Cool original Doc [2 Attachments]

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Wow! Nice blast from the past....and the arrangement worked out so well for both companies! ;-)-Shawn

      From: "klyball@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2016 12:22 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Cool original Doc [2 Attachments]

<!--#yiv4418042489 #yiv4418042489 .yiv4418042489ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv4418042489 div.yiv4418042489ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv4418042489 div.yiv4418042489photo-title a, #yiv4418042489 div.yiv4418042489photo-title a:active, #yiv4418042489 div.yiv4418042489photo-title a:hover, #yiv4418042489 div.yiv4418042489photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv4418042489 div.yiv4418042489attach-table div.yiv4418042489attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv4418042489 div.yiv4418042489attach-table div.yiv4418042489attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv4418042489 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv4418042489 div.yiv4418042489ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv4418042489 div.yiv4418042489attach-table div.yiv4418042489attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv4418042489 div.yiv4418042489attach-table div.yiv4418042489attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv4418042489 div.yiv4418042489ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv4418042489 --> <!--#yiv4418042489 #yiv4418042489ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv4418042489 #yiv4418042489ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv4418042489 #yiv4418042489ygrp-mkp #yiv4418042489hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv4418042489 #yiv4418042489ygrp-mkp #yiv4418042489ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv4418042489 #yiv4418042489ygrp-mkp .yiv4418042489ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv4418042489 #yiv4418042489ygrp-mkp .yiv4418042489ad p {margin:0;}#yiv4418042489 #yiv4418042489ygrp-mkp .yiv4418042489ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}-->[Attachment(s) from klyball@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] included below]

Found this in my Grid Pile










Yahoo! Message number: 3046
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2016 14:36:48 -0800

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Serial port data





  
    
  
  
    Hello all,

    I find myself with a lack of knowledge. I have managed to export an
    application from GRiD ROM and run it on a modern computer. The
    application addresses the GRiD RS232C 25-pin serial port. The
    device it controls uses three lines, TX, RX and GND.

    

    When running the app on a modern computer, it fails to see the BUS
    of the equipment. However, I can see signaling coming from the
    serial port to the correct pins for TX. Why doesn't it work?

    

    To troubleshoot this more, I'd like to know if the serial port on a
    GRiD is pre-set to any specific values. Baud, parity, etc. I have
    used an O-scope to compare the signals from the GRiD and my other
    laptop. The only difference I can discern is voltage. When the
    application runs on the GRiD, the voltage is 2.6V pk-pk, swinging
    1.3V either side of GND. On the modern laptop its only putting out
    1.44V pk-pk with a .7V swing either side of GND.

    

    I am still researching the end-equipment to see if it requires a
    higher voltage trigger or not. Meanwhile I thought I'd ask about
    the serial port protocol; maybe I have to set my port differently on
    my modern computer.

    

    Any insights folks might have would be appreciated.

    Thank you,

    Asa Jay

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired




  






Yahoo! Message number: 3047
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2016 23:49:51 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Serial port data

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Asa,Have you tried looping back TX and RX to see if the computer and terminal program see the data it sent?-Shawn


      From: "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2016 5:36 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Serial port data

<!--#yiv9661988924 #yiv9661988924 .yiv9661988924ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv9661988924 div.yiv9661988924ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv9661988924 div.yiv9661988924photo-title a, #yiv9661988924 div.yiv9661988924photo-title a:active, #yiv9661988924 div.yiv9661988924photo-title a:hover, #yiv9661988924 div.yiv9661988924photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv9661988924 div.yiv9661988924attach-table div.yiv9661988924attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv9661988924 div.yiv9661988924attach-table div.yiv9661988924attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv9661988924 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv9661988924 div.yiv9661988924ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv9661988924 div.yiv9661988924attach-table div.yiv9661988924attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv9661988924 div.yiv9661988924attach-table div.yiv9661988924attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv9661988924 div.yiv9661988924ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv9661988924 -->

 Hello all,
 I find myself with a lack of knowledge.  I have managed to export an application from GRiD ROM and run it on a modern computer.  The application addresses the GRiD RS232C 25-pin serial port.  The device it controls uses three lines, TX, RX and GND.

 When running the app on a modern computer, it fails to see the BUS of the equipment.  However, I can see signaling coming from the serial port to the correct pins for TX.  Why doesn't it work?

 To troubleshoot this more, I'd like to know if the serial port on a GRiD is pre-set to any specific values.  Baud, parity, etc.  I have used an O-scope to compare the signals from the GRiD and my other laptop.  The only difference I can discern is voltage.  When the application runs on the GRiD, the voltage is 2.6V pk-pk, swinging 1.3V either side of GND.  On the modern laptop its only putting out 1.44V pk-pk with a .7V swing either side of GND.

 I am still researching the end-equipment to see if it requires a higher voltage trigger or not.  Meanwhile I thought I'd ask about the serial port protocol; maybe I have to set my port differently on my modern computer.

 Any insights folks might have would be appreciated.
 Thank you,
 Asa  Jay
 Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired











Yahoo! Message number: 3048
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2016 16:20:35 -0800

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Serial port data





  
    
  
  
    A good point indeed, however... I did something even better.

    

    After looking in the TO and not finding anything regarding baud
    rates, I decided to experiment.

    It would appear the program or GRiD is sending at 4800. At least,
    it all appears to operate at that baud rate on my other computer
    just fine. I just couldn't see it being the voltage since most
    RS232C compatible equipment should work even with the lower signal
    voltage I was seeing. But being the troubleshooter I am, I asked as
    many questions as possible up front.

    

    Thank you,

    Asa Jay

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired



    

    On 1/24/2016 3:49 PM, Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]
    wrote:
    

      
      
          

            

              
Asa,

              
Have you tried looping back TX and RX to see if
                  the computer and terminal program see the data it
                  sent?

              
-Shawn

              
            

          

        
      
      

    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3049
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2016 11:21:59 -0800

From: Jim Stephens 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Serial port data

text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed




On 1/24/2016 4:20 PM, Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] 
wrote:
>
>
> A good point indeed, however... I did something even better.
>
> After looking in the TO and not finding anything regarding baud rates, 
> I decided to experiment.
> It would appear the program or GRiD is sending at 4800.  At least, it 
> all appears to operate at that baud rate on my other computer just 
> fine.  I just couldn't see it being the voltage since most RS232C 
> compatible equipment should work even with the lower signal voltage I 
> was seeing.  But being the troubleshooter I am, I asked as many 
> questions as possible up front.
>
the .7 volts value sounds wrong.  ARe you using a 10x probe?  The 
numbers seem off by that much.

.7 is the noise threshold of TTL of course.  And only very modern 
equipment should be using the 1.3 or 1.5v and that is with parts that 
are running off a 3.3v Vcc.

Something isn't right there.

The baud rate should be settable either in Dos or in the application, 
and only if they are working thru a dos COM port device.  If they take 
control of what may be marked COM1 or COM2 they usually mean they are 
controlling devices @ 0x03f8, or 0x02f8 in the x86 address space which 
are where the uarts live(d).  That can cause some confusion.  You may 
need to proceed carefully till you figure that out as changing the Uart 
parameters vary in a lot of ways depending on what way the program is 
addressing the Uarts.

Most nicely behaved ones now days have to go thru the Dos COM port to 
accommodate such as USB devices on modern systems.  The COM application 
program interface still works that way.  And you can't get to any USB 
device via physical ports except in very unusual interface examples.

thanks
Jim


> Thank you,
> Asa Jay
> Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
>
>
> On 1/24/2016 3:49 PM, Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
>> Asa,
>> Have you tried looping back TX and RX to see if the computer and 
>> terminal program see the data it sent?
>> -Shawn
>>
>
>
> 






Yahoo! Message number: 3050
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2016 13:06:16 -0800

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Serial port data

text/plain; charset=utf-8



I thought about the 10x probe possibility as I went to bed last night.  I'm new to this scope and have only played with it once before.  As I passed by it I looked at the probe and found it's a dual range...  with the switch set in 10x.

Doh!!

So tonight when I get home from work I will re-test it all.  I also thought it sounded low but dismissed it quite quickly for some unknown reason.

I did get my other non-GRiD computer to work by changing the COM1 baud rate.  I still don't know if the application tries to change it and fails to on my other computer or if the application uses the default state of the COM1 port when the GRiD is first turned on.  More investigation needed.

Asa  Jay


Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks

"Jim Stephens jws@jwsss.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

>  
>
>
>
>On 1/24/2016 4:20 PM, Asa Jay Laughton asajay@asajay.com [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
>
>A good point indeed, however... I did something even better.
>
>After looking in the TO and not finding anything regarding baud rates, I decided to experiment.
>It would appear the program or GRiD is sending at 4800.  At least, it all appears to operate at that baud rate on my other computer just fine.  I just couldn't see it being the voltage since most RS232C compatible equipment should work even with the lower signal voltage I was seeing.  But being the troubleshooter I am, I asked as many questions as possible up front.
>
>the .7 volts value sounds wrong.  ARe you using a 10x probe?  The numbers seem off by that much.
>
>.7 is the noise threshold of TTL of course.  And only very modern equipment should be using the 1.3 or 1.5v and that is with parts that are running off a 3.3v Vcc.
>
>Something isn't right there.
>
>The baud rate should be settable either in Dos or in the application, and only if they are working thru a dos COM port device.  If they take control of what may be marked COM1 or COM2 they usually mean they are controlling devices @ 0x03f8, or 0x02f8 in the x86 address space which are where the uarts live(d).  That can cause some confusion.  You may need to proceed carefully till you figure that out as changing the Uart parameters vary in a lot of ways depending on what way the program is addressing the Uarts.
>
>Most nicely behaved ones now days have to go thru the Dos COM port to accommodate such as USB devices on modern systems.  The COM application program interface still works that way.  And you can't get to any USB device via physical ports except in very unusual interface examples.
>
>thanks
>Jim
>
>
>Thank you,
>Asa Jay
>Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired 
>On 1/24/2016 3:49 PM, Shawnerz shawnerz@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote: 
>
>  
>
>Asa,
>
>Have you tried looping back TX and RX to see if the computer and terminal program see the data it sent?
>
>-Shawn
>
>
>
>
>
><!-- #ygrp-mkp { border: 1px solid #d8d8d8; font-family: Arial; margin: 10px 0; padding: 0 10px; } #ygrp-mkp hr { border: 1px solid #d8d8d8; } #ygrp-mkp #hd { color: #628c2a; font-size: 85%; font-weight: 700; line-height: 122%; margin: 10px 0; } #ygrp-mkp #ads { margin-bottom: 10px; } #ygrp-mkp .ad { padding: 0 0; } #ygrp-mkp .ad p { margin: 0; } #ygrp-mkp .ad a { color: #0000ff; text-decoration: none; } #ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc { font-family: Arial; } #ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc #hd { margin: 10px 0px; font-weight: 700; font-size: 78%; line-height: 122%; } #ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc .ad { margin-bottom: 10px; padding: 0 0; } #actions { font-family: Verdana; font-size: 11px; padding: 10px 0; } #activity { background-color: #e0ecee; float: left; font-family: Verdana; font-size: 10px; padding: 10px; } #activity span { font-weight: 700; } #activity span:first-child { text-transform: uppercase; } #activity span a { color: #5085b6; text-decoration: none; } #activity span span { color: #ff7900; } #activity span .underline { text-decoration: underline; } .attach { clear: both; display: table; font-family: Arial; font-size: 12px; padding: 10px 0; width: 400px; } .attach div a { text-decoration: none; } .attach img { border: none; padding-right: 5px; } .attach label { display: block; margin-bottom: 5px; } .attach label a { text-decoration: none; } blockquote { margin: 0 0 0 4px; } .bold { font-family: Arial; font-size: 13px; font-weight: 700; } .bold a { text-decoration: none; } dd.last p a { font-family: Verdana; font-weight: 700; } dd.last p span { margin-right: 10px; font-family: Verdana; font-weight: 700; } dd.last p span.yshortcuts { margin-right: 0; } div.attach-table div div a { text-decoration: none; } div.attach-table { width: 400px; } div.file-title a, div.file-title a:active, div.file-title a:hover, div.file-title a:visited { text-decoration: none; } div.photo-title a, div.photo-title a:active, div.photo-title a:hover, div.photo-title a:visited { text-decoration: none; } div#ygrp-mlmsg #ygrp-msg p a span.yshortcuts { font-family: Verdana; font-size: 10px; font-weight: normal; } .green { color: #628c2a; } .MsoNormal { margin: 0 0 0 0; } o { font-size: 0; } #photos div { float: left; width: 72px; } #photos div div { border: 1px solid #666666; height: 62px; overflow: hidden; width: 62px; } #photos div label { color: #666666; font-size: 10px; overflow: hidden; text-align: center; white-space: nowrap; width: 64px; } #reco-category { font-size: 77%; } #reco-desc { font-size: 77%; } .replbq { margin: 4px; } #ygrp-actbar div a:first-child { /* border-right: 0px solid #000;*/ margin-right: 2px; padding-right: 5px; } #ygrp-mlmsg { font-size: 13px; font-family: Arial, helvetica,clean, sans-serif; *font-size: small; *font: x-small; } #ygrp-mlmsg table { font-size: inherit; font: 100%; } #ygrp-mlmsg select, input, textarea { font: 99% Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; } #ygrp-mlmsg pre, code { font:115% monospace; *font-size:100%; } #ygrp-mlmsg * { line-height: 1.22em; } #ygrp-mlmsg #logo { padding-bottom: 10px; } #ygrp-msg p a { font-family: Verdana; } #ygrp-msg p#attach-count span { color: #1E66AE; font-weight: 700; } #ygrp-reco #reco-head { color: #ff7900; font-weight: 700; } #ygrp-reco { margin-bottom: 20px; padding: 0px; } #ygrp-sponsor #ov li a { font-size: 130%; text-decoration: none; } #ygrp-sponsor #ov li { font-size: 77%; list-style-type: square; padding: 6px 0; } #ygrp-sponsor #ov ul { margin: 0; padding: 0 0 0 8px; } #ygrp-text { font-family: Georgia; } #ygrp-text p { margin: 0 0 1em 0; } #ygrp-text tt { font-size: 120%; } #ygrp-vital ul li:last-child { border-right: none !important; } --> 



Yahoo! Message number: 3051
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2016 20:56:39 -0800

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Serial port data





  
    
    
  
  
    To put this issue to bed, I again tested this evening.

    

    Both the GRiD RS232C serial out, and the USB-to-Serial converter on
    my everyday Dell laptop, both read 10.2V pk-pk when the probe is set
    to 1X (and not 10X). That is more like it.

    

    Problem solved, just a little PEBKAC, or ID10T error. :)

    

    Now, I still can't determine the baud rate out of the GRiD unless
    there is some way to tell from the pulses or frequency of pulses
    coming out of the port and read on an o-scope.

    

    Asa Jay

    

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired



    

    On 1/26/2016 1:06 PM, Asa Jay Laughton asajay@...
    [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
    

      
      
          

            

              
I thought about the 10x probe possibility as I went
                to bed last night. I'm new to this scope and have only
                played with it once before. As I passed by it I looked
                at the probe and found it's a dual range... with the
                switch set in 10x.

              


              

              
Doh!!

              


              

              
So tonight when I get home from work I will re-test
                it all. I also thought it sounded low but dismissed it
                quite quickly for some unknown reason.

              


              

              
I did get my other non-GRiD computer to work by
                changing the COM1 baud rate. I still don't know if the
                application tries to change it and fails to on my other
                computer or if the application uses the default state of
                the COM1 port when the GRiD is first turned on. More
                investigation needed.

              


              

              
Asa Jay

              


              

              


              

              
Sent using
                    Jedi Mind Tricks

            

            

            

            "Jim Stephens jws@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"
             wrote:

            

            
            

              
 

                

              

              
On 1/24/2016 4:20 PM, Asa Jay
                Laughton asajay@...
                [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:

              

              
 A good point indeed, however... I did
                something even better.

                

                After looking in the TO and not finding anything
                regarding baud rates, I decided to experiment.

                It would appear the program or GRiD is sending at 4800.
                At least, it all appears to operate at that baud rate on
                my other computer just fine. I just couldn't see it
                being the voltage since most RS232C compatible equipment
                should work even with the lower signal voltage I was
                seeing. But being the troubleshooter I am, I asked as
                many questions as possible up front.

                

              

              the .7 volts value sounds wrong. ARe you using a 10x
              probe? The numbers seem off by that much.

              

              .7 is the noise threshold of TTL of course. And only very
              modern equipment should be using the 1.3 or 1.5v and that
              is with parts that are running off a 3.3v Vcc.

              

              Something isn't right there.

              

              The baud rate should be settable either in Dos or in the
              application, and only if they are working thru a dos COM
              port device. If they take control of what may be marked
              COM1 or COM2 they usually mean they are controlling
              devices @ 0x03f8, or 0x02f8 in the x86 address space which
              are where the uarts live(d). That can cause some
              confusion. You may need to proceed carefully till you
              figure that out as changing the Uart parameters vary in a
              lot of ways depending on what way the program is
              addressing the Uarts.

              

              Most nicely behaved ones now days have to go thru the Dos
              COM port to accommodate such as USB devices on modern
              systems. The COM application program interface still
              works that way. And you can't get to any USB device via
              physical ports except in very unusual interface examples.

              

              thanks

              Jim

              

              

              
 Thank you,

                Asa Jay

                
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired



                

                On 1/24/2016 3:49 PM, Shawnerz shawnerz@...
                [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
                
 
                  

                    

                      
Asa,

                      
Have you tried looping back TX and RX
                          to see if the computer and terminal program
                          see the data it sent?

                      
-Shawn

                       

                  

                  

                

              

              

            

          

          
      
      
No virus found
        in this message.

        Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

        Version: 2016.0.7357 / Virus Database: 4522/11490 - Release
        Date: 01/26/16

      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3052
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2016 06:53:00 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Serial port data

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Asa,I can't remember what your end goal is. But, would an old version of Procomm Plus help? If it works correctly, you should be able to set the baud rate to whatever you want.-Shawn

      From: "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@asajay.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Tuesday, January 26, 2016 11:56 PM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Serial port data

<!--#yiv8222321525 #yiv8222321525 .yiv8222321525ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv8222321525 div.yiv8222321525ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv8222321525 div.yiv8222321525photo-title a, #yiv8222321525 div.yiv8222321525photo-title a:active, #yiv8222321525 div.yiv8222321525photo-title a:hover, #yiv8222321525 div.yiv8222321525photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv8222321525 div.yiv8222321525attach-table div.yiv8222321525attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv8222321525 div.yiv8222321525attach-table div.yiv8222321525attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv8222321525 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv8222321525 div.yiv8222321525ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv8222321525 div.yiv8222321525attach-table div.yiv8222321525attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv8222321525 div.yiv8222321525attach-table div.yiv8222321525attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv8222321525 div.yiv8222321525ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv8222321525 -->

 To put this issue to bed, I again tested this evening.

 Both the GRiD RS232C serial out, and the USB-to-Serial converter on my everyday Dell laptop, both read 10.2V pk-pk when the probe is set to 1X (and not 10X).  That is more like it.

 Problem solved, just a little PEBKAC, or ID10T error.  :)

 Now, I still can't determine the baud rate out of the GRiD unless there is some way to tell from the pulses or frequency of pulses coming out of the port and read on an o-scope.

 Asa  Jay

 Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired










Yahoo! Message number: 3053
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2016 10:29:23 -0800

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Serial port data

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Thank you but that will be unnecessary.  I could also set the baud on the GRiD using the MODE command, but that's not what I was after.

My original goal was to:
1)  Extract the Collins HF-80 radio control program from the GRiD and get it to run on any non-GRiD laptop.  Accomplished.
2)  Get the application to actually operate the radios from a modern laptop that doesn't contain an RS232 9-pin or 25-pin serial port.  This I accomplished by using an FTDI chipset USB-to-serial (9-pin) adapter with Virtual Com Port drivers, reassigning the port to COM1 and finally, adjusting the baud rate via the Windows Device Manager for COM1 to 4800.

The GRiD had always worked with the system.  My goal was to make it all work -without- the GRiD, so that I could also run other applications in my Ham Shack on a single computer.  In the end, I still don't know what baud rate the GRiD is using once the application is up and running, but by adjusting the baud in Windows, I seem to have found a rate the system will operate at.

This will help keep the GRiD from being used a lot, preserving it for future use or conservation.

Asa  Jay
W7TSC


Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks

"Shawnerz shawnerz@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

>  
>
>Asa,
>
>I can't remember what your end goal is. But, would an old version of Procomm Plus help? If it works correctly, you should be able to set the baud rate to whatever you want.
>
>-Shawn
>
>
>
>From: "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@asajay.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
>To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com 
>Sent: Tuesday, January 26, 2016 11:56 PM
>Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Serial port data
>
>
>
>
>To put this issue to bed, I again tested this evening.
>
>Both the GRiD RS232C serial out, and the USB-to-Serial converter on my everyday Dell laptop, both read 10.2V pk-pk when the probe is set to 1X (and not 10X).  That is more like it.
>
>Problem solved, just a little PEBKAC, or ID10T error.  :)
>
>Now, I still can't determine the baud rate out of the GRiD unless there is some way to tell from the pulses or frequency of pulses coming out of the port and read on an o-scope.
>
>Asa  Jay
>
>Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired 
>
>
>
>
>
><!-- #ygrp-mkp { border: 1px solid #d8d8d8; font-family: Arial; margin: 10px 0; padding: 0 10px; } #ygrp-mkp hr { border: 1px solid #d8d8d8; } #ygrp-mkp #hd { color: #628c2a; font-size: 85%; font-weight: 700; line-height: 122%; margin: 10px 0; } #ygrp-mkp #ads { margin-bottom: 10px; } #ygrp-mkp .ad { padding: 0 0; } #ygrp-mkp .ad p { margin: 0; } #ygrp-mkp .ad a { color: #0000ff; text-decoration: none; } #ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc { font-family: Arial; } #ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc #hd { margin: 10px 0px; font-weight: 700; font-size: 78%; line-height: 122%; } #ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc .ad { margin-bottom: 10px; padding: 0 0; } #actions { font-family: Verdana; font-size: 11px; padding: 10px 0; } #activity { background-color: #e0ecee; float: left; font-family: Verdana; font-size: 10px; padding: 10px; } #activity span { font-weight: 700; } #activity span:first-child { text-transform: uppercase; } #activity span a { color: #5085b6; text-decoration: none; } #activity span span { color: #ff7900; } #activity span .underline { text-decoration: underline; } .attach { clear: both; display: table; font-family: Arial; font-size: 12px; padding: 10px 0; width: 400px; } .attach div a { text-decoration: none; } .attach img { border: none; padding-right: 5px; } .attach label { display: block; margin-bottom: 5px; } .attach label a { text-decoration: none; } blockquote { margin: 0 0 0 4px; } .bold { font-family: Arial; font-size: 13px; font-weight: 700; } .bold a { text-decoration: none; } dd.last p a { font-family: Verdana; font-weight: 700; } dd.last p span { margin-right: 10px; font-family: Verdana; font-weight: 700; } dd.last p span.yshortcuts { margin-right: 0; } div.attach-table div div a { text-decoration: none; } div.attach-table { width: 400px; } div.file-title a, div.file-title a:active, div.file-title a:hover, div.file-title a:visited { text-decoration: none; } div.photo-title a, div.photo-title a:active, div.photo-title a:hover, div.photo-title a:visited { text-decoration: none; } div#ygrp-mlmsg #ygrp-msg p a span.yshortcuts { font-family: Verdana; font-size: 10px; font-weight: normal; } .green { color: #628c2a; } .MsoNormal { margin: 0 0 0 0; } o { font-size: 0; } #photos div { float: left; width: 72px; } #photos div div { border: 1px solid #666666; height: 62px; overflow: hidden; width: 62px; } #photos div label { color: #666666; font-size: 10px; overflow: hidden; text-align: center; white-space: nowrap; width: 64px; } #reco-category { font-size: 77%; } #reco-desc { font-size: 77%; } .replbq { margin: 4px; } #ygrp-actbar div a:first-child { /* border-right: 0px solid #000;*/ margin-right: 2px; padding-right: 5px; } #ygrp-mlmsg { font-size: 13px; font-family: Arial, helvetica,clean, sans-serif; *font-size: small; *font: x-small; } #ygrp-mlmsg table { font-size: inherit; font: 100%; } #ygrp-mlmsg select, input, textarea { font: 99% Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; } #ygrp-mlmsg pre, code { font:115% monospace; *font-size:100%; } #ygrp-mlmsg * { line-height: 1.22em; } #ygrp-mlmsg #logo { padding-bottom: 10px; } #ygrp-msg p a { font-family: Verdana; } #ygrp-msg p#attach-count span { color: #1E66AE; font-weight: 700; } #ygrp-reco #reco-head { color: #ff7900; font-weight: 700; } #ygrp-reco { margin-bottom: 20px; padding: 0px; } #ygrp-sponsor #ov li a { font-size: 130%; text-decoration: none; } #ygrp-sponsor #ov li { font-size: 77%; list-style-type: square; padding: 6px 0; } #ygrp-sponsor #ov ul { margin: 0; padding: 0 0 0 8px; } #ygrp-text { font-family: Georgia; } #ygrp-text p { margin: 0 0 1em 0; } #ygrp-text tt { font-size: 120%; } #ygrp-vital ul li:last-child { border-right: none !important; } --> 



Yahoo! Message number: 3054
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2016 14:16:00 -0800

From: Jim Stephens 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Serial port data

text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed



If you can find a way to do it, like a brick on the keyboard, the upper 
case U is pattern 0x55.  that pattern should give you the most wiggles 
for the buck, and at least 8 of them will be changing exactly once per 
bit time.

I know if you can get the scope to sync and have sufficiently low rep 
rate, you should be able to time the bits you see and approximate the 
baud rate.

parity and stop bits make a big difference.
The most common settings are

7 bits, Even parity, 1 stop bit,
8 bits, no parity, 1 stop bit.

Both of the above ascii frames have the same number of bits.  the 7 bit 
+ even party == 8 bits in the data portion of the frame

8 bits with no  parity (giving the capability to send full 256 character 
ascii table) has 8 data bits as well.

If the upper case U is transmitted with 7 E and 1, then you will have 4 
bits, so the parity bit should be off, since you have an even number of 
1 bits already (correct me if I'm wrong, been a long time since I've 
done that particular thing w/o a cheet sheet).

I have a copy of pcplus somewhere, not sure of licensing, or if I have 
one what will run on a dos session.  I shifted to the windows version 
and am not sure if there is a simple version that would fit on a DOS 
floppy and run on dos or not.

thanks
Jim

On 1/27/2016 10:29 AM, Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... 
[RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
>
>
> Thank you but that will be unnecessary.  I could also set the baud on 
> the GRiD using the MODE command, but that's not what I was after.
>
> My original goal was to:
> 1)  Extract the Collins HF-80 radio control program from the GRiD and 
> get it to run on any non-GRiD laptop. Accomplished.
> 2)  Get the application to actually operate the radios from a modern 
> laptop that doesn't contain an RS232 9-pin or 25-pin serial port.  
> This I accomplished by using an FTDI chipset USB-to-serial (9-pin) 
> adapter with Virtual Com Port drivers, reassigning the port to COM1 
> and finally, adjusting the baud rate via the Windows Device Manager 
> for COM1 to 4800.
>
> The GRiD had always worked with the system.  My goal was to make it 
> all work -without- the GRiD, so that I could also run other 
> applications in my Ham Shack on a single computer.  In the end, I 
> still don't know what baud rate the GRiD is using once the application 
> is up and running, but by adjusting the baud in Windows, I seem to 
> have found a rate the system will operate at.
>
> This will help keep the GRiD from being used a lot, preserving it for 
> future use or conservation.
>
> Asa  Jay
> W7TSC
>
>
> /Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks/
>
>
> "Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" 
> <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>
> Asa,
> I can't remember what your end goal is. But, would an old version of 
> Procomm Plus help? If it works correctly, you should be able to set 
> the baud rate to whatever you want.
> -Shawn
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" 
> <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
> *To:* RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
> *Sent:* Tuesday, January 26, 2016 11:56 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Serial port data
>
>
>
> To put this issue to bed, I again tested this evening.
>
> Both the GRiD RS232C serial out, and the USB-to-Serial converter on my 
> everyday Dell laptop, both read 10.2V pk-pk when the probe is set to 
> 1X (and not 10X).  That is more like it.
>
> Problem solved, just a little PEBKAC, or ID10T error.  :)
>
> Now, I still can't determine the baud rate out of the GRiD unless 
> there is some way to tell from the pulses or frequency of pulses 
> coming out of the port and read on an o-scope.
>
> Asa  Jay
>
> Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 






Yahoo! Message number: 3055
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2016 06:39:08 +0000

From: David Walton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Serial port data

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Well done!


> On 27 Jan 2016, at 18:29, "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@...m [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>
> Thank you but that will be unnecessary.  I could also set the baud on the GRiD using the MODE command, but that's not what I was after.
>
> My original goal was to:
> 1)  Extract the Collins HF-80 radio control program from the GRiD and get it to run on any non-GRiD laptop.  Accomplished.
> 2)  Get the application to actually operate the radios from a modern laptop that doesn't contain an RS232 9-pin or 25-pin serial port.  This I accomplished by using an FTDI chipset USB-to-serial (9-pin) adapter with Virtual Com Port drivers, reassigning the port to COM1 and finally, adjusting the baud rate via the Windows Device Manager for COM1 to 4800.
>
> The GRiD had always worked with the system.  My goal was to make it all work -without- the GRiD, so that I could also run other applications in my Ham Shack on a single computer.  In the end, I still don't know what baud rate the GRiD is using once the application is up and running, but by adjusting the baud in Windows, I seem to have found a rate the system will operate at.
>
> This will help keep the GRiD from being used a lot, preserving it for future use or conservation.
>
> Asa  Jay
> W7TSC
>
>
> Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks
>
>
> "Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>
>
> Asa,
> I can't remember what your end goal is. But, would an old version of Procomm Plus help? If it works correctly, you should be able to set the baud rate to whatever you want.
> -Shawn
>
>
> From: "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
> To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, January 26, 2016 11:56 PM
> Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Serial port data
>
>
>
> To put this issue to bed, I again tested this evening.
>
> Both the GRiD RS232C serial out, and the USB-to-Serial converter on my everyday Dell laptop, both read 10.2V pk-pk when the probe is set to 1X (and not 10X).  That is more like it.
>
> Problem solved, just a little PEBKAC, or ID10T error.  :)
>
> Now, I still can't determine the baud rate out of the GRiD unless there is some way to tell from the pulses or frequency of pulses coming out of the port and read on an o-scope.
>
> Asa  Jay
>
> Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
>
>
>
>
>
>





Yahoo! Message number: 3056
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2016 20:29:22 -0800

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Follow-up  RE:Serial port data





Yahoo! Message number: 3057
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2016 04:58:43 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Follow-up  RE:Serial port data




Very cool, Asa!


      From: "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Thursday, January 28, 2016 11:29 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Follow-up RE:Serial port data

<!--#yiv9469203950 #yiv9469203950 .yiv9469203950ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv9469203950 div.yiv9469203950ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv9469203950 div.yiv9469203950photo-title a, #yiv9469203950 div.yiv9469203950photo-title a:active, #yiv9469203950 div.yiv9469203950photo-title a:hover, #yiv9469203950 div.yiv9469203950photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv9469203950 div.yiv9469203950attach-table div.yiv9469203950attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv9469203950 div.yiv9469203950attach-table div.yiv9469203950attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv9469203950 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv9469203950 div.yiv9469203950ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv9469203950 div.yiv9469203950attach-table div.yiv9469203950attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv9469203950 div.yiv9469203950attach-table div.yiv9469203950attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv9469203950 div.yiv9469203950ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv9469203950 -->

 I had time today to hook up my o-scope to the GRiD again to try and determine the baud rate for certain.  I first found this simple explanation of how to do it:

https://www.kumari.net/index.php/random/37-determing-unknown-baud-rate

 I set up the GRiD and found it had a minimum pulse width of 410uS which works out to be 2400 baud:


 I then did the same with my FTDI USB-to-serial cable on my Dell.  It too came out the same, no matter what I set the COM1 port to.  Therefore, it would appear the program sets the baud rate, despite what Windows says it should be.  My previous failure was due to something else I hadn't considered, the config of the program at the time.  When I set the baud in Windows to 2400, I also did more configs in the application in order to "see" the proper radios.

 Therefore, the baud really -is- 2400 from the GRiD, at least for this specific program, and the program appears to set the baud of my USB-to-serial cable to 2400 on my Windows 7 laptop, despite what I set the port to in the Device Manager.
 
 Just some little tidbits I thought you might enjoy.
 Asa  Jay
 Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired


 On 1/27/2016 2:16 PM, Jim Stephens jws@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
  
 If you can find a way to do it, like a brick on the keyboard, the upper case U is pattern 0x55.  that pattern should give you the most wiggles for the buck, and at least 8 of them will be changing exactly once per bit time.

 I know if you can get the scope to sync and have sufficiently low rep rate, you should be able to time the bits you see and approximate the baud rate.

 parity and stop bits make a big difference. 
 The most common settings are

 7 bits, Even parity, 1 stop bit,
 8 bits, no parity, 1 stop bit.

 Both of the above ascii frames have the same number of bits.  the 7 bit + even party == 8 bits in the data portion of the frame

 8 bits with no  parity (giving the capability to send full 256 character ascii table) has 8 data bits as well.

 If the upper case U is transmitted with 7 E and 1, then you will have 4 bits, so the parity bit should be off, since you have an even number of 1 bits already (correct me if I'm wrong, been a long time since I've done that particular thing w/o a cheet sheet).

 I have a copy of pcplus somewhere, not sure of licensing, or if I have one what will run on a dos session.  I shifted to the windows version and am not sure if there is a simple version that would fit on a DOS floppy and run on dos or not.

 thanks
 Jim

  On 1/27/2016 10:29 AM, Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:

  Thank you but that will be unnecessary.  I could also set the baud on the GRiD using the MODE command, but that's not what I was after.
  My original goal was to: 1)  Extract the Collins HF-80 radio control program from the GRiD and get it to run on any non-GRiD laptop.  Accomplished. 2)  Get the application to actually operate the radios from a modern laptop that doesn't contain an RS232 9-pin or 25-pin serial port.  This I accomplished by using an FTDI chipset USB-to-serial (9-pin) adapter with Virtual Com Port drivers, reassigning the port to COM1 and finally, adjusting the baud rate via the Windows Device Manager for COM1 to 4800.
  The GRiD had always worked with the system.  My goal was to make it all work -without- the GRiD, so that I could also run other applications in my Ham Shack on a single computer.  In the end, I still don't know what baud rate the GRiD is using once the application is up and running, but by adjusting the  baud in Windows, I seem to have found a rate the system will operate at.
  This will help keep the GRiD from being used a lot, preserving it for future use or conservation.
  Asa  Jay W7TSC

  Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks

 "Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

     Asa, I can't remember what your end goal is. But, would an old version of Procomm Plus help? If it works correctly, you should be able to set the baud rate to whatever you want. -Shawn

        From: "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@...m>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Tuesday, January 26, 2016 11:56 PM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Serial port data





 To put this issue to bed, I again tested this evening.

 Both the GRiD RS232C serial out, and the USB-to-Serial converter on my everyday Dell laptop, both read 10.2V pk-pk when the probe is set to 1X (and not 10X).  That is more like it.

 Problem solved, just a little PEBKAC, or ID10T error.  :)

 Now, I still can't determine the baud rate out of the GRiD unless there is some way to tell from the pulses or frequency of pulses coming out of the port and read on an o-scope.

 Asa  Jay

 Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired






  No virus found in this message.
 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
 Version: 2016.0.7357 / Virus Database: 4522/11495 - Release Date: 01/27/16





This is part 2 of a multi-part message.




Attached image/png file not shown; stay tuned!





Yahoo! Message number: 3058
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2016 22:34:49 -0800

From: Jim Stephens 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Follow-up RE:Serial port data [1 Attachment]





On 1/28/2016 8:58 PM, Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
> Very cool, Asa!
Great progress.  It is a cesspool trying to figure out who is doing what 
without hardware tracing and the like, and you just have to guess or get 
lucky in cases like this to get it working.  Glad you figured it out.  
Hope it works for you now.

thanks
Jim





Yahoo! Message number: 3059
Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2016 03:58:50 +0000 (UTC)

From: Keith Reid 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Serial port data

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Worked in the Data Communications/Computer industry.  Do you have access to a serial line monitor (DLM4,5,etc or Atlantic Research line monitor) or know anyone who does?  I picked one up on ebay for $20 and it still comes in handy.
A tough way would be to have another computer with a true serial port (no converters) and make a null modem cable.keith



      From: "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Tuesday, January 26, 2016 10:56 PM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Serial port data

     To put this issue to bed, I again tested this evening.

 Both the GRiD RS232C serial out, and the USB-to-Serial converter on my everyday Dell laptop, both read 10.2V pk-pk when the probe is set to 1X (and not 10X).  That is more like it.

 Problem solved, just a little PEBKAC, or ID10T error.  :)

 Now, I still can't determine the baud rate out of the GRiD unless there is some way to tell from the pulses or frequency of pulses coming out of the port and read on an o-scope.

 Asa  Jay

 Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired


 On 1/26/2016 1:06 PM, Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
     I thought about the 10x probe possibility as I went to bed last night.  I'm new to this scope and have only played with it once before.  As I passed by it I looked at the probe and found it's a dual range...  with the switch set in 10x.
  Doh!!
  So tonight when I get home from work I will re-test it all.  I also thought it sounded low but dismissed it quite quickly for some unknown reason.
  I did get my other non-GRiD computer to work by changing the COM1 baud rate.  I still don't know if the application tries to change it and fails to on my other computer or if the application uses the default state of  the COM1 port when the GRiD is first turned on.  More investigation needed.
  Asa  Jay

  Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks

 "Jim Stephens jws@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

  

  On 1/24/2016 4:20 PM, Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:

 A good point indeed, however... I did something even better.

 After looking in the TO and not finding anything regarding baud rates, I decided to experiment.
 It would appear the program or GRiD is sending at 4800.  At least, it all appears to operate at that baud rate on my other computer just fine.  I just couldn't see it being the voltage since most RS232C compatible equipment should work even with the lower signal voltage I was  seeing.  But being the troubleshooter I am, I asked as many questions as possible up front.


 the .7 volts value sounds wrong.  ARe you using a 10x probe?  The numbers seem off by that much.

 .7 is the noise threshold of TTL of course.  And only very modern equipment should be using the 1.3 or 1.5v and that is with parts that are running off a 3.3v Vcc.

 Something isn't right there.

 The baud rate should be settable either in Dos or in the application, and only if they are working thru a dos COM port device.  If they take control of what may be marked COM1 or COM2 they usually mean they are controlling devices @ 0x03f8, or 0x02f8 in the x86 address space which are where the uarts live(d).  That can cause some confusion.  You may need to proceed carefully till you figure that out as changing the Uart parameters vary in a lot of ways depending on what way the program is addressing the Uarts.

 Most nicely behaved ones now days have to go thru the Dos COM port to accommodate such as USB devices on modern systems.  The COM application program interface still works that way.  And you can't get to any USB device via physical ports except in very unusual interface examples.

 thanks
 Jim



 Thank you,
 Asa Jay
 Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired


 On 1/24/2016 3:49 PM, Shawnerz shawnerz@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
     Asa, Have you tried looping back TX and RX to see if the computer and terminal program see the data it sent? -Shawn



   No virus found in this message.
 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
 Version: 2016.0.7357 / Virus Database: 4522/11490 - Release Date: 01/26/16
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Yahoo! Message number: 3060
Date: 01 Feb 2016 07:54:05 -0800

From: walton.david@...

Subject: Help with GridCase 1660 battery rebuild




Hello, 
 

 The rechargeable battery pack for my GridCase 1660 has had it. It has an output of 14.4V 1.45Ah and the part number is G25-4209. I opened it up and found some unusual size batteries in it plus a black wire with a tab on it (see photos). 
 

 1. Does anyone know what size and type of batteries these are? Assume 12 x 1.2v either NiCd or NiMH. The only markings are HT-2 MC27 and each measure 43mm x 14mm which doesn't fit any size I am aware of.
 

 2. Does anyone know what the black wire with Tab is? It has the following text (KLIXON 3-S 4MM75A X1J). Is it a temperature sensor or a resistor?
 

 3. Any advise from someone who has attempted this before?
 

 Many thanks
 

 David.
 

 


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Yahoo! Message number: 3061
Date: 01 Feb 2016 10:30:31 -0800

From: shawnerz@...

Subject: Re: Help with GridCase 1660 battery rebuild

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Hello, David.
Just guessing here. Based on late 90's technology, NiMH wasn't around yet. So NiCD is my bet.

I'm 99% sure it is a battery protector. If the cells overheat due to charging (or very rapid discharge), the junction opens. My guess is it's one of these: http://www.sensata.com/download/motor-ys11.pdf http://www.sensata.com/download/motor-ys11.pdf with a 75 deg C cut off.

If you're sentimental for having the battery pack, I would see about getting the pack rebuilt. I would call them on the phone and email pictures to get a quote first. In the past, on a cordless drill and radio projects, I've used a place out of PA and one in Canada with good results.
Good luck,
-Shawn



Yahoo! Message number: 3062
Date: Mon, 01 Feb 2016 10:37:19 -0800

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Help with GridCase 1660 battery rebuild [2 Attachments]

text/plain; charset=utf-8



The black gizmo is most likely a thermal fuse of sorts, I could search the part number but I'm being lazy at the moment.  We've put similar devices on some of our battery powered products to prevent overload.  It's like a self-resetting fuse.

With that said, if you don't have any power from the batteries as a whole, but individual cells appear to have power, then that part is probably bad.

If you have a Batteries Plus near you, I'd take it to them and ask if they could replace the batteries.  Take the whole assembly; they might be able to fix you up really well.

Asa  Jay

Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks

"walton.david@sky.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

>  
>
>[Attachment(s) from walton.david@sky.com [RuGRiD-Laptop] included below] 
>
>Hello, 
>
>
>The rechargeable battery pack for my GridCase 1660 has had it. It has an output of 14.4V 1.45Ah and the part number is G25-4209. I opened it up and found some unusual size batteries in it plus a black wire with a tab on it (see photos). 
>
>
>1. Does anyone know what size and type of batteries these are? Assume 12 x 1.2v either NiCd or NiMH. The only markings are HT-2 MC27 and each measure 43mm x 14mm which doesn't fit any size I am aware of.
>
>
>2. Does anyone know what the black wire with Tab is? It has the following text (KLIXON 3-S 4MM75A X1J). Is it a temperature sensor or a resistor?
>
>
>3. Any advise from someone who has attempted this before?
>
>
>Many thanks
>
>
>David.
>
>
>< br class="yui-cursor">
>
>
>
><!-- #ygrp-mkp { border: 1px solid #d8d8d8; font-family: Arial; margin: 10px 0; padding: 0 10px; } #ygrp-mkp hr { border: 1px solid #d8d8d8; } #ygrp-mkp #hd { color: #628c2a; font-size: 85%; font-weight: 700; line-height: 122%; margin: 10px 0; } #ygrp-mkp #ads { margin-bottom: 10px; } #ygrp-mkp .ad { padding: 0 0; } #ygrp-mkp .ad p { margin: 0; } #ygrp-mkp .ad a { color: #0000ff; text-decoration: none; } #ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc { font-family: Arial; } #ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc #hd { margin: 10px 0px; font-weight: 700; font-size: 78%; line-height: 122%; } #ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc .ad { margin-bottom: 10px; padding: 0 0; } #actions { font-family: Verdana; font-size: 11px; padding: 10px 0; } #activity { background-color: #e0ecee; float: left; font-family: Verdana; font-size: 10px; padding: 10px; } #activity span { font-weight: 700; } #activity span:first-child { text-transform: uppercase; } #activity span a { color: #5085b6; text-decoration: none; } #activity span span { color: #ff7900; } #activity span .underline { text-decoration: underline; } .attach { clear: both; display: table; font-family: Arial; font-size: 12px; padding: 10px 0; width: 400px; } .attach div a { text-decoration: none; } .attach img { border: none; padding-right: 5px; } .attach label { display: block; margin-bottom: 5px; } .attach label a { text-decoration: none; } blockquote { margin: 0 0 0 4px; } .bold { font-family: Arial; font-size: 13px; font-weight: 700; } .bold a { text-decoration: none; } dd.last p a { font-family: Verdana; font-weight: 700; } dd.last p span { margin-right: 10px; font-family: Verdana; font-weight: 700; } dd.last p span.yshortcuts { margin-right: 0; } div.attach-table div div a { text-decoration: none; } div.attach-table { width: 400px; } div.file-title a, div.file-title a:active, div.file-title a:hover, div.file-title a:visited { text-decoration: none; } div.photo-title a, div.photo-title a:active, div.photo-title a:hover, div.photo-title a:visited { text-decoration: none; } div#ygrp-mlmsg #ygrp-msg p a span.yshortcuts { font-family: Verdana; font-size: 10px; font-weight: normal; } .green { color: #628c2a; } .MsoNormal { margin: 0 0 0 0; } o { font-size: 0; } #photos div { float: left; width: 72px; } #photos div div { border: 1px solid #666666; height: 62px; overflow: hidden; width: 62px; } #photos div label { color: #666666; font-size: 10px; overflow: hidden; text-align: center; white-space: nowrap; width: 64px; } #reco-category { font-size: 77%; } #reco-desc { font-size: 77%; } .replbq { margin: 4px; } #ygrp-actbar div a:first-child { /* border-right: 0px solid #000;*/ margin-right: 2px; padding-right: 5px; } #ygrp-mlmsg { font-size: 13px; font-family: Arial, helvetica,clean, sans-serif; *font-size: small; *font: x-small; } #ygrp-mlmsg table { font-size: inherit; font: 100%; } #ygrp-mlmsg select, input, textarea { font: 99% Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; } #ygrp-mlmsg pre, code { font:115% monospace; *font-size:100%; } #ygrp-mlmsg * { line-height: 1.22em; } #ygrp-mlmsg #logo { padding-bottom: 10px; } #ygrp-msg p a { font-family: Verdana; } #ygrp-msg p#attach-count span { color: #1E66AE; font-weight: 700; } #ygrp-reco #reco-head { color: #ff7900; font-weight: 700; } #ygrp-reco { margin-bottom: 20px; padding: 0px; } #ygrp-sponsor #ov li a { font-size: 130%; text-decoration: none; } #ygrp-sponsor #ov li { font-size: 77%; list-style-type: square; padding: 6px 0; } #ygrp-sponsor #ov ul { margin: 0; padding: 0 0 0 8px; } #ygrp-text { font-family: Georgia; } #ygrp-text p { margin: 0 0 1em 0; } #ygrp-text tt { font-size: 120%; } #ygrp-vital ul li:last-child { border-right: none !important; } --> 



Yahoo! Message number: 3063
Date: Fri, 12 Feb 2016 02:05:30 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Internet Archive Announces Browser Based Windows 3.0

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



::Yawn:: 
Most of us can still actually run Windows 3.0/3.1 on our 1520's, 1535's, or 1550SX's!If you're interested, you can read about it here. :)Windows 3.1 Games Are Now Just a Click Away


|
|
|
|   |    |

   |

  |
|
|   |
Windows 3.1 Games Are Now Just a Click Away
 The Internet Archive brings the ability to run classic games and other software to a browser near you  |   |

  |

  |








Yahoo! Message number: 3064
Date: Sun, 21 Feb 2016 20:29:31 -0800

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Old GRiD app on modern computers





  
    
  
  
    As some of you may recall, I was trying to extract a specialized
    program from a GRiD ROM in order to try running it on a modern
    computer. The goal was simple; to not use the GRiD full-time in the
    hopes of preserving it, while at the same time allowing me to run
    the radios it was supposed to control so I could continue
    conservation and restoration efforts.

    

    The system also required a 25-pin serial connection, which modern
    computers don't have. These challenges were not insurmountable and
    the work has paid off.

    

    I have documented the process used to pull off the files and run
    them on a modern 64-bit Windows computer with no serial ports and
    put that information on my web site:

    

    http://w7tsc.org/index.php/an-tsc-60-v/tsc-60-v-2-4/15-grid

    

    The information there might help others as needed in the following
    areas:

    - Pulling files from the ROM (requires the computer still work)

    - Running old ROM files on a modern computer using DOSBox

    - Using a USB-to-Serial converter for controlling a serial device

    

    The reading is a bit long and broken into four specific articles
    which can also be downloaded from the Downloads area.

    

    I realize most people subscribed to this group probably want to
    -use- the GRiD and this information may not interest them as much.
    However, if someone finds themselves in a similar situation, these
    articles may help.

    

    Asa Jay

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired



    
  






Yahoo! Message number: 3065
Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2016 06:58:24 -0500

From: shawn 

Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Old GRiD app on modern computers

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Wow! Very impressive! I'm sure that was a lot of work.
Thanks for giving us the link to your site of very good information-and pictures! :-)
-Shawn

-------- Original message --------
From: "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@asajay.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> 
Date:02/21/2016  23:29  (GMT-05:00) 
To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com 
Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Old GRiD app on modern computers 



As some of you may recall, I was trying to extract a specialized program from a GRiD ROM in order to try running it on a modern computer.  The goal was simple; to not use the GRiD full-time in the hopes of preserving it, while at the same time allowing me to run the radios it was supposed to control so I could continue conservation and restoration efforts.

The system also required a 25-pin serial connection, which modern computers don't have.  These challenges were not insurmountable and the work has paid off.

I have documented the process used to pull off the files and run them on a modern 64-bit Windows computer with no serial ports and put that information on my web site:

http://w7tsc.org/index.php/an-tsc-60-v/tsc-60-v-2-4/15-grid

The information there might help others as needed in the following areas:
- Pulling files from the ROM (requires the computer still work)
- Running old ROM files on a modern computer using DOSBox
- Using a USB-to-Serial converter for controlling a serial device

The reading is a bit long and broken into four specific articles which can also be downloaded from the Downloads area.

I realize most people subscribed to this group probably want to -use- the GRiD and this information may not interest them as much.  However, if someone finds themselves in a similar situation, these articles may help.

Asa  Jay
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired







Yahoo! Message number: 3066
Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2016 21:07:59 +0000

From: D Walton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Old GRiD app on modern computers

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Thanks for listing. Glad to hear you had a good outcome.
Regards,
David Walton

> On 22 Feb 2016, at 04:29, Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>
> As some of you may recall, I was trying to extract a specialized program from a GRiD ROM in order to try running it on a modern computer.  The goal was simple; to not use the GRiD full-time in the hopes of preserving it, while at the same time allowing me to run the radios it was supposed to control so I could continue conservation and restoration efforts.
>
> The system also required a 25-pin serial connection, which modern computers don't have.  These challenges were not insurmountable and the work has paid off.
>
> I have documented the process used to pull off the files and run them on a modern 64-bit Windows computer with no serial ports and put that information on my web site:
>
> http://w7tsc.org/index.php/an-tsc-60-v/tsc-60-v-2-4/15-grid
>
> The information there might help others as needed in the following areas:
> - Pulling files from the ROM (requires the computer still work)
> - Running old ROM files on a modern computer using DOSBox
> - Using a USB-to-Serial converter for controlling a serial device
>
> The reading is a bit long and broken into four specific articles which can also be downloaded from the Downloads area.
>
> I realize most people subscribed to this group probably want to -use- the GRiD and this information may not interest them as much.  However, if someone finds themselves in a similar situation, these articles may help.
>
> Asa  Jay
> Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
>
> 





Yahoo! Message number: 3067
Date: Tue, 23 Feb 2016 22:04:29 -0800

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: GRiD Serial port research and comparison





  
    
    
  
  
    A little while back I was researching questions around the the
    RS232C 25-pin serial port on my GRiD in order to figure out if it
    worked the same as a modern computer. This was prompted by another
    person mentioning that they thought the GRiD serial port was
    "special" in some way and getting the same signaling out of a modern
    computer would require special hardware or code.

    

    With some help of others in this group and some additional research
    I found the answers I needed. There is nothing special about the
    GRiD serial port.

    

    I have written this quick research up in an article on my web site
    here:

http://w7tsc.org/index.php/an-tsc-60-v/tsc-60-v-2-4/15-grid/15-grid-serial-port-comparison-to-modern-computer

    

    This includes links to a brief description of the RS232C standard
    (modern standard by the way), and information on how to calculate
    baud rate using an oscilloscope, complete with screenshots.

    

    For anyone who wondered about the serial port on their GRiD.

    Asa Jay

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired




  






Yahoo! Message number: 3068
Date: 05 Jun 2016 13:39:42 -0700

From: klyball@...

Subject: 1520/1530 plasma screen




Does anyone have a spare screen from a part unit they would part with

Thanks
Grant



Yahoo! Message number: 3069
Date: 05 Jun 2016 13:48:12 -0700

From: lescovez@...

Subject: Re: 1520/1530 plasma screen




Hi!
Look here!:
Scott Smith
Computer Fusion
3516 Tarrant Main (DOCK 2)
Euless TX 76040
United States
 
Voice +001  817-354-4446
Fax +001 815-366-8093
scottsmith@cfusion.com https://e.mail.ru/compose/?mailto=mailto%3ascottsmith@cfusion.com

Yuri

This is part 2 of a multi-part message.




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Yahoo! Message number: 3070
Date: Sun, 05 Jun 2016 16:49:40 -0400

From: shawn 

Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520/1530 plasma screen

text/plain; charset=utf-8



LCD or Plasma?

-------- Original message --------
From: "klyball@hotmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> 
Date:06/05/2016  16:39  (GMT-05:00) 
To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com 
Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520/1530 plasma screen 

Does anyone have a spare screen from a part unit they would part with

Thanks
Grant

------------------------------------
Posted by: klyball@hotmail.com
------------------------------------

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rugrid-laptop/
------------------------------------

Yahoo Groups Links







Yahoo! Message number: 3071
Date: Sun, 5 Jun 2016 20:50:46 +0000 (UTC)

From: =?UTF-8?B?0K7RgNC40Lkg0JvQtdGB0LrQvtCy0LXRhg==?= 

Subject: =?UTF-8?Q?=D0=9E=D1=82=D0=B2:_[RuGRiD-Laptop]_Re:_1520/15?= =?UTF-8?Q?30_plasma_screen_[4_Attachments]?=

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



It costs about $ 95 (new!!!)

Yuri

    понедельник, 6 июня 2016 1:48 "lescovez@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> писал(а):


     [Attachment(s) from lescovez@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop] included below] Hi!
Look here!:
Scott Smith
Computer Fusion
3516 Tarrant Main (DOCK 2)
Euless TX 76040
United States
 
Voice +001  817-354-4446
Fax +001 815-366-8093
scottsmith@cfusion.com

Yuri
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Yahoo! Message number: 3072
Date: 05 Jun 2016 13:52:38 -0700

From: lescovez@...

Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520/1530 plasma screen

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Red Plasma!

Yuri



Yahoo! Message number: 3073
Date: Mon, 6 Jun 2016 15:28:52 +0000

From: Grant Shannon 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520/1530 plasma screen

text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"



Hi Shawn


Plasma is what I am looking for


Thanks


________________________________
From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of shawn shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: June 5, 2016 1:49 PM
To: RuGRiD-Laptop@...m
Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520/1530 plasma screen



LCD or Plasma?

-------- Original message --------
From: "klyball@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"
Date:06/05/2016 16:39 (GMT-05:00)
To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520/1530 plasma screen

Does anyone have a spare screen from a part unit they would part with

Thanks
Grant

------------------------------------
Posted by: klyball@...
------------------------------------

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rugrid-laptop/
------------------------------------

Yahoo Groups Links










Yahoo! Message number: 3074
Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2016 14:41:42 -0400

From: shawn 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520/1530 plasma screen

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Hey there, Grant.
I saw your response yesterday, but I don't think I have one. My Grid's are in storage. I think I have an LCD screen to spare. But I do not think I have a plasma screen. I will stop by my storage location and look on the weekend.
Good luck,
-Shawn

-------- Original message --------
From: "Grant Shannon klyball@hotmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> 
Date:06/06/2016  11:28  (GMT-05:00) 
To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com 
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520/1530 plasma screen 



Hi Shawn

Plasma is what I am looking for

Thanks


 
From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of shawn shawnerz@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: June 5, 2016 1:49 PM
To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520/1530 plasma screen
 
LCD or Plasma?

-------- Original message --------
From: "klyball@hotmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" 
Date:06/05/2016 16:39 (GMT-05:00) 
To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com 
Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520/1530 plasma screen 

Does anyone have a spare screen from a part unit they would part with

Thanks
Grant

------------------------------------
Posted by: klyball@hotmail.com
------------------------------------

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rugrid-laptop/
------------------------------------

Yahoo Groups Links









Yahoo! Message number: 3075
Date: Wed, 8 Jun 2016 18:39:43 +0200

From: Fabio Gerosa 

Subject: New to the Group- Presentation and some questions

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Hi All,
I have recently found this group and decided to subscribe to bring back to use, after more than 20 years, my GRIDCASE 3.

Before annoying all of you, is there an archive of the previous exchanged messaged I can download to try answering most of my questions by myself?


I am looking for external expansion bus pinout to try to adapt a possible HD drive. I guess the bus is a SCSI 1 like this on: http://www.interfacebus.com/SCSI_Differential_A_Cable_Pinout.html <http://www.interfacebus.com/SCSI_Differential_A_Cable_Pinout.html> . Am I correct?
I have the schematics of the internal HD Drive, a 34 pins connectors (I can share if you need it) , but I was not able to understand which kind of interface was implemented: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hard_disk_drive_interface <https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hard_disk_drive_interface>

Any suggestions? I guess it was discussed so many time, so excuse me.

Thanks!

Fabio







Yahoo! Message number: 3076
Date: 08 Jun 2016 18:03:31 -0700

From: robcarnegie@...

Subject: New member, old Grid




 Hello to all, I am a new member but there's nothing new about me  or my Gridcase 1520, which I have owned since 1990. My Grid is in great shape but it has developed the clock and CMOS setting errors that I see are a common issue.  I assume there's a battery in there that needs replacing.

Mine is a 286 and that is cool with me as there aren't too many 286 any things left in working order.  I aged this system in a closet for about 20 years and now that I look at it again, I realize how nice these are compared to the throwaways made today.

Does anyone know the use of the two Rom sockets?  I can't find my owners manual and I didn't see a pdf of it in the file section.

Rob



Yahoo! Message number: 3077
Date: 08 Jun 2016 23:51:49 -0700

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: New member, old Grid

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Hi, Rob,
 
        Welcome to the group. You are correct in that the reason for the clock and CMOS settings disappearing is because the internal CMOS battery has indeed died after 26 years. This is the  most common problem we run into here. As to replacing the battery, that depends on which version of the 1520 you have. If you are lucky, you have a separate Tadaran CMOS battery in the upper right area of the motherboard after you remove the keyboard cover plate, and that is a very easy fix. You can't miss it as it is purple in color and easily distinguishable. The batteries are easily obtainable also. However, chances are good that your version will likely have instead the Dallas 1287A RTC chip on the  board, in which case, you will have some work to do. That is because the CMOS battery is located inside the 1287A RTC chip itself. There are files in the files section that deal with this. On a 1520, I would not recommend trying to replace the 1287A RTC chip, as on some 1520's this locks the computer into an unbreakable loop where it will never boot up. We have figured a way around this here on the forum, but it involves burning new ROM chips for your computer, which can get rather involved. It is recommended instead you replaced the CMOS battery on the 1287A RTC chip with an external one as per the instructions you will find in the files section. 
 

         The two ROM sockets are for 128K ROM's which can hold programs which can be booted from there. The two ROMs essentially function as an extension of the "A" drive, such that if you had two ROM chips inserted, your "A" drive would show 1.69 Mb of capacity, instead of 1.44 Mb. You just have to remember that the extra 256K is unalterable ROM data. Most people use these ROM chips for the OS (usually MSDOS 3.1), to automatically boot the computer, especially if the 1520 is a model that does not have a hard drive. You can store other programs on the ROM's as well, which can be called at any time from the "A" drive.
 

         If you will look on the files section get the PDF list of "Jeriddian's downloadable files". The first listed file is a treatise on how to replace the 1287A RTC chip in a 1530 ( or 1520 in some cases. The procedure is identical for both models). Replacing the chip is not what you want to do, but it will show you how to disassemble the computer, and remove the 1287A chip from the motherboard, so that you can modify the chip with a new battery and then re-solder it back into the motherboard. It will require some unsoldering tools to do this right. There are also a couple of sites that can help you in achieving this. 
 

 http://www.mcamafia.de/mcapage0/dsrework.htm http://www.mcamafia.de/mcapage0/dsrework.htm  
 This is a file that describes the process of attaching and external battery to the 1287A RTC chip. Do not put the battery on top of the chip though.
 

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vltmhi5Thw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vltmhi5Thw
 

 This is a you tube video that shows how to put ion an external battery. Remember that you will have to find some other place in the computer to put the CMOS battery, a coin battery probably being best, and not on top of the chip itself as there is no room for it there due to the keyboard being right on top of the chip.
 

 Hope this helps, Rob. Good luck
 

 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3078
Date: 08 Jun 2016 23:51:54 -0700

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: New to the Group- Presentation and some questions

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Hello, Fabio,
 

         Welcome to the group. To be succinct, the bus is NOT SCSI. SCSI was not invented until well after these computers were designed. In fact, the basic IDE standard itself had not yet been finalized. We are talking about the early 1980's. The HD pin configuration is for a  standard called MFM (modified frequency modulation), a forerunner of IDE. But on top of that, this is in the time when standardization of hard drives universally across the board had not yet been done. In the early to mid '80's, computers had to individually program into their BIOS code all the necessary data for all the hard drives that computer would accept. In other words, the computer was designed to accept only a few hard wired parameter descriptions of a few hard drives, and would not recognize any others. This is the case with the GRID. The only hard drives this computer would accept were the old Conner hard drives, consisting of the CP series. Most of my knowledge is of the 1500 series, not the Gridcase 3, but the Gridcase 3 is the forerunner of the 1500 series, and therefore a little more primitive. It usually ran MSDOS 2.1 if I recall correctly. The problem you are likely going to have is that no modern hard drive will likely even be recognized by the computer at all, due to hard coding of the BIOS. I do not know exactly which hard drives the Gridcase 3 uses, if any, and maybe there are some other members in the forum who can help you with this better than I can, but this is my experience.
         Perhaps you can find a way to connect a hard drive, but I think it would take some major recoding of the BIOS, or a program and hardware like an ADAPTEC SCSI connector to the parallel port (I have one for my 1500's) which can connect a SCSI hard drive as a peripheral, but I think the Gridcase 3 may be too primitive for that. However I am not a programmer, so I can't be sure. I wish you good luck.
 

 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3079
Date: 09 Jun 2016 00:04:19 -0700

From: robcarnegie@...

Subject: Re: New member, old Grid

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Thanks for the information Phil.  It sounds like I will find everything I need to get it sorted out. 

 I actually have a basement full of old computers (most of which I paid new retail prices for) and this is one of the few that isn't working.
 

 People have been saying I horde old computers but now I can just say that I am into "Retro Computing". 




Yahoo! Message number: 3080
Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2016 10:28:37 +0200

From: Fabio Gerosa 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: New to the Group- Presentation and some questionsam

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Bello Phil
Thanks a lot for al the info.
My Gridcase3 came without an internal HD nor any external one.
Regarding the MFM interface for the internal HD, the only dubt I stil have is based on the pinout info I received 30 years ago from Grid ( here below), it do not match at all with the signals described here for MFM:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hard_disk_drive_interface


About the external expansion bus, should I say It is not a SCSI Interface as well?

Thanks!
Regards


Fabio Gerosa

> Il giorno 09/giu/2016, alle ore 08:51, Jeriddian@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@...m> ha scritto:
>
> Hello, Fabio,
>
>         Welcome to the group. To be succinct, the bus is NOT SCSI. SCSI was not invented until well after these computers were designed. In fact, the basic IDE standard itself had not yet been finalized. We are talking about the early 1980's. The HD pin configuration is for a  standard called MFM (modified frequency modulation), a forerunner of IDE. But on top of that, this is in the time when standardization of hard drives universally across the board had not yet been done. In the early to mid '80's, computers had to individually program into their BIOS code all the necessary data for all the hard drives that computer would accept. In other words, the computer was designed to accept only a few hard wired parameter descriptions of a few hard drives, and would not recognize any others. This is the case with the GRID. The only hard drives this computer would accept were the old Conner hard drives, consisting of the CP series. Most of my knowledge is of the 1500 series, not the Gridcase 3, but the Gridcase 3 is the forerunner of the 1500 series, and therefore a little more primitive. It usually ran MSDOS 2.1 if I recall correctly. The problem you are likely going to have is that no modern hard drive will likely even be recognized by the computer at all, due to hard coding of the BIOS. I do not know exactly which hard drives the Gridcase 3 uses, if any, and maybe there are some other members in the forum who can help you with this better than I can, but this is my experience.
>         Perhaps you can find a way to connect a hard drive, but I think it would take some major recoding of the BIOS, or a program and hardware like an ADAPTEC SCSI connector to the parallel port (I have one for my 1500's) which can connect a SCSI hard drive as a peripheral, but I think the Gridcase 3 may be too primitive for that. However I am not a programmer, so I can't be sure. I wish you good luck.
>
> Phil
>





Yahoo! Message number: 3081
Date: 10 Jun 2016 09:00:53 -0700

From: bikebeer2k3@...

Subject: Introduction and Gridcase 1530 questions




Hi Folks,
 

 My name's Julian and I've just acquired a 1530 in pretty clean condition. I'm new to Grids, but not to vintage computers. My collection consists of IBM XT/AT, Amigas (1200, 2000, 3000), Apple IIc, Mac LCII & Motorola Starmax, Tandy 102, HP 200LX, Zenith Supersport 286 portable and an AT&T PC7300 Unix PC (work in progress). I'd been looking for a Grid for a long time and finally came across one for a good price on ebay.
 

 The machine has a dead Dallas battery with the 02 error message. I made a GridDOS 3.3 disk with the tool in the files section and booted it via F1 key. I ran Gridscan and it detected all of the hardware (including a 387 coprocessor!) except for the hard drive.
 

 I disassembled it and found lube all over the Conner CP3044 hard drive (see attached photos). I desoldered the Dallas chip, attached leads for an external CR2032 battery and reinstalled the chip. For testing I also installed the Conner into a PIII machine I keep around - the bios detects the Conner drive but is unable to boot from it. I booted a gparted linux disk to see if it could see the drive/partitions and I see a ton of I/O seek errors from the Linux kernel during boot - so I suspect the drive is shot.
 

 I'm in the process of reassembling it and will test the drive back in the Grid to see if I can get it to work. If I can't, I'll be looking at the BIOS modifications that allow use of other drives. I've read a good bit of the conversations in the group, but I have several questions.
 

 1) Does anyone have a good location (with photos) for the external Dallas battery on a 1530? I've done some test fitting of a surface mount battery holder, wrapped in silicon tape and it looks like it can sit just forward of the keyboard cable connectors.
 

 2) I cracked a small piece off of the left hinge when removing the screen (see photos) - my fault for not following disassembly directions... Any ideas on re-attaching this piece? I suspect superglue won't hold. Maybe epoxy?
 

 3) I can't believe all of the stuff that was on the drive & around it is lube from the hard drive motor. There's SO much of it. It came off pretty easily with 99% isopropyl. Any chance it's some gasket material from between the drive halves? I've never seen a drive lubed like this, even old seagate ST-225 5.25" drives didn't have this much lube.
 

 4) I'm interested in making DOS and maybe application ROMS for the ROM sockets on the motherboard, as well as burning BIOS ROMs myself. I've read over the ROM building guide from the files section and have the rombuild.exe application. Any suggestions / part numbers / sources for the chips and equipment necessary?
 

 5) There's a 1530ROM.zip file in the files section that is labelled as allowing any hard drive. I assume this means any drive under 528MB total size and with the odd placement of the IDE connector like the original conner has, so that it will fit the drive backplane? What drive makes/models are these ROM images configured for? I understand that I can modify the included .BAS program for other drive parameters.
 

 6) Has there been any progress towards a BIOS that would allow a IDE-CF adapter?
 

 That's it for now. Thanks for reading if you've made it this far. I'm sure more questions will come up as I work with this great old computer.
 

 Thanks for any advice!
 

 -Julian
 

 


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Yahoo! Message number: 3082
Date: 10 Jun 2016 10:10:52 -0700

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: Introduction and Gridcase 1530 questions

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Excellent Work, Julian,
 

         Welcome to the group. My particular interest has always bene the 1530's as well, ever since I bought my first one in the mid-1980's when it first came out. Your pictures tell the story well, and I can see both the CPU and the math coprocessor in them. As you noted, the dead CMOS battery would not allow you to see the hard drive. Once you performed the external CMOS battery conversion procedure, your computer will now see the hard drive but cannot read it. As you suspect, the Conner drive is indeed shot, and that is why. That was an unfortunate problem we have in that the old Conner drives very often went bad after time like this and had to be frequently replaced. The leakage of oil is a telltale sign of drive failure. Your only option is to replace the drive. I will address your questions now:
 

 1) Although I have a couple of my machines with replacement external batteries, I have never found a very good place for them myself. This is why I tend to simply replace the 1287A with a new one (when I can). However, the best option may be where the Tadaran battery would normally go. After some time I think GRiD realized that Dallas 1287A RTC was a bother and changed the design to using a Motorola RTC with an external CMOS battery (Actually I am not sure which came first. I could be wrong and the Dallas 1287A design may have come afterward.) This was a Tadaran Lithium-Ion battery which was purple in color and was located in the upper right area of the motherboard, just below the hard drive, and right above the RAM sticks. When GRiD made these changes, they didn't change that area of the circuitry, and so that space where the battery should be located is empty in the 1287A versions. My best success has been to find a way to fix a Tadaran battery there and lead the wires from there to the 1287A. Other than that location, I too have not really found a very successful area to locate a battery, at least until I find a more adaptable battery configuration (maybe a long, thin tube type might be easier to put in the computer?)
 

 2) The hinges for the screen are highly susceptible to breakage and one just has to be careful with them. Usually I have replaced broken ones with good ones from other machines. I have toyed with the idea of making a mold of an intact hinge and try to cast one made of metal, but never actually tried it. As to repairing it, I would recommend epoxy also (JB Weld also comes to mind), and I would recommend thickening up the repair underneath the slide area to give it more strength. It should not interfere much with the passage of the wires there, but I also am not sure about the hinge being able to be installed back into place on the case. However, I am sure you can assess that when you try it. You only other option is to get an intact hinge from a dead machine.
 

 3) Yeah, those old Conner drives leaked pretty good. I can't tell you if there is a gasket between the two parts. Maybe someone else on the forum can tell, but I've never actually taken one of those drives apart to see. I usually just replace them. Original drives can be found, but it is difficult.
 

 4) I think some of the other guys can help you better with the programming of the ROM chips. I've never tried it. Shawn, our administrator could tell you better about that I think. The chips are 128K chips though. That much I do know. Also understand that if you put a ROM chip into the machine, it will become part of the "A" drive as far as the 1530 is concerned. In other words, you will access it through the A: prompt along with any floppy that you put in. The computer just combines the two sources into one volume and augments the capacity of the drive accordingly (1.44 Mb to 1.57 Mb)
 

 5) Shawn and I (I think) are the only ones who have actually done any programming of the BIOS chips and actually burned EPROMS to accept other HD's. CJFord wrote that program, but I have never tried it myself. I always hard coded my changes, as did Shawn, I believe. You could send CJFord a PM about it and see how it works. There are two places in the BIOS you must change to get it to accept a new HD. One location lists the brand and model, and the other lists the hard drive parameters. I think the .exe program takes the basic BIOS BIN files provided, and changes them according to your input to include the new hard drive, then you can burn new BIOS chips. But again, I am not sure as I have never tried it. As to the hard drives themselves, that odd placement of the plugs in the back is a limitation and would have to be considered in replacement. The GRID only accepted six hard drives: CP3022 (half height 20 MB), CP3024 (full height 20 MB), CP3044 (Full height 40 MB), CP3042 (half height 40 MB), CP344 (full height 100 MB), and CP3104 (half height 100 MB). You are correct that the limits of DOS prevent anything more than a 528 MB drive being used fully. There are many Conner drives that used that configuration, not just the CP series that are the only ones standard recognized. Both Shawn and I have adapted a CFS420A to a 1520 and 1530 respectively (420 MB). I have also used a couple of other such Conners, one with 170 MB and another with about 230 MB (I can't remember their model numbers). I have not tried any other brand of hard drive however. I suppose it should work though if you put in a WD or Seagate, but I don't know for sure. You can get a list of all the Conner hard drives from Seagate off the web. If you limit yourself to just the smaller capacity drives under 500 MB, they nearly all have the right pin configuration, though of course you need to check it out to be sure. I should probably have put that list up in the files section at some point, but you can get it easily enough.
 

 6) I don't think anyone has tried to alter the BIOS to accept an IDE-CF adapter. Except possibly for Mike Brutman. none of us here have the programming skills in assembly language to do it. It was fortunate that reprogramming the BIOS for other hard drives was a simple and straight forward process. However, Shawn has been experimenting for some time to try and adapt the bus to accept booting the computer from an external flash drive. However, you will need to talk to him about the specifics. 
 

 Again, Welcome to the group, Julian. I hope this helps you along the way.
 

 Phil

  




Yahoo! Message number: 3083
Date: 11 Jun 2016 16:42:09 -0700

From: bikebeer2k3@...

Subject: Re: Introduction and Gridcase 1530 questions




Thanks for the battery placement idea, that worked great. 

 I seem to have gotten lucky with the hard drive, after I put everything back together, the machine found its hard drive and booted.
 

 I haven't had much time to investigate the software that's on it yet.

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Yahoo! Message number: 3084
Date: Sat, 11 Jun 2016 23:51:24 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Introduction and Gridcase 1530 questions [4 Attachments]

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Very interesting recovery!So, it looks like you have Grid that was used to monitor and control building automation and control.Most commercial buildings communicate via a protocol called MODBUS. That would explain the MODSNOOP selection.
PLC information on Wikipedia here: Programmable logic controller - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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Programmable logic controller - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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And there is an "old school" way of electronically controlling relays. By "old school" I mean 1970's technology. It uses things called "relay ladders" and a bunch of things I do not understand. But it was cutting edge building and factory automation in the 70's and 80's.That looks very cool! :)-Shawn

      From: "bikebeer2k3@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Saturday, June 11, 2016 7:42 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Introduction and Gridcase 1530 questions [4 Attachments]

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Thanks for the battery placement idea, that worked great.
I seem to have gotten lucky with the hard drive, after I put everything back together, the machine found its hard drive and booted.
I haven't had much time to investigate the software that's on it yet.








Yahoo! Message number: 3085
Date: Sun, 12 Jun 2016 01:01:31 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Introduction and Gridcase 1530 questions

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Sorry for not responding sooner.
I have not programmed the ROM chips. I have programmed the EPROMs used for BIOS. But I have not programmed the ROM's that contain the OS.
And yes, it does need to be changed in two places. In addition to those changes, we have not been able to understand the checksum routine. The checksum, itself, is a simple CRC-8 checksum. The problem is, the BIOS EPROM checksum value is does not appear in the EPROM data. Or, if it does appear, it may be encoded as another value. I have never been able to identify the byte locations. As a result, I have had to go to the beginning of the file and manipulate the copyright text in order to get the new checksum to match the original checksum.
Mike Brutman left this list. But he can be contacted on another excellent resource: Vintage Computer Forums. http://www.vcfed.org/forum/forum.php
I think it was suggested, several years ago by another member, that our understanding of the BIOS to IDE controller communication was backwards. The check to see if the drive matches one stored in BIOS was not done for security. It was done because the BIOS, for some reason, needs low-level control of the hard drive. I do not know what that means. However, it explains why if you change the BIOS parameters to match some other hard drive, even if it's below 520 MB, the Grid won't boot. I think Phil and I got *lucky* that the Conner CFS420 drives worked. I think the CFS420 internally thought, "Yeah, OK, I'll work with this controller" and that's why it worked. More and more, I am thinking the changes to the BIOS had little to do with it. Just my theory...and I've been wrong many times.
I had an idea to use 2 Raspberry Pi Zero's and some Python code,  to act as a "man-in-the-middle" to mimic a CP-344. However, it is nothing more than an idea at this point. And, of course, the boot up of the 16 MHz 286, would have to be held off for a minute or more, while the 1 GHz ARM controller boots and catches up. ;-)
I'm no hardware, nor programming expert. So, feel free to post your ideas, comments, or suggestions.Thanks,-Shawn

      From: "Jeriddian@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Friday, June 10, 2016 1:10 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Introduction and Gridcase 1530 questions

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Excellent Work, Julian,
        Welcome to the group. My particular interest has always bene the 1530's as well, ever since I bought my first one in the mid-1980's when it first came out. Your pictures tell the story well, and I can see both the CPU and the math coprocessor in them. As you noted, the dead CMOS battery would not allow you to see the hard drive. Once you performed the external CMOS battery conversion procedure, your computer will now see the hard drive but cannot read it. As you suspect, the Conner drive is indeed shot, and that is why. That was an unfortunate problem we have in that the old Conner drives very often went bad after time like this and had to be frequently replaced. The leakage of oil is a telltale sign of drive failure. Your only option is to replace the drive. I will address your questions now:
1) Although I have a couple of my machines with replacement external batteries, I have never found a very good place for them myself. This is why I tend to simply replace the 1287A with a new one (when I can). However, the best option may be where the Tadaran battery would normally go. After some time I think GRiD realized that Dallas 1287A RTC was a bother and changed the design to using a Motorola RTC with an external CMOS battery (Actually I am not sure which came first. I could be wrong and the Dallas 1287A design may have come afterward.) This was a Tadaran Lithium-Ion battery which was purple in color and was located in the upper right area of the motherboard, just below the hard drive, and right above the RAM sticks. When GRiD made these changes, they didn't change that area of the circuitry, and so that space where the battery should be located is empty in the 1287A versions. My best success has been to find a way to fix a Tadaran battery there and lead the wires from there to the 1287A. Other than that location, I too have not really found a very successful area to locate a battery, at least until I find a more adaptable battery configuration (maybe a long, thin tube type might be easier to put in the computer?)
2) The hinges for the screen are highly susceptible to breakage and one just has to be careful with them. Usually I have replaced broken ones with good ones from other machines. I have toyed with the idea of making a mold of an intact hinge and try to cast one made of metal, but never actually tried it. As to repairing it, I would recommend epoxy also (JB Weld also comes to mind), and I would recommend thickening up the repair underneath the slide area to give it more strength. It should not interfere much with the passage of the wires there, but I also am not sure about the hinge being able to be installed back into place on the case. However, I am sure you can assess that when you try it. You only other option is to get an intact hinge from a dead machine.
3) Yeah, those old Conner drives leaked pretty good. I can't tell you if there is a gasket between the two parts. Maybe someone else on the forum can tell, but I've never actually taken one of those drives apart to see. I usually just replace them. Original drives can be found, but it is difficult.
4) I think some of the other guys can help you better with the programming of the ROM chips. I've never tried it. Shawn, our administrator could tell you better about that I think. The chips are 128K chips though. That much I do know. Also understand that if you put a ROM chip into the machine, it will become part of the "A" drive as far as the 1530 is concerned. In other words, you will access it through the A: prompt along with any floppy that you put in. The computer just combines the two sources into one volume and augments the capacity of the drive accordingly (1.44 Mb to 1.57 Mb)
5) Shawn and I (I think) are the only ones who have actually done any programming of the BIOS chips and actually burned EPROMS to accept other HD's. CJFord wrote that program, but I have never tried it myself. I always hard coded my changes, as did Shawn, I believe. You could send CJFord a PM about it and see how it works. There are two places in the BIOS you must change to get it to accept a new HD. One location lists the brand and model, and the other lists the hard drive parameters. I think the .exe program takes the basic BIOS BIN files provided, and changes them according to your input to include the new hard drive, then you can burn new BIOS chips. But again, I am not sure as I have never tried it. As to the hard drives themselves, that odd placement of the plugs in the back is a limitation and would have to be considered in replacement. The GRID only accepted six hard drives: CP3022 (half height 20 MB), CP3024 (full height 20 MB), CP3044 (Full height 40 MB), CP3042 (half height 40 MB), CP344 (full height 100 MB), and CP3104 (half height 100 MB). You are correct that the limits of DOS prevent anything more than a 528 MB drive being used fully. There are many Conner drives that used that configuration, not just the CP series that are the only ones standard recognized. Both Shawn and I have adapted a CFS420A to a 1520 and 1530 respectively (420 MB). I have also used a couple of other such Conners, one with 170 MB and another with about 230 MB (I can't remember their model numbers). I have not tried any other brand of hard drive however. I suppose it should work though if you put in a WD or Seagate, but I don't know for sure. You can get a list of all the Conner hard drives from Seagate off the web. If you limit yourself to just the smaller capacity drives under 500 MB, they nearly all have the right pin configuration, though of course you need to check it out to be sure. I should probably have put that list up in the files section at some point, but you can get it easily enough.
6) I don't think anyone has tried to alter the BIOS to accept an IDE-CF adapter. Except possibly for Mike Brutman. none of us here have the programming skills in assembly language to do it. It was fortunate that reprogramming the BIOS for other hard drives was a simple and straight forward process. However, Shawn has been experimenting for some time to try and adapt the bus to accept booting the computer from an external flash drive. However, you will need to talk to him about the specifics.
Again, Welcome to the group, Julian. I hope this helps you along the way.
Phil
 








Yahoo! Message number: 3086
Date: 12 Jun 2016 17:16:37 -0700

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: New to the Group- Presentation and some questionsam

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Hi, Fabio,
 

 You are definitely correct in that this is not SCSI. Way too primitive for that. SCSI didn't appear until after 1990 or so. I forgot this was a GRiD 3, therefore it is an old 8 bit machine, running an 8086/8088/Z80 type of processor. As such, the expansion bus likely is not for a hard drive, as most computers of that era didn't even offer one, especially the portables. Therefore it is not MFM at all. Mybad. It is 34 pins, and I initially thought maybe it was for an external floppy drive, but the pins don't seem to match for that. So I don't know what it is for, but I suspect it might be proprietary for some specific external peripheral that GRID made for that unit. GRiD does have a history for that. The 1500' s had such a proprietary 25 pin DB connector for its external peripherals. Past that, I don't know. Good Luck.
 

 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3087
Date: 12 Jun 2016 18:10:00 -0700

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: New to the Group- Presentation and some questions

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Hi, Is it the 50 pin connector,
 The 11xx series used gpib but the drives used sasi I think it's possible that when the did the 12xx gridcase 3 series they might have skiped the gpib and that 50 pin is sasi to connect the 22xx drives 
 Just a thought
 

 

 





Yahoo! Message number: 3088
Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2016 01:37:11 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: New to the Group- Presentation and some questions

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Whoa. In my experience, GPIB is way too slow for hard drive communication or any kinda of sustained high data rate communication. It's usually used to talk to test equipment, or other slow speed peripherals. It is also used to control receivers and transmitters, right Asa? :)-Shawn
      From: "klyball@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2016 9:10 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: New to the Group- Presentation and some questions

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Hi,Is it the 50 pin connector,The 11xx series used gpib but the drives used sasi I think it's possible that when the did the 12xx gridcase 3 series they might have skiped the gpib and that 50 pin is sasi to connect the 22xx drives Just a thought











Yahoo! Message number: 3089
Date: 12 Jun 2016 18:46:53 -0700

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: New to the Group- Presentation and some questions




Correct

They used gpib for floppies and sasi for harddrive

But I would think they just moved to sasi for both for the gridcase 3

When I put my 50pin grid harddrive back together I'll try hooking it up to my gridcase 3

Mind you my 2102 harddrive floppy combo is just gpib and works fine



Yahoo! Message number: 3090
Date: Sun, 12 Jun 2016 20:08:57 -0700

From: Jim Stephens 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: New to the Group- Presentation and some questions

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On 6/12/2016 6:37 PM, Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
> Whoa. In my experience, GPIB is way too slow for hard drive 
> communication or any kinda of sustained high data rate communication. 
Two friends of mine made businesses of adding disks to both the IBM PC 
and to TRS80s in the same timeframe as Grid had the GPIB's out.

They both used GPIB interfaces because of the ease of doing interfaces 
for both the PC and the TRS80 for that device bus.  Not a ball of fire 
but it outran floppies by a lot.  Hard disk performance wasn't an issue.

Neither were bootable devices either, which became an issue for them as 
IBM got their act together and came out with the Xebec controller (and 
later WD) for the XT PC.  The product my friend had for the TRS80 was 
competitive with Radio Shacks products till the product itself sort of 
was relegated to toy status.  At one time Dbase on anything was a 
business product, including on the TRS80 because of the popularity of it 
on previous CPM systems.  Eventually the TRS80 was not interesting for 
that and that was about when my friend folded his business there.

The GRID stuff was always astronomically expensive and I don't know 
anyone who had the funds to play with GRID in those days.  As in either 
personally, or business.  Only in the later 90s did I get some of the 
red screen units which is really all I have.

thanks
Jim





Yahoo! Message number: 3091
Date: Sun, 12 Jun 2016 21:18:10 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: New to the Group- Presentation and some questions




The GRiD used with the AN/TSC-60(V)9 HF comm facility used the RS232C  
serial bus for controlling the HF-80 radios.  Most GPIB stuff I've  
ever been exposed to was with electronic test equipment used in  
production testing of RF radios.  I honestly don't think GPIB would be  
used for hard drives; SCSI yes.

Asa  Jay


Quoting "Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"  
<RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>:

> Whoa. In my experience, GPIB is way too slow for hard drive  
> communication or any kinda of sustained high data rate  
> communication. It's usually used to talk to test equipment, or other  
> slow speed peripherals. It is also used to control receivers and  
> transmitters, right Asa? :)-Shawn
>       From: "klyball@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"  
> <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
>  To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
>  Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2016 9:10 PM
>  Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: New to the Group- Presentation and  
> some questions
>
>
-- 
Asa Jay Laughton - sent from somewhere other than home
******************************************************
http://www.w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com







Yahoo! Message number: 3092
Date: 12 Jun 2016 21:44:45 -0700

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: New to the Group- Presentation and some questions




Most early hp stuff used hpib/gpib for all there drives tape floppy and hard

My grid hard drive is gpib to sasi it has a standard xebec sasi controller in it to gpib 
The other I have has both sasi and gpib inputs

I'll scope out the gridcase 3 connector when I get a chance



Yahoo! Message number: 3093
Date: 12 Jun 2016 21:50:54 -0700

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: New to the Group- Presentation and some questions




Check out the hp drive project I was thinking something like this was a good idea for the compass

I use it with my hp8924c and my hp3000



Yahoo! Message number: 3094
Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2016 14:19:46 +0200

From: Fabio Gerosa 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] New to the Group- Presentation and some questionsam

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Thanks everyone.


For sure the 50 pins expansion bus at the back of GridCase3 is for connecting the following devices: 2200 BaseStation for battery pack recharge, 2201 Disk System and 2202 5 1/4 diskette drive and all are stackable via the 50 pins connector. That’s why I was thinking to SCSI, but more probably diskette drive used a kind of interface and HD dive another one through two set in pins.

Anyone was looking for the original Grid-DOS 2.11 3 1/2 disk? I have it and can clone. Can someone share with me some content to be stored on the 4 EPROM slots?

Thanks again.
regards

Fabio



> Il giorno 13 giu 2016, alle ore 02:16, Jeriddian@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> ha scritto:
>
>
> Hi, Fabio,
>
> You are definitely correct in that this is not SCSI. Way too primitive for that. SCSI didn't appear until after 1990 or so. I forgot this was a GRiD 3, therefore it is an old 8 bit machine, running an 8086/8088/Z80 type of processor. As such, the expansion bus likely is not for a hard drive, as most computers of that era didn't even offer one, especially the portables. Therefore it is not MFM at all. Mybad. It is 34 pins, and I initially thought maybe it was for an external floppy drive, but the pins don't seem to match for that. So I don't know what it is for, but I suspect it might be proprietary for some specific external peripheral that GRID made for that unit. GRiD does have a history for that. The 1500' s had such a proprietary 25 pin DB connector for its external peripherals. Past that, I don't know. Good Luck.
>
> Phil
>
>






Yahoo! Message number: 3095
Date: 28 Jun 2016 10:58:50 -0700

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures

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Hello all
 

 Does anyone know the type of Eprom the Gridcase 1520 takes? Would an M27C4001 sixteen bit rom work? Also what type of hard drive enclosure would be necessary for the Connor hard drives? I have been unsuccessful in low level formatting them in my grid, even following all of the different procedures for debug, FDISK still couldn't find the disk. Would an IDE PATA external hard drive enclosure work?
 

 Thanks
 

 Joshua
 

 





Yahoo! Message number: 3096
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2016 19:30:10 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures

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Joshua,My Grid's are in storage, so I have to do this from memory. But the EPROMs are 8 bit (from memory) 27C64's. They're used in an Odd/Even (or Low/High) byte arrangement. One EPROM holds the lower 8 bits and the other EPROM holds the upper 8 bits to make up the 16 bit word.I think a 16 bit chip *could* work, but it would take running jumpers from the vacant EPROM socket to the populated socket. Additionally, the pinouts would have to be compared to make sure the other control signals end up at the correct pins.I am not sure what you mean by "hard drive enclosure."And no, FDISK/external IDE won't work.We're not 100% sure on the communication exchange. But it appears that the BIOS queries the hard drive to determine the hard drive type.  If the hard drive is not one of the HD's in the EPROMs list, there will not be communication to the HD. It is more than just editing the list and entering the CHS (Cylinder, Head, Sector) information in to the EPROM. We do not know what is preventing communication with other older drives. It seems only a handful of Conner drives are supported.If you have any information, a posting it here would be appreciated. :)Thanks,-Shawn 

      From: "joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2016 1:58 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures

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Hello all
Does anyone know the type of Eprom the Gridcase 1520 takes? Would an M27C4001 sixteen bit rom work? Also what type of hard drive enclosure would be necessary for the Connor hard drives? I have been unsuccessful in low level formatting them in my grid, even following all of the different procedures for debug, FDISK still couldn't find the disk. Would an IDE PATA external hard drive enclosure work?
Thanks
Joshua










Yahoo! Message number: 3097
Date: 28 Jun 2016 12:43:02 -0700

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Thank you for the info.
 I was just wondering if anyone had tried hooking up a Conner hard drive onto a modern PATA to usb converter to format the drive from a modern computer. Those sixteen bit Eproms that I was telling you about fit the actual slots in the front of the 1520, but when I inserted a couple of blank ones just to test, the computer just failed to turn on. I am just a bit frustrated that I can't seem to get anything bigger than a 720 kb floppy onto the Grid. If I even insert my 720kb floppy disk into my modern computer, windows corrupts it. So I used a 1999 Sony with windows 98 to transfer everything, which of course just died.  I also tried a virtual windows 3.1 machine which also failed to read the disks as it has to use the host machines drive. Do you have any advice?
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3098
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2016 20:18:21 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Josh:>I was just wondering if anyone had tried hooking up a Conner hard drive onto a modern PATA to usb converter to format the drive from a modern computer.
I did it a while ago. I think I had to fall back to Win98 machine in order for the drive to be seen by Windows. 
>the computer just failed to turn on.If they're blank, the laptop is just going to sit there and look at you. It can't do anything without a BIOS load. If you saw no lights and it looked dead, my guess is the power supply voltage was shorted. I'm sure the IC pinouts are totally different.
>I am just a bit frustrated that I can't seem to get anything bigger than a 720 kb floppy onto the Grid.My 1520 will read and write 1.44M floppies.If you mean that you can't see a larger hard drive, yeah, I feel your pain. There is a limit due to only having 16 bits. But we've tried using older, non-Conner hard drives, and larger Conners. We can't seem to get past 100 MB Conner drives.
>Do you have any advice?I'm not sure what you're trying to do? Transfer the data off of the floppies? If you have a real floppy drive (vs. a 'fake' USB drive) you might try going to bootdisk.com and downloading an image to boot. Then copy the floppies to a hard drive.I hope that helps,-Shawn      From: "joshuaparkour@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2016 3:43 PM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures

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Thank you for the info.I was just wondering if anyone had tried hooking up a Conner hard drive onto a modern PATA to usb converter to format the drive from a modern computer. Those sixteen bit Eproms that I was telling you about fit the actual slots in the front of the 1520, but when I inserted a couple of blank ones just to test, the computer just failed to turn on. I am just a bit frustrated that I can't seem to get anything bigger than a 720 kb floppy onto the Grid. If I even insert my 720kb floppy disk into my modern computer, windows corrupts it. So I used a 1999 Sony with windows 98 to transfer everything, which of course just died.  I also tried a virtual windows 3.1 machine which also failed to read the disks as it has to use the host machines drive. Do you have any advice?









Yahoo! Message number: 3099
Date: 28 Jun 2016 13:37:02 -0700

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Thank you for the info and your quick response. The computer failed to turn on when I plugged the Eproms I told you about into it. However it turned on when I removed those Eproms. My grid 1520 doesn't read 1.44 mb floppies, could the drive be a different model from yours? The pain is really the problem of the modern computer corrupting the 720kb floppy every time it is inserted. Right now the computer reads the floppy but just sits there with the floppy drive on and not much else happening. I think the disk is corrupt but I have no way to check it without my 1999 Sony. I was just wondering if their was a workaround way to get my modern computer to read a 720kb floppy on an external usb floppy drive.
 

 Thank you for your help.





Yahoo! Message number: 3100
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2016 13:47:13 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures




I have successfully read the 720K floppies from my GRiD in a modern  
computer, without corruption, using an external USB floppy drive.  I  
don't let Windows try to "fix" the floppy because I know there isn't  
anything wrong with it, but as I recall, Windows wants to do something  
to it.  There are different USB floppy drives available like this one:

https://www.amazon.com/Sabrent-External-Floppy-Drive-FL-UDRV/dp/B00E9MD700/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1467146579&sr=8-1&keywords=usb+floppy+drive

I have used this on a Windows 7 64-bit system without a problem.

The floppy drive on the GRiD is just a 720K.  Later floppies and  
drives were able to accept 1.4M and you can tell the difference by the  
number of write-protect windows on the floppy.

A 720K floppy only has ONE write-protect window and a tab that can  
slide back and forth to write-protect the drive.

A 1.4M floppy has TWO windows, only one of which has the write-protect slider.

If all you have are 1.4M floppies with the two windows, you CAN use  
them in your GRiD, and you can get Windows to format them for you as  
720K but Windows will complain.  The easy thing to do is simply tape  
over the extra window on the floppy, then it will appear to be a 720K  
floppy.

I can probably help with floppy questions, but I can't help you out  
with the hard drive.
Asa  Jay


Quoting "joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"  
<RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>:

> Thank you for the info.
>  I was just wondering if anyone had tried hooking up a Conner hard  
> drive onto a modern PATA to usb converter to format the drive from a  
> modern computer. Those sixteen bit Eproms that I was telling you  
> about fit the actual slots in the front of the 1520, but when I  
> inserted a couple of blank ones just to test, the computer just  
> failed to turn on. I am just a bit frustrated that I can't seem to  
> get anything bigger than a 720 kb floppy onto the Grid. If I even  
> insert my 720kb floppy disk into my modern computer, windows  
> corrupts it. So I used a 1999 Sony with windows 98 to transfer  
> everything, which of course just died.  I also tried a virtual  
> windows 3.1 machine which also failed to read the disks as it has to  
> use the host machines drive. Do you have any advice?


-- 
Asa Jay Laughton - sent from somewhere other than home
******************************************************
http://www.w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com







Yahoo! Message number: 3101
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2016 17:02:57 -0400

From: shawn 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Josh,
I have a USB floppy drive. 
Perhaps that might help. If you want to buy one, you might want to see if a local computer store might have one. Of course, there's always ebay and Amazon. If you just gotta have it now, there is always Best Buy. But, of course, the prices are high.
Good luck,
-Shawn

-------- Original message --------
From: "joshuaparkour@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> 
Date:06/28/2016  16:37  (GMT-05:00) 
To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com 
Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures 



Thank you for the info and your quick response. The computer failed to turn on when I plugged the Eproms I told you about into it. However it turned on when I removed those Eproms. My grid 1520 doesn't read 1.44 mb floppies, could the drive be a different model from yours? The pain is really the problem of the modern computer corrupting the 720kb floppy every time it is inserted. Right now the computer reads the floppy but just sits there with the floppy drive on and not much else happening. I think the disk is corrupt but I have no way to check it without my 1999 Sony. I was just wondering if their was a workaround way to get my modern computer to read a 720kb floppy on an external usb floppy drive.

Thank you for your help.






Yahoo! Message number: 3102
Date: 28 Jun 2016 14:08:40 -0700

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures




Thanks
So it is most likely the usb floppy drive that I am using that is at fault? It reads and writes 1.4mb disks fine. My grid just fails to read the 720kb disks that my usb drive writes to.



Yahoo! Message number: 3103
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2016 14:10:44 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures




By the way.

A GRiD 729K drive will "see" a 1.4M floppy as a 720K floppy, NOT a  
1.4M floppy even if it has two windows on it.  Therefore, if you  
format and use a 1.4M floppy in a GRiD as a 720K floppy, then take it  
to your Windows computer, WITHOUT taping shut the extra window on  
floppy case.... Windows will have a fit and that might be your  
problem... just guessing here mind you.

Asa  Jay


Quoting "joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"  
<RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>:

> Thank you for the info and your quick response. The computer failed  
> to turn on when I plugged the Eproms I told you about into it.  
> However it turned on when I removed those Eproms. My grid 1520  
> doesn't read 1.44 mb floppies, could the drive be a different model  
> from yours? The pain is really the problem of the modern computer  
> corrupting the 720kb floppy every time it is inserted. Right now the  
> computer reads the floppy but just sits there with the floppy drive  
> on and not much else happening. I think the disk is corrupt but I  
> have no way to check it without my 1999 Sony. I was just wondering  
> if their was a workaround way to get my modern computer to read a  
> 720kb floppy on an external usb floppy drive.
>
>
>  Thank you for your help.


-- 
Asa Jay Laughton - sent from somewhere other than home
******************************************************
http://www.w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com







Yahoo! Message number: 3104
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2016 21:13:29 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Clarification

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



I made a mistake and I wanted to clarify something.
>>Do you have any advice?>I'm not sure what you're trying to do? Transfer the data off of the floppies? If you have a real floppy drive (vs. a 'fake' USB drive) you might try going to >bootdisk.com and downloading an image to boot. Then copy the floppies to a hard drive.
I wanted to say that if you have a USB floppy drive, and you plug it in to your computer, as Asa Jay pointed out, you should be able to read and write to the floppy disk.There is no need to go to early version of Windows.
Sorry for the confusion,-Shawn




Yahoo! Message number: 3105
Date: 28 Jun 2016 14:15:55 -0700

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures




Whenever I try that I get a disk error until I tape the hole, then I get the same problem that I have been having.



Yahoo! Message number: 3106
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2016 14:21:23 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures




Can you send a quick photo of the floppy you are trying to read?
Can you tell us exactly what operating system you are using (Win 7,  
32-bit as an example)
What brand of external USB/Floppy drive are you using?
Does the drive show up in File Manager?
Can you get a screen capture of any error message?

Post all here and maybe we can help more.
Thank you,
Asa  Jay


Quoting "joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"  
<RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>:

> Whenever I try that I get a disk error until I tape the hole, then I  
> get the same problem that I have been having.


-- 
Asa Jay Laughton - sent from somewhere other than home
******************************************************
http://www.w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com







Yahoo! Message number: 3107
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2016 14:32:00 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures




Sorry... follow up questions...

Does that floppy -work- in the GRiD?
What are you specifically trying to do with the floppy?
Format it for the GRiD?
Read files from it?
Other?

Thanks
Asa  Jay

Quoting "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"  
<RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>:

> Can you send a quick photo of the floppy you are trying to read?
> Can you tell us exactly what operating system you are using (Win 7,
> 32-bit as an example)
> What brand of external USB/Floppy drive are you using?
> Does the drive show up in File Manager?
> Can you get a screen capture of any error message?
>
> Post all here and maybe we can help more.
> Thank you,
> Asa  Jay
>
>
> Quoting "joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"
> <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>:
>
>> Whenever I try that I get a disk error until I tape the hole, then I
>> get the same problem that I have been having.
>
>
> --
> Asa Jay Laughton - sent from somewhere other than home
> ******************************************************
> http://www.w7tsc.org
> http://www.teampanteraracing.com


-- 
Asa Jay Laughton - sent from somewhere other than home
******************************************************
http://www.w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com







Yahoo! Message number: 3108
Date: 28 Jun 2016 14:37:16 -0700

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I am trying to read files from it to boot my grid. The modern computer sees the 720kb floppy but thinks that it is corrupted. When I format it from the modern computer as 720kb via the command prompt and then put it in my grid, I get a disk read error on non bootable disks and with bootable disks the grid just sits their spinning the floppy without booting past bios. I made it bootable with the dos tool in files.



Yahoo! Message number: 3109
Date: 28 Jun 2016 14:41:26 -0700

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



My computer is a 64bit windows 10 shuttle SH-87R6 with a Haswell I7 quad core processor with a DYNEX DX-EF101 external floppy drive.



Yahoo! Message number: 3110
Date: 28 Jun 2016 14:46:27 -0700

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I just retried to make a bootable floppy. I formatted a floppy as 720kb with command prompt on my modern computer. Then I used the tool in the files to make it bootable. I put that disk in my grid and this time I got a disk boot error from my grid as it tried to read the disk.



Yahoo! Message number: 3111
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2016 15:00:36 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures




Good info.  Let me ask more questions.

Will the GRiD boot -without- the floppy in it at all?
Or does it think it needs the floppy for some reason?

If it boots without the floppy, then you can probably use tools on the  
computer to format a floppy inserted after boot.

It's been a few months now, but I don't believe the GRiD will boot a  
floppy disk that has been formatted with boot files from an operating  
system newer than GRiD DOS 3.3 unless it's a newer GRiD that came with  
GRiD DOS 5.0.

In other words, you can't format with boot files on a 720K floppy with  
a modern OS and get it to work in a GRiD.  You'd need to format the  
floppy and copy the boot files for GRiD DOS (I think, it's been a few  
months).

This is why on my GRiD, I use the on-board disk tools to create new  
bootable floppies; I don't recall being able to do it with my Windows  
7 computer.

Is that what you're running into?  If so, then you need a copy of GRiD  
DOS that you can run on a modern computer and use to format floppies  
with boot files.

Asa  Jay



Quoting "joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"  
<RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>:

> I am trying to read files from it to boot my grid. The modern  
> computer sees the 720kb floppy but thinks that it is corrupted. When  
> I format it from the modern computer as 720kb via the command prompt  
> and then put it in my grid, I get a disk read error on non bootable  
> disks and with bootable disks the grid just sits their spinning the  
> floppy without booting past bios. I made it bootable with the dos  
> tool in files.


-- 
Asa Jay Laughton - sent from somewhere other than home
******************************************************
http://www.w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com







Yahoo! Message number: 3112
Date: 28 Jun 2016 15:09:32 -0700

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Thank you!
 That is what I was looking for. My gridcase 1520 will not boot without a bootable floppy. I continually get "disk boot error" trying to boot from the hard disk. I have been able to use windows 98 on my old laptop to create bootable floppys, but that just broke. So the solution would be to boot another computer with dos then create new bootable dos disks from that computer?





Yahoo! Message number: 3113
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2016 15:32:02 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures




Sounds like partial success.  What tool did you use to make the floppy  
bootable?

Asa


Quoting "joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"  
<RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>:

> I just retried to make a bootable floppy. I formatted a floppy as  
> 720kb with command prompt on my modern computer. Then I used the  
> tool in the files to make it bootable. I put that disk in my grid  
> and this time I got a disk boot error from my grid as it tried to  
> read the disk.


-- 
Asa Jay Laughton - sent from somewhere other than home
******************************************************
http://www.w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com







Yahoo! Message number: 3114
Date: 28 Jun 2016 15:33:15 -0700

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



The dos_33 tool in the files. However I can't get anything to boot from it...



Yahoo! Message number: 3115
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2016 15:45:43 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures




Hmmm, I'm not intimately familiar with that tool but I think you're on  
the right track.  If you used to be able to create bootable floppies  
from your Win98 machine, it may be that it's not requiring special  
GRiD DOS.

How did you format them with Win98?
Did you use the GUI File Manager to do it, or did you do it via the  
command line?

If using the command line to format, are you also sending the format  
command with the /S switch telling the OS to put the boot files  
necessary onto the floppy?  CAUTION, I see with Windows 10 (on my  
computer here) that /S has been reassigned to specifying shortname  
support(whatever) so it might not do the system files transfer anymore.

SYS A:  used to write the system files to a floppy to accomplish the  
same thing, but checking on my Windows 10 box I don't see that as  
viable either.

You might also try using the DOS 6.2 thing on this page:
http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/tutorials/create-floppy-boot-disk-in-windows/

Another thought.  Try DOSBox, I'm not sure you can format a floppy  
from it or not, but it might worth a shot.  I can try it later tonight  
after I get home to perhaps help some more.  I can't try it at work  
since I don't have a floppy drive (or floppies) at work anymore.

Asa



Quoting "joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"  
<RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>:

> The dos_33 tool in the files. However I can't get anything to boot from it...


-- 
Asa Jay Laughton - sent from somewhere other than home
******************************************************
http://www.w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com







Yahoo! Message number: 3116
Date: 28 Jun 2016 15:59:26 -0700

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Either the windows 98 GUI or it's command prompt worked fine for formatting floppies. I made them bootable with grid dos 3.3 with a dos program that I downloaded from another website. I will upload that program if I can get my windows 98 sony running again. As for dosbox, it seems to access physical drives through the host system and just froze when I tried to format floppies in 720kb form.



Yahoo! Message number: 3117
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2016 16:04:55 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures




ACK!  That's right... DOSBox is unaware of USB "stuff" so a USB/Floppy  
drive won't be recognized.  Sorry for leading you down that path, my  
mistake.  AND that's why booting another OS, like DOS 5.0 or 3.3 or  
whatever from a CD ROM won't work.... because it won't have drivers to  
recognize the USB/floppy drive.

Complicated isn't it?
I probably have the GRiD DOS 3.x files you need, at home.  I won't be  
there for a couple more hours though.  Someone might have already  
uploaded that to the files area of the Yahoo group too, have you  
checked there?  (I haven't)

Asa


Quoting "joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"  
<RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>:

> Either the windows 98 GUI or it's command prompt worked fine for  
> formatting floppies. I made them bootable with grid dos 3.3 with a  
> dos program that I downloaded from another website. I will upload  
> that program if I can get my windows 98 sony running again. As for  
> dosbox, it seems to access physical drives through the host system  
> and just froze when I tried to format floppies in 720kb form.


-- 
Asa Jay Laughton - sent from somewhere other than home
******************************************************
http://www.w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com







Yahoo! Message number: 3118
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2016 16:10:57 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures




There is a DOS33.EXE file in the file area of the Yahoo group:

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files

It's near the bottom of the list.  It claims to build the bootable  
floppy for you.  You might download that and try it.

Asa


Quoting "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"  
<RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>:

> ACK!  That's right... DOSBox is unaware of USB "stuff" so a USB/Floppy
> drive won't be recognized.  Sorry for leading you down that path, my
> mistake.  AND that's why booting another OS, like DOS 5.0 or 3.3 or
> whatever from a CD ROM won't work.... because it won't have drivers to
> recognize the USB/floppy drive.
>
> Complicated isn't it?
> I probably have the GRiD DOS 3.x files you need, at home.  I won't be
> there for a couple more hours though.  Someone might have already
> uploaded that to the files area of the Yahoo group too, have you
> checked there?  (I haven't)
>
> Asa
>
>
> Quoting "joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"
> <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>:
>
>> Either the windows 98 GUI or it's command prompt worked fine for
>> formatting floppies. I made them bootable with grid dos 3.3 with a
>> dos program that I downloaded from another website. I will upload
>> that program if I can get my windows 98 sony running again. As for
>> dosbox, it seems to access physical drives through the host system
>> and just froze when I tried to format floppies in 720kb form.
>
>
> --
> Asa Jay Laughton - sent from somewhere other than home
> ******************************************************
> http://www.w7tsc.org
> http://www.teampanteraracing.com


-- 
Asa Jay Laughton - sent from somewhere other than home
******************************************************
http://www.w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com







Yahoo! Message number: 3119
Date: 28 Jun 2016 16:21:22 -0700

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures




Thanks, but the file in the files section was the one I was trying to use to make a bootable. It didn't work...
The other program that I used to use was a dos executive that worked perfectly in Windows 98.



Yahoo! Message number: 3120
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2016 16:40:55 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures




Gotcha, I'll see what I can dig up when I get home.
Asa

Quoting "joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"  
<RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>:

> Thanks, but the file in the files section was the one I was trying  
> to use to make a bootable. It didn't work...
> The other program that I used to use was a dos executive that worked  
> perfectly in Windows 98.


-- 
Asa Jay Laughton - sent from somewhere other than home
******************************************************
http://www.w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com







Yahoo! Message number: 3121
Date: 28 Jun 2016 16:56:46 -0700

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



With windows 98, I could use the GUI default or the command line to format floppies. It didn't matter as long as I selected 720kb. I used a dos tool that I downloaded from another website to create bootable GRID DOS floppies. If I can fix my windows 98 Sony, I will post that tool to the group.
 I have been working with dosbox to try to format and it doesn't seem to be working.





Yahoo! Message number: 3122
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2016 19:08:04 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures





  
    
  
  
    Joshua (assuming that's correct),

    I am home now and looking at what I have.

    

    DOSBox won't work to format a floppy in a USB drive as far as I know
    because I don't think DOSBox can actually see the floppy as it hangs
    on a USB port. If you've figured out how DOSbox can see the floppy,
    please let me know, I may have missed something simple and would
    enjoy knowing how to do it.

    

    Alright, so next question. How is the dos33.exe tool failing? On
    my 64-bit system it appear to fail with a message that it can't read
    itself, so my guess is it won't work on a 64-bit system, though I
    may be wrong.

    

    Have you had any success during the time it took me to get home?

    

    The next thing I'm looking to do is create a new bootable disk (if I
    can) and image it and see if I can use a tool to re-image it to
    another floppy.

    

    Hang in there, we'll lick this yet.

    Asa

    

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
& Shelley Marie
Spokane, WA
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 6/28/2016 4:56 PM, joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
    

      
      
          

            
With windows 98, I could use the GUI default or the
              command line to format floppies. It didn't matter as long
              as I selected 720kb. I used a dos tool that I downloaded
              from another website to create bootable GRID DOS floppies.
              If I can fix my windows 98 Sony, I will post that tool to
              the group.

            
I have been working with dosbox to try to format and it
              doesn't seem to be working.
            

          

        
      
      

    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3123
Date: 28 Jun 2016 19:14:47 -0700

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Yes, the way to get dosbox to see the floppy is to select "devices" in the running system menu. Check the host drive floppy. 
 

 When I use the dos 33 tool it says success but when I actually try to boot or view the floppy it shows up as a blank disk.





Yahoo! Message number: 3124
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2016 19:46:29 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures





  
    
  
  
    Is the host drive floppy being addressed as A: in DOSBox?

    When the dos33 app runs, does it look like it's addressing the
    floppy and writing to it?

    Once finished, can you see anything on the floppy via DOSbox?

    

    Now you've got me going. I have to step away for a while for a
    radio net but will be back later to noodle on this some more. I
    have DOSBox installed on my system here and will try to replicate
    what you are experiencing.

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
& Shelley Marie
Spokane, WA
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 6/28/2016 7:14 PM, joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
    

      
      
          

            
Yes, the way to get dosbox to see the floppy is to
              select "devices" in the running system menu. Check the
              host drive floppy. 

            


            

            
When I use the dos 33 tool it says success but when I
              actually try to boot or view the floppy it shows up as a
              blank disk.

            

          

          
      
      
No virus found
        in this message.

        Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

        Version: 2016.0.7640 / Virus Database: 4613/12512 - Release
        Date: 06/28/16

      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3125
Date: 28 Jun 2016 20:13:39 -0700

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures




Yes, the host floppy is a: on my system at least. The app really does look like it is writing to it and that disk appears blank on dosbox and the host computer.



Yahoo! Message number: 3126
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2016 21:58:20 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures


This is part 1 of a multi-part message.





  
    
    
  
  
    Joshua,

    I'm not certain we are talking about the same DOSBox here, so pardon
    my ignorance. Also, at home I'm running a Windows 7 system with the
    DOSBox emulator so it might look different than what you have.

    

    I'm referring to a specific DOS emulator called "DOSBox" that you
    can download and install from this web site:

    https://www.dosbox.com/

    

    When running it, I find that the dos33.exe program can't be run in
    DOS mode, so I think we are talking about two different things here
    unfortunately.

    

    However, I'm not letting it keep me down.

    I don't actually -have- a bootable floppy in my posession, and the
    tools on my GRiD only allow me to format a drive, not actually move
    the system files to it (unfortunately). So I'm having to work out
    something different. It will take me some time but I have some
    ideas.

    

    In the meantime, the best bet may be to get your old Win98 system
    running. I myself still have a hard drive with Win98 on it, but the
    computer I had with the removable drives went kaput a couple years
    ago and I've not built a new system to take it. 

    

    This sounds like something the community needs so I'm up for making
    it happen, but it might take me a few days.

    

    

    ... wait..... 

    Okay, so this is weird.

    I tried a few times to run dos33.exe and it wouldn't work. Now it's
    working... go figure.

    

    Alright, so the floppy HAS files on it. So far so good. Now I'm
    going to use "Floppy Image.exe" to suck an image from it.

    

    Okay, I now have an IMG file. But the Floppy Image.exe program
    won't write to a floppy (apparently) unless it's already formatted.

    

    Now I'm having to format a new 720K disk using a command prompt in
    Windows 7 with the following command:

    

    format a: /FS:FAT /F:720

    

    And it's formatted the disk as a 720K floppy (note the extra window
    in the drive had to be covered)

    

    Now I'm using the Floppy Image.exe program to write the IMG file to
    the newly formatted floppy.

    

    Checking the newly imaged floppy and.... all the files appear to be
    there.

    

    So... I'm attaching a zip file to this email (let me know if it
    comes through), it has the floppy imager program and the img file I
    created. Use the exe to build the image on your floppy.

    

    Note, the floppy must be A:

    Make sure that's the drive letter assigned by the operating system.

    

    That's it for me tonight.... Hopefully this works for you.

    Asa Jay

    

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
& Shelley Marie
Spokane, WA
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 6/28/2016 8:13 PM, joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
    

      
      
          

            
Yes, the host floppy is a: on my system at least. The app
              really does look like it is writing to it and that disk
              appears blank on dosbox and the host computer.
            

          

        

      
      

    
  




This is part 2 of a multi-part message.




Attached application/zip file not shown; stay tuned!






Yahoo! Message number: 3128
Date: 29 Jun 2016 11:57:12 -0700

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I formatted the floppy with your command and then used the tool you provided to write to the floppy. Windows thought that the floppy was corrupt after I had done that. I inserted the disk into my grid and "disk boot error" popped up again.
 

 You were right, I was using a different program than you to try to format my floppies. I was using Virtualbox with DOS 6.11 and Windows 3.1. I don't know why I kept referring to it as "Dosbox"
 

 Thank you for all of your help. It appears the only options left are to either burn Eproms with the operating system, which I will do eventually anyway, or get my old windows 98  computer working again.
 

 Joshua





Yahoo! Message number: 3129
Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2016 13:01:09 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures




I'm sorry you're still having trouble.  At this point I'm not sure  
there is anything else I can offer, except that either the GRiD is  
still trying to boot a hard disk or the floppy drive is bad.  Or the  
Windows system just isn't creating the floppy properly.

On my Win 7 system, it formatted to 720k just fine, then wrote the  
image and then I could read it in the USB/floppy drive just fine,  
seeing all the necessary DOS files on the floppy using Windows File  
Manager (explorer).  If your system thinks it's corrupt after going  
through all that, all I can think is that Windows 10 has some other  
incompatibility, but if it formatted the disk from the command prompt,  
I should think it would work.

You -are- leaving the tape over the extra hole after it's all done, right?

I'm at a loss to explain it.
Asa  Jay


Quoting "joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"  
<RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>:

> I formatted the floppy with your command and then used the tool you  
> provided to write to the floppy. Windows thought that the floppy was  
> corrupt after I had done that. I inserted the disk into my grid and  
> "disk boot error" popped up again.
>
>
>  You were right, I was using a different program than you to try to  
> format my floppies. I was using Virtualbox with DOS 6.11 and Windows  
> 3.1. I don't know why I kept referring to it as "Dosbox"
>
>
>  Thank you for all of your help. It appears the only options left  
> are to either burn Eproms with the operating system, which I will do  
> eventually anyway, or get my old windows 98  computer working again.
>
>
>  Joshua


-- 
Asa Jay Laughton - sent from somewhere other than home
******************************************************
http://www.w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com







Yahoo! Message number: 3130
Date: 01 Jul 2016 08:18:37 -0700

From: wd8cyv@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms and Hard Drive Enclosures

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



noticed some talk about floppy drives
some grids came with 720 some with 1.44 
this can cause some confusion 
dave



Yahoo! Message number: 3131
Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2016 15:44:10 -0400

From: Beau Walker 

Subject: ISO Gridcase 1520 Battery

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



I'm looking for one of these to possibly refurbish.  OR has anyone had any
luck simply making a new one out of sheet metal, cells and connectors?

-- 
Sent from my time machine





Yahoo! Message number: 3132
Date: Tue, 05 Jul 2016 17:45:13 -0400

From: shawn 

Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] ISO Gridcase 1520 Battery

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Beau, I am not aware of anyone making a replacement battery pack. It is possible, I guess. But, I do not know if anyone has done it.
An option, if you have the original battery pack, is to send it to a Ni-Cad batterty referb house.
Good luck,
-Shawn

-------- Original message --------
From: "Beau Walker arrowrunner@gmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> 
Date:07/05/2016  15:44  (GMT-05:00) 
To: rugrid-laptop <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> 
Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] ISO Gridcase 1520 Battery 



I'm looking for one of these to possibly refurbish.  OR has anyone had any luck simply making a new one out of sheet metal, cells and connectors?

-- 
Sent from my time machine






Yahoo! Message number: 3133
Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2016 16:25:25 -0400

From: Beau Walker 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] ISO Gridcase 1520 Battery

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



I do not have a battery pack unfortunately.  Are there any good pics of
them?  Is the inside just a bundle of nicad batteries?

On Tue, Jul 5, 2016 at 5:45 PM, shawn shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] <
RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

>
>
> Beau, I am not aware of anyone making a replacement battery pack. It is
> possible, I guess. But, I do not know if anyone has done it.
> An option, if you have the original battery pack, is to send it to a
> Ni-Cad batterty referb house.
> Good luck,
> -Shawn
>
>
> -------- Original message --------
> From: "Beau Walker arrowrunner@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"
> Date:07/05/2016 15:44 (GMT-05:00)
> To: rugrid-laptop
> Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] ISO Gridcase 1520 Battery
>
> I'm looking for one of these to possibly refurbish.  OR has anyone had any
> luck simply making a new one out of sheet metal, cells and connectors?
>
> --
> Sent from my time machine
>
>
>



--
Sent from my time machine





Yahoo! Message number: 3134
Date: Sun, 10 Jul 2016 18:18:36 +0200

From: "fabio.gerosa206" 

Subject: R: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] ISO Gridcase 1520 Battery




HelloI have refurbished a battery pack for Gridcase 3, yes it is a bundle of 9 Ni-Cd standard battery type SC 1.2V. I found a 2000 mAh on eBay.  There is a capacitor or resistor in series. Here a picture. 



Inviato da smartphone Samsung Galaxy.
-------- Messaggio originale --------Da: "Beau Walker arrowrunner@gmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Data: 08/07/16  22:25  (GMT+01:00) A: rugrid-laptop <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Oggetto: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] ISO Gridcase 1520 Battery 

 



  


    
      
      
      I do not have a battery pack unfortunately.  Are there any good pics of them?  Is the inside just a bundle of nicad batteries?
On Tue, Jul 5, 2016 at 5:45 PM, shawn shawnerz@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:













 

 



  


    
      
      
      Beau, I am not aware of anyone making a replacement battery pack. It is possible, I guess. But, I do not know if anyone has done it.An option, if you have the original battery pack, is to send it to a Ni-Cad batterty referb house.Good luck,-Shawn

-------- Original message --------
From: "Beau Walker arrowrunner@gmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]"  
Date:07/05/2016  15:44  (GMT-05:00) 
To: rugrid-laptop  
Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] ISO Gridcase 1520 Battery 








I'm looking for one of these to possibly refurbish.  OR has anyone had any luck simply making a new one out of sheet metal, cells and connectors?

-- 
Sent from my time machine















    
     

    
    






  









-- 
Sent from my time machine




    
     

    
    



This is part 2 of a multi-part message.




Attached image/jpeg file not shown; stay tuned!





Yahoo! Message number: 3135
Date: Sun, 10 Jul 2016 17:00:45 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: R: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] ISO Gridcase 1520 Battery [1 Attachment]

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Fabio,Thank you very much for the picture.How did you open the pack? Did you use a heat gun, or did you cut it open?
Also, that is is not a capacitor or resistor. It is a thermistor. If the temperature inside the battery gets too hot, it will open. This stops the current flow.  It is assumed that the temperature became too hot by a rapid discharge, a shorted cell(s) pulling too much current from the charger, or some other bad condition. For safety, the thermistor opens. This stops the current flow.  After a few minutes, it will cool and close again. Thanks,-Shawn

      From: "'fabio.gerosa206' fabio.gerosa206@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2016 12:18 PM
 Subject: R: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] ISO Gridcase 1520 Battery [1 Attachment]

<!--#yiv8607762018 #yiv8607762018 .yiv8607762018ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;min-height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv8607762018 div.yiv8607762018ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;min-height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv8607762018 div.yiv8607762018photo-title a, #yiv8607762018 div.yiv8607762018photo-title a:active, #yiv8607762018 div.yiv8607762018photo-title a:hover, #yiv8607762018 div.yiv8607762018photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv8607762018 div.yiv8607762018attach-table div.yiv8607762018attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv8607762018 div.yiv8607762018attach-table div.yiv8607762018attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv8607762018 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv8607762018 div.yiv8607762018ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv8607762018 div.yiv8607762018attach-table div.yiv8607762018attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv8607762018 div.yiv8607762018attach-table div.yiv8607762018attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv8607762018 div.yiv8607762018ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv8607762018 --> [Attachment(s) from fabio.gerosa206 included below]

HelloI have refurbished a battery pack for Gridcase 3, yes it is a bundle of 9 Ni-Cd standard battery type SC 1.2V. I found a 2000 mAh on eBay.  There is a capacitor or resistor in series. Here a picture. 



Inviato da smartphone Samsung Galaxy.
-------- Messaggio originale --------Da: "Beau Walker arrowrunner@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Data: 08/07/16 22:25 (GMT+01:00) A: rugrid-laptop <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Oggetto: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] ISO Gridcase 1520 Battery
   I do not have a battery pack unfortunately.  Are there any good pics of them?  Is the inside just a bundle of nicad batteries?
On Tue, Jul 5, 2016 at 5:45 PM, shawn shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

     Beau, I am not aware of anyone making a replacement battery pack. It is possible, I guess. But, I do not know if anyone has done it.An option, if you have the original battery pack, is to send it to a Ni-Cad batterty referb house.Good luck,-Shawn

-------- Original message --------
From: "Beau Walker arrowrunner@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]"
Date:07/05/2016 15:44 (GMT-05:00)
To: rugrid-laptop
Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] ISO Gridcase 1520 Battery

I'm looking for one of these to possibly refurbish.  OR has anyone had any luck simply making a new one out of sheet metal, cells and connectors?

--
Sent from my time machine




--
Sent from my time machine









Yahoo! Message number: 3136
Date: Sun, 10 Jul 2016 20:13:01 +0200

From: "fabio.gerosa206" 

Subject: R: Re: R: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] ISO Gridcase 1520 Battery




I had to cut to open since it was really well sealed.Yes thermistor correct!Now glued back. I have to polish it.ThanksFabio

Inviato da smartphone Samsung Galaxy.
-------- Messaggio originale --------Da: "Shawnerz shawnerz@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Data: 10/07/16  19:00  (GMT+01:00) A: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com Oggetto: Re: R: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] ISO Gridcase 1520 Battery 

 



  


    
      
      
      Fabio,Thank you very much for the picture.How did you open the pack? Did you use a heat gun, or did you cut it open?
Also, that is is not a capacitor or resistor. It is a thermistor. If the temperature inside the battery gets too hot, it will open. This stops the current flow.  It is assumed that the temperature became too hot by a rapid discharge, a shorted cell(s) pulling too much current from the charger, or some other bad condition. For safety, the thermistor opens. This stops the current flow.  After a few minutes, it will cool and close again. Thanks,-Shawn

       From: "'fabio.gerosa206' fabio.gerosa206@tiscali.it [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com 
 Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2016 12:18 PM
 Subject: R: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] ISO Gridcase 1520 Battery [1 Attachment]
   







        





[Attachment(s) from fabio.gerosa206 included below]







HelloI have refurbished a battery pack for Gridcase 3, yes it is a bundle of 9 Ni-Cd standard battery type SC 1.2V. I found a 2000 mAh on eBay.  There is a capacitor or resistor in series. Here a picture. 



Inviato da smartphone Samsung Galaxy.
-------- Messaggio originale --------Da: "Beau Walker arrowrunner@gmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Data: 08/07/16  22:25  (GMT+01:00) A: rugrid-laptop <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Oggetto: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] ISO Gridcase 1520 Battery 

 



    
      
      
      I do not have a battery pack unfortunately.  Are there any good pics of them?  Is the inside just a bundle of nicad batteries?
On Tue, Jul 5, 2016 at 5:45 PM, shawn shawnerz@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:













 

 



  


    
      
      
      Beau, I am not aware of anyone making a replacement battery pack. It is possible, I guess. But, I do not know if anyone has done it.An option, if you have the original battery pack, is to send it to a Ni-Cad batterty referb house.Good luck,-Shawn

-------- Original message --------
From: "Beau Walker arrowrunner@gmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]"  
Date:07/05/2016  15:44  (GMT-05:00) 
To: rugrid-laptop  
Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] ISO Gridcase 1520 Battery 








I'm looking for one of these to possibly refurbish.  OR has anyone had any luck simply making a new one out of sheet metal, cells and connectors?

-- 
Sent from my time machine















    
     

    
    






  









-- 
Sent from my time machine




    
     

    




















    

    
     

    
    



This is part 2 of a multi-part message.




Attached image/jpeg file not shown; stay tuned!





Yahoo! Message number: 3137
Date: 10 Jul 2016 14:49:20 -0700

From: klyball@...

Subject: grid server manuals

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Hi does anyone have any documentation for the grid server 1701?

Thanks 
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3138
Date: 11 Jul 2016 03:14:35 -0700

From: gerosa_fabio@...

Subject: Gridcase 3 plasma gas display replacement

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Hello,
 I am looking for a replacement for my Gridcase3 broken display (some ICs are dead).
 My guess it is the same for the Compass 1139.
 

 Have you any clue for me? Anyone with a datasheet of the display to try to fix it?
 

 Part number is PD640G200B from NEC.
 I have found some references on the web, such as this one below, but I got no answer back
 

 PD640G200B-Sharp NEC AUO Hitachi KYOCERA lcd panel and touch screen Hmi http://www.yxlcds.com/search/index.html?name=PD640G200B

 
 
 PD640G200B-Sharp NEC AUO Hitachi KYOCERA lcd panel and touch screen Hmi http://www.yxlcds.com/search/index.html?name=PD640G200B Shenzhen Y&X Electronic Co., Ltd are one of the largest LCD sources for many years, we are specialized in supplying LCDs and parts for PDA, Car Monitor, Industrail devices, PSP, GPS, Projector, Scanner, Medical equipment, Video door bell, such as high-tech devices, etc...
 
 
 
 View on www.yxlcds.com http://www.yxlcds.com/search/index.html?name=PD640G200B 
 Preview by Yahoo 
 
 
 

 Thanks 
Fabio
 

 





Yahoo! Message number: 3139
Date: 11 Jul 2016 03:28:52 -0700

From: gerosa_fabio@...

Subject: Re: Grid Donation

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Hello, is still anything for the Gridcase 3 available? 

 Thank you!
 Regards,
 

 Fabio




Yahoo! Message number: 3140
Date: 11 Jul 2016 05:43:04 -0700

From: gerosa_fabio@...

Subject: 3D printed carriers for Molex socket ROM




I have managed 3d printing the carriers which are obsolete and almost impossible to be find.
 If anyone is interested Ican share the model file.
 Attached a picture of the result. I have tested them and working flawless.
 

 Regards,
 Fabio

This is part 2 of a multi-part message.




Attached image/jpeg file not shown; stay tuned!





Yahoo! Message number: 3141
Date: 11 Jul 2016 18:49:33 -0700

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: Gridcase 3 plasma gas display replacement

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Hi, the screen is not the same as a 1139 its a 512x256 EL display
you need a 640 x 200 plasma ,there are some 640 x 400 displays around for the 1520/1530 but i doubt they are compatible plus you would need a different bezel.

keep searching china and ebay for a dead unit, i have that salt water damaged grid 3 but there was not much salvageable other than the case. 

Grant



Yahoo! Message number: 3142
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 02:27:58 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 3D printed carriers for Molex socket ROM [1 Attachment]

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Great work, Fabio! :)-Shawn

      From: "gerosa_fabio@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Monday, July 11, 2016 8:43 AM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 3D printed carriers for Molex socket ROM [1 Attachment]

<!--#yiv7223780329 #yiv7223780329 .yiv7223780329ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;min-height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv7223780329 div.yiv7223780329ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;min-height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv7223780329 div.yiv7223780329photo-title a, #yiv7223780329 div.yiv7223780329photo-title a:active, #yiv7223780329 div.yiv7223780329photo-title a:hover, #yiv7223780329 div.yiv7223780329photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv7223780329 div.yiv7223780329attach-table div.yiv7223780329attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv7223780329 div.yiv7223780329attach-table div.yiv7223780329attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv7223780329 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv7223780329 div.yiv7223780329ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv7223780329 div.yiv7223780329attach-table div.yiv7223780329attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv7223780329 div.yiv7223780329attach-table div.yiv7223780329attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv7223780329 div.yiv7223780329ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv7223780329 --> <!--#yiv7223780329 #yiv7223780329ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv7223780329 #yiv7223780329ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv7223780329 #yiv7223780329ygrp-mkp #yiv7223780329hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv7223780329 #yiv7223780329ygrp-mkp #yiv7223780329ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv7223780329 #yiv7223780329ygrp-mkp .yiv7223780329ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv7223780329 #yiv7223780329ygrp-mkp .yiv7223780329ad p {margin:0;}#yiv7223780329 #yiv7223780329ygrp-mkp .yiv7223780329ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}-->[Attachment(s) from gerosa_fabio@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] included below]

I have managed 3d printing the carriers which are obsolete and almost impossible to be find.If anyone is interested Ican share the model file.Attached a picture of the result. I have tested them and working flawless.
Regards,Fabio








Yahoo! Message number: 3143
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 02:29:13 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Grid Donation

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



I'm sorry. I do not know of any sources for parts.-Shawn

      From: "gerosa_fabio@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Monday, July 11, 2016 6:28 AM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Grid Donation

<!--#yiv9447251469 #yiv9447251469 .yiv9447251469ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;min-height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv9447251469 div.yiv9447251469ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;min-height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv9447251469 div.yiv9447251469photo-title a, #yiv9447251469 div.yiv9447251469photo-title a:active, #yiv9447251469 div.yiv9447251469photo-title a:hover, #yiv9447251469 div.yiv9447251469photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv9447251469 div.yiv9447251469attach-table div.yiv9447251469attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv9447251469 div.yiv9447251469attach-table div.yiv9447251469attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv9447251469 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv9447251469 div.yiv9447251469ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv9447251469 div.yiv9447251469attach-table div.yiv9447251469attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv9447251469 div.yiv9447251469attach-table div.yiv9447251469attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv9447251469 div.yiv9447251469ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv9447251469 --> <!--#yiv9447251469 #yiv9447251469ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv9447251469 #yiv9447251469ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv9447251469 #yiv9447251469ygrp-mkp #yiv9447251469hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv9447251469 #yiv9447251469ygrp-mkp #yiv9447251469ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv9447251469 #yiv9447251469ygrp-mkp .yiv9447251469ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv9447251469 #yiv9447251469ygrp-mkp .yiv9447251469ad p {margin:0;}#yiv9447251469 #yiv9447251469ygrp-mkp .yiv9447251469ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}-->

Hello, is still anything for the Gridcase 3 available?
Thank you!Regards,
Fabio








Yahoo! Message number: 3144
Date: 18 Jul 2016 20:17:39 -0700

From: jim.leamer@...

Subject: Gridcase3 for sale

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



About a year ago I bought a Gridcase3 and was hoping to restore it.  I joined this group and enjoyed watching the conversations...I am old enough to understand some of the technical talk from the good old days. 

But I realized that the Grid project was not getting any attention and that probably wouldn't change.  So I listed it on EBay.  I am sorry, but I should have mentioned it here first.  It would be great if someone from this group could get it and make it fully operational.

Jim
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3145
Date: 22 Jul 2016 12:57:12 -0700

From: athan.dejong@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 3D printed carriers for Molex socket ROM [1 Attachment]

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



HI

Nice work :)

it would be really great if you share the file ...

Regards,
athan




Yahoo! Message number: 3146
Date: Sun, 24 Jul 2016 06:39:06 +0000 (UTC)

From: Gene Dawson 

Subject: Re: Gridcase3 for sale

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Didn't see it listed or sold..What kind of attention did you need?  I'm sure someone here could help steer you in the right direction..






Yahoo! Message number: 3147
Date: Sun, 24 Jul 2016 08:29:45 -0400

From: Jim Leamer 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Gridcase3 for sale

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Gene,

I just don't have the time right now.  I think it just needs an power
adapter and boot disk.

The EBay listing ends tonight and here is the link.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Gridcase3-Computer-/232017149974?hash=item36054cc016:g:CUUAAOSwARZXjDTg

Thanks for the offer to help.

Jim

On Sun, Jul 24, 2016 at 2:39 AM, Gene Dawson bigbrassring@...
[RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

>
>
> Didn't see it listed or sold..
> What kind of attention did you need?  I'm sure someone here could help
> steer you in the right direction..
>
>
>





Yahoo! Message number: 3148
Date: Sun, 24 Jul 2016 14:50:22 +0200

From: "fabio.gerosa206" 

Subject: R: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Gridcase3 for sale

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Hello JimCan you PLEASE incudes Italy to the shipping address?Please.Thank youRegardsFabio


Inviato da smartphone Samsung Galaxy.
-------- Messaggio originale --------Da: "Jim Leamer jim.leamer@gmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Data: 24/07/16  14:29  (GMT+01:00) A: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com Oggetto: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Gridcase3 for sale 

 



  


    
      
      
      Gene,

I just don't have the time right now.  I think it just needs an power adapter and boot disk.

The EBay listing ends tonight and here is the link.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Gridcase3-Computer-/232017149974?hash=item36054cc016:g:CUUAAOSwARZXjDTg

Thanks for the offer to help.

Jim

On Sun, Jul 24, 2016 at 2:39 AM, Gene Dawson bigbrassring@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:













 

 



  


    
      
      
      Didn't see it listed or sold..What kind of attention did you need?  I'm sure someone here could help steer you in the right direction..



    
     

    
    






  










    
     

    
    






Yahoo! Message number: 3149
Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2016 03:07:52 +0000 (UTC)

From: Gene Dawson 

Subject: Re: Gridcase3 for sale

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Drats, I missed the grid3 auction by an hour. 
Well, Congrats to the new owner.  The soft bag - if it's original - that's a hard to find.Good luck, and get 'er done.  There's never enough time, is there?  :)
Regards, Gene





Yahoo! Message number: 3150
Date: Sun, 24 Jul 2016 23:51:36 -0400

From: Jim Leamer 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Gridcase3 for sale

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Sorry about that.  I should have given more notice.

I hate to ruin your day, but the carrying bag was original.  It went for
$102.  Is that what you would have expected?

Jim

On Sun, Jul 24, 2016 at 11:07 PM, Gene Dawson bigbrassring@...
[RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

>
>
> Drats, I missed the grid3 auction by an hour.
> Well, Congrats to the new owner.  The soft bag - if it's original - that's
> a hard to find.
> Good luck, and get 'er done.  There's never enough time, is there?  :)
>
> Regards, Gene
>
>
>





Yahoo! Message number: 3151
Date: Tue, 26 Jul 2016 20:23:12 +0200

From: "fabio.gerosa206" 

Subject: R: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 3D printed carriers for Molex socket ROM

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Hello AthanHere is the STL file ready to be 3D printed. My suggestion is print in ABS since the PLA is very weak.Let me know and see your results.Cheers,Fabio


Inviato da smartphone Samsung Galaxy.
-------- Messaggio originale --------Da: "athan.dejong@yahoo.fr [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Data: 22/07/16  21:57  (GMT+01:00) A: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com Oggetto: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 3D printed carriers for Molex socket ROM 

 



  


    
      
      
      HI

Nice work :)

it would be really great if you share the file ...

Regards,
athan


    
     

    
    






Yahoo! Message number: 3152
Date: 29 Jul 2016 10:59:02 -0700

From: bigbrassring@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Gridcase3 for sale

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Hi Jim,
Well, maybe what I might expect I guess.  I'd guess it didn't have a hard drive, but that could have been resolved, tho not an easy task.  I was working on faking an SSD replacement, but that wouldn't be original, would it?  Nor a power supply as I understood, also resolvable  (I have about 20 of them).  The bag, yeah - those would be hard to come by but it sounds as if it was well worn.  Of course, that also means someone loved the computer a lot.  

Yeah, sorry I missed the auction.  On to bigger projects for you, and here's hoping you get what you're looking for most. :)

Best Regards, Gene



Yahoo! Message number: 3153
Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2016 16:28:03 -0400

From: Jim Leamer 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Gridcase3 for sale

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Gene,

Thanks for your note.  I just hope the guy who got it keeps it somewhere
near original.  He lives in the Bay area and I hope he gets in touch with
this group

Thanks again

Jim

On Fri, Jul 29, 2016 at 1:59 PM, bigbrassring@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] <
RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

>
>
> Hi Jim,
> Well, maybe what I might expect I guess.  I'd guess it didn't have a hard
> drive, but that could have been resolved, tho not an easy task.  I was
> working on faking an SSD replacement, but that wouldn't be original, would
> it?  Nor a power supply as I understood, also resolvable  (I have about 20
> of them).  The bag, yeah - those would be hard to come by but it sounds as
> if it was well worn.  Of course, that also means someone loved the computer
> a lot.
>
> Yeah, sorry I missed the auction.  On to bigger projects for you, and
> here's hoping you get what you're looking for most. :)
>
> Best Regards, Gene
>
>





Yahoo! Message number: 3154
Date: 05 Aug 2016 15:59:54 -0700

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Eproms

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Would this eprom work in my gridcase 1520?
 It says that the are an M27C64A eprom but it only has 28 pins.
 My gridcase has a similar layout of pins but has 32 holes for them, not 28.
 

 http://www.ebay.com/itm/10PCS-M27C64A-10F1-M27C64A-IC-EPROM-UV-64KBIT-100NS-28CDIP-NEW-GOOD-QUALITY-/291548993048?hash=item43e1ac9618:g:IwQAAOSwU9xUMJFy http://www.ebay.com/itm/10PCS-M27C64A-10F1-M27C64A-IC-EPROM-UV-64KBIT-100NS-28CDIP-NEW-GOOD-QUALITY-/291548993048?hash=item43e1ac9618:g:IwQAAOSwU9xUMJFy
 

 Thank you guys for all of your help.
 

 I managed the get the floppy issue fixed by managing to get my old Sony running again.





Yahoo! Message number: 3155
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2016 09:21:04 +0200

From: "fabio.gerosa206" 

Subject: R: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms

text/plain; charset=utf-8



HiIn my GridCase3 I installed four M27C512. They are 64 KB each.M27C64 may works but are only 8KB.Both are 28 pins


Inviato da smartphone Samsung Galaxy.
-------- Messaggio originale --------Da: "joshuaparkour@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Data: 06/08/16  00:59  (GMT+01:00) A: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com Oggetto: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Eproms 

 



  


    
      
      
      Would this eprom work in my gridcase 1520?It says that the are an M27C64A eprom but it only has 28 pins.My gridcase has a similar layout of pins but has 32 holes for them, not 28.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/10PCS-M27C64A-10F1-M27C64A-IC-EPROM-UV-64KBIT-100NS-28CDIP-NEW-GOOD-QUALITY-/291548993048?hash=item43e1ac9618:g:IwQAAOSwU9xUMJFy
Thank you guys for all of your help.
I managed the get the floppy issue fixed by managing to get my old Sony running again.


    
     

    
    






Yahoo! Message number: 3156
Date: 06 Aug 2016 20:00:40 -0700

From: touchetek@...

Subject: GRiD on Chronicals

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



The Computer Chronicles - Tandy/Radio Shack Computers (1991) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sb5JGdKOHlA 
 
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sb5JGdKOHlA 
 
 The Computer Chronicles - Tandy/Radio Shack Compu... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sb5JGdKOHlA Special thanks to archive.org for hosting these episodes. Downloads of all these episodes and more can be found at: http://archive.org/details/computerchroni...
 
 
 
 View on www.youtube.com https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sb5JGdKOHlA 
 Preview by Yahoo 
 
 
 

GRiD towards the end.





Yahoo! Message number: 3157
Date: 06 Aug 2016 08:33:56 -0700

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: Eproms

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



The 1500 series GRiD's use 32 pin chips which are 128Kb chips. The 64 Kb 28 pin chips cannot be used, and trying to use 8Kb chips would probably be nonproductive. 

 Phil




Yahoo! Message number: 3158
Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2016 03:29:54 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GRiD on Chronicals

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Thanks for posting. I finally got around to watching this episode.I wonder how that Sharp/Apple/PocketMac partnership worked out? LOLAnd, of course, Grid eventually did integrate the 386SX in to the 1550. I have 1 or 2 1550SX's.And thanks Datastorm. Where would I be without ProcommPlus? Oh yeah, I'd have several hours per day of my life back during the 90's. I spent a lot of time on BBS-es. ;-)
Thanks again for posting. :)-Shawn

      From: "touchetek@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Saturday, August 6, 2016 11:00 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GRiD on Chronicals

<!--#yiv1961888964 #yiv1961888964 .yiv1961888964ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;min-height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv1961888964 div.yiv1961888964ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;min-height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv1961888964 div.yiv1961888964photo-title a, #yiv1961888964 div.yiv1961888964photo-title a:active, #yiv1961888964 div.yiv1961888964photo-title a:hover, #yiv1961888964 div.yiv1961888964photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv1961888964 div.yiv1961888964attach-table div.yiv1961888964attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv1961888964 div.yiv1961888964attach-table div.yiv1961888964attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv1961888964 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv1961888964 div.yiv1961888964ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv1961888964 div.yiv1961888964attach-table div.yiv1961888964attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv1961888964 div.yiv1961888964attach-table div.yiv1961888964attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv1961888964 div.yiv1961888964ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv1961888964 --> <!--#yiv1961888964 #yiv1961888964ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv1961888964 #yiv1961888964ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv1961888964 #yiv1961888964ygrp-mkp #yiv1961888964hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv1961888964 #yiv1961888964ygrp-mkp #yiv1961888964ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv1961888964 #yiv1961888964ygrp-mkp .yiv1961888964ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv1961888964 #yiv1961888964ygrp-mkp .yiv1961888964ad p {margin:0;}#yiv1961888964 #yiv1961888964ygrp-mkp .yiv1961888964ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}-->

The Computer Chronicles - Tandy/Radio Shack Computers (1991)
|    |
|    |        |    |       The Computer Chronicles - Tandy/Radio Shack Compu...  Special thanks to archive.org for hosting these episodes. Downloads of all these episodes and more can be found at: http://archive.org/details/computerchroni...    |    |
|      View on www.youtube.com         |    Preview by Yahoo    |
|    |



GRiD towards the end.









Yahoo! Message number: 3159
Date: 05 Aug 2016 19:58:50 -0700

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: Eproms




Hi, Joshua,

I'm sorry,  but no, those chips won't work. Those are 64Kb chips, and the sockets are designed for 128Kb chips. That's why there are four more pins that are required, I think. They should be 32 pin chips.

Sincerely,

Phil



Yahoo! Message number: 3160
Date: 09 Aug 2016 11:38:04 -0700

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: Eproms




I'm pretty sure they take both 28 and 32 pin chips



Yahoo! Message number: 3161
Date: 09 Aug 2016 21:31:49 -0700

From: shawnerz@...

Subject: Re: Eproms

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Josh, Are you trying to use these EPROMS for the BIOS (internal to the Grid), or for the operating system (U25/U26 under the lid by the keyboard)?
 For the operating system, they should work. But if you're going to use them for the BIOS, they won't fit.
 Good luck,
 -Shawn




Yahoo! Message number: 3162
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2016 04:49:11 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] (unknown)

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Anthan,I will use Google translate because I do not speak French. The results in French will probably be very funny. :) Here goes:
Tout d'abord, je tiens à présenter mes excuses. Je nettoyais les anciens emails et je l'ai vu celui-ci. Je ne me souviens pas si je répondu. Je suppose que je ne réponds pas parce que je supprime généralement des e-mails que je répondre.Je ne suis pas au courant des disques de données nécessaires pour faire fonctionner le logiciel CODES. Votre e-mail est la première fois que je l'ai entendu dire que le severice postal américain utilisé les ordinateurs de la grille.J'ai utilisé Google pour rechercher "système de côte porteur de ville» et trouvé ceci: https://www.uspsoig.gov/sites/default/files/document-library-files/2015/hr-ma-15-001.pdfBien sûr, il est en anglais. Pardon.Si # 3 être «DOIS» et non pas «ODIS»?Je serais intéressé à copier les EPROM de démarrage. Je peux fournir mon adresse si vous êtes prêt à les envoyer.Bonne chance à toi. Encore une fois, je regrette de ne pas répondre plus tôt.
Original text:First, I want to apologize. I was cleaning out old emails and I saw this one. I do not remember if I responded. My guess is I did not respond because I usually delete emails that I respond to.I am not aware of the data disks needed to operate the CODES software. Your email is the first time I have heard that the US postal severice used Grid computers.I used Google to search "city carrier coast system" and found this: https://www.uspsoig.gov/sites/default/files/document-library-files/2015/hr-ma-15-001.pdfOf course, it is in English. Sorry.Should #3 be 'DOIS" and not 'ODIS"?I would be interested in copying the boot EPROMs. I can provide my address if you are willing to send them.Good luck to you. Again, I apologize for not responding sooner.-Shawn

      From: Athan DE JONG <athan.dejong@yahoo.fr>
 To: "rugrid-laptop@yahoogroups.com" <rugrid-laptop@yahoogroups.com> 
 Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2014 7:49 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] (unknown)

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HI everybody

My name is athan,I Collect vintage computers for years now most of them are commodors & apples.
I always dreamed about having a grid an finaly managed to get one.
Now that i'm the happy owner of a gridcase 3 and need some help to get it work.

When i start the grid on the Eprom placed in the external rom socket a program called "CODES (United stats postal service)" starts up.
A 3 pages menu shows up :
1 IOCS
2RPW
3ODIS
4 city carrier coast system ......

But i do not own the floppys containig this softs. May be someone out there can help with some disk IMG ?

Any way i am happy to be here in the group, and hope to share some vintage computing hours :)
 
To the moderator:  thank you for approving my request to join the group.

Kind regards , athan




 




Yahoo! Message number: 3163
Date: 23 Aug 2016 11:44:23 -0700

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: Eproms

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I was trying to use them for the OS, so those 28 pin chips would work?
 
Yes under the lid by the keyboard.





Yahoo! Message number: 3164
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2016 19:46:47 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Eproms

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Josh,
I believe they will work. I've never burned any EPROMs for those sockets. As they say in car commercials, "You mileage may vary."You can always try it out and see what happens. :)Be sure you let us know how it goes.
Thanks,
-Shawn

      From: "joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2016 2:44 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Eproms

<!--#yiv3911078791 #yiv3911078791 .yiv3911078791ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;min-height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv3911078791 div.yiv3911078791ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;min-height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv3911078791 div.yiv3911078791photo-title a, #yiv3911078791 div.yiv3911078791photo-title a:active, #yiv3911078791 div.yiv3911078791photo-title a:hover, #yiv3911078791 div.yiv3911078791photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv3911078791 div.yiv3911078791attach-table div.yiv3911078791attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv3911078791 div.yiv3911078791attach-table div.yiv3911078791attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv3911078791 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv3911078791 div.yiv3911078791ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv3911078791 div.yiv3911078791attach-table div.yiv3911078791attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv3911078791 div.yiv3911078791attach-table div.yiv3911078791attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv3911078791 div.yiv3911078791ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv3911078791 --> <!--#yiv3911078791 #yiv3911078791ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv3911078791 #yiv3911078791ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv3911078791 #yiv3911078791ygrp-mkp #yiv3911078791hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv3911078791 #yiv3911078791ygrp-mkp #yiv3911078791ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv3911078791 #yiv3911078791ygrp-mkp .yiv3911078791ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv3911078791 #yiv3911078791ygrp-mkp .yiv3911078791ad p {margin:0;}#yiv3911078791 #yiv3911078791ygrp-mkp .yiv3911078791ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}-->

I was trying to use them for the OS, so those 28 pin chips would work?
Yes under the lid by the keyboard.









Yahoo! Message number: 3165
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2016 23:34:50 -0700

From: Jack Fischer 

Subject: Membership

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Hey. How do I join and see things?  It says Welcome but everytime i go to
look - it says i'm not a member. Help!





Yahoo! Message number: 3166
Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2016 07:09:49 -0400

From: shawn 

Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Membership

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Hello Jack and welcome to the group.
I'm not sure what you're seeing and why you're seeing it. But, you are a member of the group and you did successfully send an email to everyone. Welcome.
-Shawn

-------- Original message --------
From: "Jack Fischer jackmav3rik@gmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> 
Date:08/24/2016  02:34  (GMT-05:00) 
To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com 
Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Membership 



Hey. How do I join and see things?  It says Welcome but everytime i go to look - it says i'm not a member. Help!






Yahoo! Message number: 3167
Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2016 23:19:31 +0000 (UTC)

From: Ian Finder 

Subject: Looking to buy any GRiD in any condition except LCD-based.

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



All plasma, and EL welcome for my purpose, and willing to attempt repair.Please let me know if you have one.
I also have a 1520 plasma screen, so if you have a 1520 with a broken display that is perfect.






Yahoo! Message number: 3168
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2016 01:41:41 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: 1 MB SIPP Placement?

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



All,I found some 1 MB, 30 pin SIPP's on eBay. I brought 4 of them. Actually, I was impressed that they were cheap and there were two or 3 sellers.They arrived and I put them in to my 1520. My 1520 beeps the 1-3-3 error code on power up.I put the original 256 kb SIPP's in to the 1520, and everything is fine.
Using the 1MB SIPPs, I tried locating them in different memory sockets. But, I could never make the 1520 boot with 1 MB SIPPs.It is possible that the SIPPs are defective. Or, there is something other performance issue that is keeping them from working. The service manual says the 1520 will accept 1 MB SIPPs. But I can't find where it lists which slots they must go in to.Does anyone run their Grid with 1 MB SIPPs? If so, which slots are they installed in?Thanks,-Shawn 




Yahoo! Message number: 3169
Date: 28 Aug 2016 19:11:52 -0700

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: 1 MB SIPP Placement?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



HI, Shawn,

The usual placement for the RAM SIPP's when you only have four of them has been slots 1-3-5-7. That's what has worked for me. However, I also remember vaguely another order which might work  was 1-2-5-6 or 1-4-5-8. I think that they might have worked, but that was a very long time ago, Really, for the most part, it has been always been .1-3-5-7. Have you checked the timing on those RAM chips. I think the slowest that the computer will accept is 80 ns, and 70 ns works best.

Phil



Yahoo! Message number: 3170
Date: 28 Aug 2016 19:19:09 -0700

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Eproms

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Josh,

If you wish to burn EPROMS, as I have on several occasions, I use the 28 pin TI 27C128 chips or their equivalent for burning new BIOS chips . These chips have 128K of memory.  I have never burned chips for the OS for the sockets under the keyboard lid, so I do not know that these would work there. I have my doubts simply as those sockets are 32 pin.

Phil



Yahoo! Message number: 3171
Date: 28 Aug 2016 19:20:43 -0700

From: jws@...

Subject: Re: 1 MB SIPP Placement?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Good point from Phil, had meant to send this but caught Phil's reply too.

I would do a reverse engineering job on the parts you got.  There has to be dozens of pinouts for such parts out there, and heaven knows what yours came out of.
 
 If you can run the original parts start with just traceing ras and cas on both your original parts (and their chips), and the new ones.  And of course the power.
 
 Hopefully you didn't connect anything on the 1mb parts to anything dangerous, and nothing bad was reflected back into your 1520 mother board on a damaging line, so you are good with that, but you never know about hooking +5 to the wrong line as far as what may have been done to the 1mb parts.
 
 If that all checks out, I'd go with bad parts myself.  There is a lot of room for problems though WRT the pinouts of the parts.  Back 15 or 20 years ago I'd figure you would get good parts, but would be interested in what reference your vendor used to give you Grid parts, unless they show you the Grid system they pulled them from, or show you a reference.  (As far as the grid system is concerned).



Yahoo! Message number: 3172
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2016 05:59:38 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: 1 MB SIPP Placement?

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Well, Phil...You helped me out. But you also generated more questions for me.According to what I found with Google, the Hitachi HB56A19A-7A 1 MB 30 pin SIPP RAM modules are 70 or 80 nS. I couldn't find an actual Hitachi datasheet, so I cannot be 100% sure. But, according to page 59 of the Hardware Service Course Part 2, the Grid can operate with RAM as slow as 120 nS. So, I think I'm good on the speed specification. Many thanks to you for scanning and posting the documents in the Files section!! :)
1MB RAM in the following slots gave me the following results:1, 5 = 512k1, 2, 5, 6 = 1 MB1, 4, 5, 8 = 512 k
Every other combination gives me the 1, 3, 3 beep sequence.
I have 8, 256k SIPPs that all work and MS-DOS sees all 2 MB.
The Service Course documents make mention of a 256K and a 1 MB RAM controller being between the address bus and the RAM. Is this a software entity or hardware device? Are there DIP switches or something?
The other question is: with 1 MB SIPPs, what are the valid memory configurations? It looks to be 512k, 1 MB, and possibly 8 MB. I wonder if with 1 MB SIPPs, all 8 slots have to be filled.I guess I'll have to find 4 more and do more experimenting. :)-Shawn
P.S. JWS: Could I have shorted out the 5V? Yes. But, sometimes you just gotta try things! :)       From: "Jeriddian@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2016 10:11 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: 1 MB SIPP Placement?

#yiv6161406559 #yiv6161406559 -- #yiv6161406559 .yiv6161406559ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;min-height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv6161406559 div.yiv6161406559ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;min-height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv6161406559 div.yiv6161406559photo-title a, #yiv6161406559 div.yiv6161406559photo-title a:active, #yiv6161406559 div.yiv6161406559photo-title a:hover, #yiv6161406559 div.yiv6161406559photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv6161406559 div.yiv6161406559attach-table div.yiv6161406559attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv6161406559 div.yiv6161406559attach-table div.yiv6161406559attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv6161406559 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv6161406559 div.yiv6161406559ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv6161406559 div.yiv6161406559attach-table div.yiv6161406559attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv6161406559 div.yiv6161406559attach-table div.yiv6161406559attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv6161406559 div.yiv6161406559ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv6161406559 #yiv6161406559 #yiv6161406559 #yiv6161406559 --#yiv6161406559ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv6161406559 #yiv6161406559ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv6161406559 #yiv6161406559ygrp-mkp #yiv6161406559hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv6161406559 #yiv6161406559ygrp-mkp #yiv6161406559ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv6161406559 #yiv6161406559ygrp-mkp .yiv6161406559ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv6161406559 #yiv6161406559ygrp-mkp .yiv6161406559ad p {margin:0;}#yiv6161406559 #yiv6161406559ygrp-mkp .yiv6161406559ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}#yiv6161406559

HI, Shawn,

The usual placement for the RAM SIPP's when you only have four of them has been slots 1-3-5-7. That's what has worked for me. However, I also remember vaguely another order which might work  was 1-2-5-6 or 1-4-5-8. I think that they might have worked, but that was a very long time ago, Really, for the most part, it has been always been .1-3-5-7. Have you checked the timing on those RAM chips. I think the slowest that the computer will accept is 80 ns, and 70 ns works best.

Phil








Yahoo! Message number: 3173
Date: 08 Sep 2016 23:18:20 -0700

From: ianfinder@...

Subject: Re: GRiDMAN

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Do you have an image of this and your other compass disks you'd be willing to share?



Yahoo! Message number: 3174
Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2016 01:59:49 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRiDMAN

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Ian,I don't know who the message was intended for. I do not have the image for the Compass model.Thanks,-Shawn

      From: "ianfinder@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Friday, September 9, 2016 2:18 AM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRiDMAN

<!--#yiv2016366049 #yiv2016366049 .yiv2016366049ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;min-height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv2016366049 div.yiv2016366049ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;min-height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv2016366049 div.yiv2016366049photo-title a, #yiv2016366049 div.yiv2016366049photo-title a:active, #yiv2016366049 div.yiv2016366049photo-title a:hover, #yiv2016366049 div.yiv2016366049photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv2016366049 div.yiv2016366049attach-table div.yiv2016366049attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv2016366049 div.yiv2016366049attach-table div.yiv2016366049attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv2016366049 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv2016366049 div.yiv2016366049ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv2016366049 div.yiv2016366049attach-table div.yiv2016366049attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv2016366049 div.yiv2016366049attach-table div.yiv2016366049attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv2016366049 div.yiv2016366049ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv2016366049 --> <!--#yiv2016366049 #yiv2016366049ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv2016366049 #yiv2016366049ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv2016366049 #yiv2016366049ygrp-mkp #yiv2016366049hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv2016366049 #yiv2016366049ygrp-mkp #yiv2016366049ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv2016366049 #yiv2016366049ygrp-mkp .yiv2016366049ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv2016366049 #yiv2016366049ygrp-mkp .yiv2016366049ad p {margin:0;}#yiv2016366049 #yiv2016366049ygrp-mkp .yiv2016366049ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}-->

Do you have an image of this and your other compass disks you'd be willing to share?








Yahoo! Message number: 3175
Date: 10 Sep 2016 12:21:09 -0700

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: GRiDMAN

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



i have not archived the disk's as of yet,but is on my todo list , 

you guys will be the first to know when there done



Yahoo! Message number: 3176
Date: 10 Sep 2016 13:24:05 -0700

From: klyball@...

Subject: Gridserver

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I have recently started working on restoring a GRiD Server 1701, and Compass Central 2701 external hard drive
after rebuilding both the power supplies i have found serveral issues that need to be resolved 

1701 com-server board not being recognized by system
1701 diagnostic board seems fine
1701 file-server board seems fine

here is the big one. the harddrive in 2701 is bad, it has head failure and its not the logic boards. the heads have not crashed or  stuck to the platters .3 of the 4 heads are electrically dead. 
i assume there is a special version of the grid os is on this drive as trying to boot compass dos or grid os from floppy  is a no go, 

i know it's a long shot to find this os or even any documentation.

Ideas anyone?

Cheers
Grant
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3177
Date: 10 Sep 2016 17:06:59 -0700

From: nw@...

Subject: Re: Gridserver

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I can't help, never seen one of these up close. Any chance of pictures as you work through the restoration?  

 Aside from pictures that have appeared on eBay and a few websites I've seen very little about these as pictures or how they worked, features offered etc.
 

 

 





Yahoo! Message number: 3178
Date: 11 Sep 2016 13:28:16 -0700

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /UA571C.rar
  Uploaded by : klyball <klyball@...>
  Description : Aliens Sentry Software Compass 1139 0nly version


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/UA571C.rar


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


klyball <klyball@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3179
Date: 11 Sep 2016 13:33:44 -0700

From: klyball@...

Subject: Aliens Sentry Software

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I have uploaded my Aliens Sentry software, it runs only on a compass 1139 under Dos. The screens and fonts were done buy pixel counting from screenshots from the  movie and should be close to 100% screen accurate as the movie prop was a 1139.




 





Yahoo! Message number: 3180
Date: Sun, 11 Sep 2016 13:40:21 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop





  
    
  
  
    Oooo, I'd really enjoy that to put on one of the GRiDCases that I
    have. What would it take?

    

    (personal trivia)

    I was deployed to March AFB in California when Aliens first came
    out. We went to see it at the cinema in Riverside. It was the
    full-cut, not the watered down version most people ended up seeing
    shortly after. It was weird for many years when people told me
    about the special edition that was released and had all these never
    before scenes. Except... I'd already seen them, and in the theater
    too.

    Asa Jay

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
& Shelley Marie
Spokane, WA
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 9/11/2016 1:28 PM, RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com wrote:
    

      
      
          

            


              Hello,

              

              This email message is a notification to let you know that

              a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the
              RuGRiD-Laptop

              group.

              

              File : /UA571C.rar

              Uploaded by : klyball 

              Description : Aliens Sentry Software Compass 1139 0nly
              version

              

              You can access this file at the URL:

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/UA571C.rar

              

              To learn more about file sharing for your group, please
              visit:

https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398

              

              Regards,

              

              klyball 

            

          

          
      
      
No virus found
        in this message.

        Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

        Version: 2016.0.7752 / Virus Database: 4649/12995 - Release
        Date: 09/11/16

      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3181
Date: Sun, 11 Sep 2016 23:13:49 -0400

From: shawn 

Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Aliens Sentry Software

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Great work, Grant!
Excellent job! I had considered doing something like this in C but realised it was above my skill level.  Glad to see you completed the job! :-)
-Shawn

-------- Original message --------
From: "klyball@hotmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> 
Date:09/11/2016  16:33  (GMT-05:00) 
To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com 
Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Aliens Sentry Software 



I have uploaded my Aliens Sentry software, it runs only on a compass 1139 under Dos. The screens and fonts were done buy pixel counting from screenshots from the  movie and should be close to 100% screen accurate as the movie prop was a 1139.












Yahoo! Message number: 3182
Date: 11 Sep 2016 20:54:55 -0700

From: klyball@...

Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Aliens Sentry Software

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I did a rough version in pascal on a 1520 but it was way to slow, so I wrote it in asm right on the 1139



Yahoo! Message number: 3183
Date: 11 Sep 2016 21:06:47 -0700

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Being a amateur programmer converting it from the 1139 to a 1520 is not easy for me as the 1139 is more like a vga screen where as the 15xx series is cga ,and I'm not really sure how to effectively display it on the screen,
 I ran my code through a formula I wrote but it adds too many cycles and it runs to slow . but it does run fine on any dos box with vga with a little modification . to run it on a gridcase3 would need a total rewrite as its resolution is 400x200 pixels and the 1139 is 512x256.





Yahoo! Message number: 3184
Date: Sun, 9 Oct 2016 17:23:49 -0400

From: Justin 

Subject: GridCase 1520 repair questions





Yahoo! Message number: 3185
Date: Sun, 9 Oct 2016 22:25:14 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GridCase 1520 repair questions

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Justin,It sounds like your hard drive has died.For what you say, it sounds like the drive is spinning, but there is a head failure of some sort. Usually, the seals around the platter erode and the lubricant leaks out. If you disassemble the Grid, you might have an oily residue on the bottom of the Grid. This is common for a computer of this age.
Having said this, you can also get this same error message and failure with a bad Dallas 1287 Real Time Clock (RTC). It's internal battery is long since dead. It requires minor surgery to fix. You can look at YouTube videos for the procedure.
In the mean time, try this: Power up the 1520 for about 20 minutes. Then hit ctrl-alt-del to reboot and see if you get an error message. You probably will. But it would be curious to know if the failure persists.
Also, if you put a DOS formated boot disk in the floppy drive, the Grid should boot to MS-DOS (or Gridos in you have that disk).
Good luck and let us know how things turn out.Thanks,-Shawn
      From: "Justin shadow@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com 
 Sent: Sunday, October 9, 2016 5:23 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GridCase 1520 repair questions

I was just gifted a 1520 and am trying to get it working again.  It boots and posts, completes its memory check, and then displays an error message for invalid configuration information; code: 02.  It then says f1 to continue, but F1 has no discernible effect.  I can hear the internal hard drive spin up, and it seems like it might be seeking the floppy drive when I hit F1, or at least it is occasionally probing the mechanism as the upper disk drive light will turn on and I can hear the mechanism move.  I believe this is the red screen/tempest model but aside from having a Compass 25 years ago that I unfortunately trashed, I know very little about these machines so I’m up for any pointers in resurrecting this thing.

Thanks,

Justin






Yahoo! Message number: 3186
Date: Sun, 9 Oct 2016 19:09:55 -0400

From: Justin 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GridCase 1520 repair questions





Yahoo! Message number: 3187
Date: Sun, 9 Oct 2016 23:20:00 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GridCase 1520 repair questions

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Justin,In the Files section of the Group, there are disassembly and service instructions for the 1500 series. They are here: https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files
We have wanted to modify the BIOS to accept/allow a CF boot. We have made some small steps of progress, but no real gains. We don't have a 100% clear understanding of the interaction at boot between the hard drive and the BIOS.We could figure it out. But we just haven't made a directed effort at disassembling the BIOS code and sitting down with a logic analyzer to see what's going on.
To get to the BIOS download and copy conf1520.exe located here: https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/Grid1520files/15xxunzp/
It is all command line. type conf1520.exe /? to see the list of commands. It is very basic.Good luck,-Shawn
      From: "Justin shadow@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Sunday, October 9, 2016 7:09 PM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GridCase 1520 repair questions

Ok, I actually accidentally managed to try your 20 minutes powered on suggestion.  The error message persists and the machine smells like hell now - like burnt/leaking capacitors.  I stuck an old MS-DOS 6.22 install disk I had into it and it booted onto it.  After a few seconds I remembered that FDISK existed, and it does not detect a fixed disk.  I’d forgotten Conner was even a hard drive brand, though many moons ago when the earth was young I had a Conner 40MB drive…

So clearly I need to disassemble this thing beyond just popping the rear clamshell, clean it up, probably replace some caps.  Is there a disassembly or service manual online somewhere?  I’m sure I can muddle through it but if there is a good order of disassembly or a scanned factory manual then so much the better.  What I’ve found online indicates that is normally easy disassembly unless you have the tempest model with extra metal shielding in the back.  Not knowing what the normal one looks like on the inside, and seeing a solid cage over the ports and perforated cage over the drives I’m kind of guessing that this is one of those.

What options are there for replacing the hard drive?  I’ve used SCSI2SD in older Macs, and I’ve heard that there are solutions for replacing an old MFM drive with a CF card, but my quick Googling found ISA cards rather than something I could drop into a drive bay.

Is there a way to access the CMOS settings during boot, or do I need to burn the GRiDDOS disk to a floppy and boot from that?  I noticed that the thing starts up with numlock engaged which is somewhat weird.  I guess if the DS1287 is dead it might not matter.  The DS1287 hack I was kind of expecting, though I see there are supposedly new replacements from China on eBay and there are new production DS12887+ modules on Digikey.

Thanks,

Justin

> On Oct 9, 2016, at 18:25, Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>
>
> Justin,
> It sounds like your hard drive has died.
> For what you say, it sounds like the drive is spinning, but there is a head failure of some sort. Usually, the seals around the platter erode and the lubricant leaks out. If you disassemble the Grid, you might have an oily residue on the bottom of the Grid. This is common for a computer of this age.
>
> Having said this, you can also get this same error message and failure with a bad Dallas 1287 Real Time Clock (RTC). It's internal battery is long since dead. It requires minor surgery to fix. You can look at YouTube videos for the procedure.
>
> In the mean time, try this: Power up the 1520 for about 20 minutes. Then hit ctrl-alt-del to reboot and see if you get an error message. You probably will. But it would be curious to know if the failure persists.
>
> Also, if you put a DOS formated boot disk in the floppy drive, the Grid should boot to MS-DOS (or Gridos in you have that disk).
>
> Good luck and let us know how things turn out.
> Thanks,
> -Shawn
>
> From: "Justin shadow@darksideresearch.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
> To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Sunday, October 9, 2016 5:23 PM
> Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GridCase 1520 repair questions
>
> I was just gifted a 1520 and am trying to get it working again.  It boots and posts, completes its memory check, and then displays an error message for invalid configuration information; code: 02.  It then says f1 to continue, but F1 has no discernible effect.  I can hear the internal hard drive spin up, and it seems like it might be seeking the floppy drive when I hit F1, or at least it is occasionally probing the mechanism as the upper disk drive light will turn on and I can hear the mechanism move.  I believe this is the red screen/tempest model but aside from having a Compass 25 years ago that I unfortunately trashed, I know very little about these machines so I’m up for any pointers in resurrecting this thing.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Justin
> 
>
>







Yahoo! Message number: 3188
Date: 09 Oct 2016 17:44:44 -0700

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GridCase 1520 repair questions

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Justin,
 

 Before you do anything more, remember that until the CMOS battery is good on the computer, the computer cannot recognize the hard drive. It requires a good CMOS battery. Your HD may still be good, but the computer will not see it until the CMOS battery is replaced. That's what the invalidation configuration code 02 means, that the CMOS battery is dead. You should replace the CMOS battery first and then see if the computer recognizes the HD. If you are lucky and do not have the Dallas RTC chip (some 1520's come that way), all you have to do is replace the Tadiran CMOS Battery underneath the keyboard bezel at the upper right hand corner, an easy thing to do. However, if you have a Dallas RTC chip on the motherboard, you will be required to disassemble the computer and do the procedure to replace the battery on that chip. As Shawn has noted, there are files on the forum that will tell you how to do this. In addition, please look at my file list on the forum and you will find links to instructions on assembling and disassembling the computer. But you should do this first and see if the computer will finally see the HD with a good CMOS battery. You can still boot from a floppy disk without the CMOS battery, but you'll never get the computer to see the HD until that CMOS battery is replaced.
 

 Good Luck
 

 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3189
Date: 10 Oct 2016 13:53:21 -0700

From: wd8cyv@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GridCase 1520 repair questions

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



the new 1287 chip does not fix the problem there is a code in the original chip that is only in it so you have to fire up the installed chip   or you have dead meat
 

 never put a password in a 1520   no one supports the password of the day any more 
 so if you loose control and loose the password there is no reset
 years ago  about 15 i made image of a custom install
 of dos 6 and 6.22   load that then disk 4 shuts off all the bad stuff in the load  
 never leave smart drive running it spends tooo much time sorting stuff and makes computer
 slow and dumb if done proper 3.1 windows will run but need more of the very rare sipps memory
 dave  wd8cyv at yahoo dot com 
 questions welcome but i have not had one fired up in 12 years so i may not know any answers..
 dave




Yahoo! Message number: 3190
Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 01:00:26 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GridCase 1520 repair questions

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Thanks for the reminder, Phil.I got my steps out of order. Thanks for setting it straight. :)-Shawn

      From: "Jeriddian@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Sunday, October 9, 2016 8:44 PM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GridCase 1520 repair questions

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Justin,
Before you do anything more, remember that until the CMOS battery is good on the computer, the computer cannot recognize the hard drive. It requires a good CMOS battery. Your HD may still be good, but the computer will not see it until the CMOS battery is replaced. That's what the invalidation configuration code 02 means, that the CMOS battery is dead. You should replace the CMOS battery first and then see if the computer recognizes the HD. If you are lucky and do not have the Dallas RTC chip (some 1520's come that way), all you have to do is replace the Tadiran CMOS Battery underneath the keyboard bezel at the upper right hand corner, an easy thing to do. However, if you have a Dallas RTC chip on the motherboard, you will be required to disassemble the computer and do the procedure to replace the battery on that chip. As Shawn has noted, there are files on the forum that will tell you how to do this. In addition, please look at my file list on the forum and you will find links to instructions on assembling and disassembling the computer. But you should do this first and see if the computer will finally see the HD with a good CMOS battery. You can still boot from a floppy disk without the CMOS battery, but you'll never get the computer to see the HD until that CMOS battery is replaced.
Good Luck
Phil









Yahoo! Message number: 3191
Date: 10 Oct 2016 20:24:35 -0700

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GridCase 1520 repair questions

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



You are right, Dave.
 

 Justin, the Dallas RTC 1287A chip in the 1520 cannot be replaced as it will lock the computer into an endless rebooting cycle where it would ask for a password it has no way of accepting as the BIOS has no code to process a password (at least that is what I think has happened). You end up in an infinite loop that never boots the computer. So it is best to carefully extract the old Dallas RTC 1287A chip from the motherboard. See my instruction file on doing this which is: 
 

 www.omnipulsemedia.com/GRiD_files/Removing and Replacing the 1287A RTC Timing Chip.pdf.
 

 Once out, you can follow the directions in disconnecting the old embedded battery, which is easily demonstrated on the follow you tube link:
 

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vltmhi5Thw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vltmhi5Thw
 

 This little video shows how to use a dremel tool to get to the pins involved inside the chip. However, on the 1520, since the 1287A lies directly underneath the keyboard, there is no room at all, so it is best to simply solder wires to the leads to pins and lay them to the battery in a different location on the computer, not place the battery on top of the chip as this video portrays. I recommend using the space where they normally would have put the Tadiran CMOS battery at the upper right part of the motherboard near the RAM and right in front of the HD, and place the battery there. 
 

 However, if for some reason, the old 1287A chip becomes unusable, and you have no choice but to put in a new chip, there is a work around, as I did get a modification of the BIOS which allows you to bypass the password requirement. This would require, however, burning some new EPROM BIOS chips for the computer and replacing the original chips with them. 
 

 Hope this helps.
 

 Phil
 

 





Yahoo! Message number: 3192
Date: 13 Oct 2016 06:37:42 -0700

From: lescovez@...

Subject: John Ellenby, co-founder of GRiD Systems, Dies at 75

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



John Ellenby, co-founder of GRiD Systems, Dies at 75 
 http://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/27/technology/john-ellenby-visionary-who-helped-create-early-laptop-dies-at-75.html






 John Ellenby, Visionary Who Helped Create Early Laptop, Dies at 75 http://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/27/technology/john-ellenby-visionary-who-helped-create-early-laptop-dies-at-75.html?_r=0

 
 
 http://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/27/technology/john-ellenby-visionary-who-helped-create-early-laptop-dies-at-75.html?_r=0 
 
 John Ellenby, Visionary Who Helped Create Early Laptop,... http://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/27/technology/john-ellenby-visionary-who-helped-create-early-laptop-dies-at-75.html?_r=0 Mr. Ellenby founded Grid Systems, where the Compass was produced. It went on to become a tool for big corporations, government spies, White House official...
 
 
 
 View on www.nytimes.com http://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/27/technology/john-ellenby-visionary-who-helped-create-early-laptop-dies-at-75.html?_r=0 
 Preview by Yahoo 
 
 
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3193
Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2016 01:41:59 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] John Ellenby, co-founder of GRiD Systems, Dies at 75

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Yuri,Thank you very much for posting this article. It is great to know the history of our wonderful computers.
I was first introduced to Grid's as a member of the White House Communications Agency (1988-1994). So, I can say that this line: "[Admiral Poindexter]...would also spend his free time using the Compass to reprogram the IBM electronic mail system that the White House employed..." is, shall we say, a stretch of the truth.
Grid's were used, on the road outside of DC, as dumb terminals. They were usually connected to a modem, or digital switch, via their serial port. Most were configured at VT100's or 3270 terminals connected to a mainframe back in DC. I seem to remember VM/360 was the mainframe OS. It ran IBM's PROFS (Professional Office System). There was a separate, secure (encrypted) system called S/PROFS (Secure PROFS) that supported end to end encryption for those who needed it. It was mostly used for email. So, to say that he "reprogrammed" the electronic mail system is a bit misleading. I'm sure he was just checking his secure email. But, what do I know? I was a radio guy. I did radio stuff-not computer stuff. The computer guys and gals had their own headaches. :)
Thanks again for posting,-Shawn
      From: "lescovez@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2016 9:37 AM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] John Ellenby, co-founder of GRiD Systems, Dies at 75

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John Ellenby, co-founder of GRiD Systems, Dies at 75 John Ellenby, Visionary Who Helped Create Early Laptop, Dies at 75

|    |
|    |        |    |       John Ellenby, Visionary Who Helped Create Early Laptop,...  Mr. Ellenby founded Grid Systems, where the Compass was produced. It went on to become a tool for big corporations, government spies, White House official...    |    |
|      View on www.nytimes.com      |    Preview by Yahoo    |
|    |











Yahoo! Message number: 3194
Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2016 03:38:37 +0000 (UTC)

From: =?UTF-8?B?0K7RgNC40Lkg0JvQtdGB0LrQvtCy0LXRhg==?= 

Subject: =?UTF-8?Q?=D0=9E=D1=82=D0=B2:_[RuGRiD-Laptop]_John_Ellenby,_c?= =?UTF-8?Q?o-founder_of_GRiD_Systems,_Dies_at_75?=

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Shawn, you've worked in the White House?

Yuri    пятница, 14 октября 2016 6:42 "Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> писал(а):


     Yuri,Thank you very much for posting this article. It is great to know the history of our wonderful computers.
I was first introduced to Grid's as a member of the White House Communications Agency (1988-1994). So, I can say that this line: "[Admiral Poindexter]...would also spend his free time using the Compass to reprogram the IBM electronic mail system that the White House employed..." is, shall we say, a stretch of the truth.
Grid's were used, on the road outside of DC, as dumb terminals. They were usually connected to a modem, or digital switch, via their serial port. Most were configured at VT100's or 3270 terminals connected to a mainframe back in DC. I seem to remember VM/360 was the mainframe OS. It ran IBM's PROFS (Professional Office System). There was a separate, secure (encrypted) system called S/PROFS (Secure PROFS) that supported end to end encryption for those who needed it. It was mostly used for email. So, to say that he "reprogrammed" the electronic mail system is a bit misleading. I'm sure he was just checking his secure email. But, what do I know? I was a radio guy. I did radio stuff-not computer stuff. The computer guys and gals had their own headaches. :)
Thanks again for posting,-Shawn
      From: "lescovez@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2016 9:37 AM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] John Ellenby, co-founder of GRiD Systems, Dies at 75



John Ellenby, co-founder of GRiD Systems, Dies at 75 John Ellenby, Visionary Who Helped Create Early Laptop, Dies at 75

|    |
|    |        |    |       John Ellenby, Visionary Who Helped Create Early Laptop,...  Mr. Ellenby founded Grid Systems, where the Compass was produced. It went on to become a tool for big corporations, government spies, White House official...    |    |
|      View on www.nytimes.com      |    Preview by Yahoo    |
|    |






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Yahoo! Message number: 3195
Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2016 03:46:03 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: =?UTF-8?Q?Re:_=D0=9E=D1=82=D0=B2:_[RuGRiD-Laptop]_John_Ellenby,?= =?UTF-8?Q?_co-founder_of_GRiD_Systems,_Dies_at_75?=

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



No. I was just 1 of many people who supported the White House.-Shawn

      From: "Юрий Лесковец lescovez@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: "RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2016 11:38 PM
 Subject: Отв: [RuGRiD-Laptop] John Ellenby, co-founder of GRiD Systems, Dies at 75

#yiv3076135527 #yiv3076135527 -- #yiv3076135527 .yiv3076135527ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv3076135527 div.yiv3076135527ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv3076135527 div.yiv3076135527photo-title a, #yiv3076135527 div.yiv3076135527photo-title a:active, #yiv3076135527 div.yiv3076135527photo-title a:hover, #yiv3076135527 div.yiv3076135527photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv3076135527 div.yiv3076135527attach-table div.yiv3076135527attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv3076135527 div.yiv3076135527attach-table div.yiv3076135527attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv3076135527 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv3076135527 div.yiv3076135527ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv3076135527 div.yiv3076135527attach-table div.yiv3076135527attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv3076135527 div.yiv3076135527attach-table div.yiv3076135527attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv3076135527 div.yiv3076135527ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv3076135527 #yiv3076135527

Shawn, you've worked in the White House?

Yuri    пятница, 14 октября 2016 6:42 "Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> писал(а):


  
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Yahoo! Message number: 3196
Date: 25 Oct 2016 23:00:44 -0700

From: ianfinder@...

Subject: Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Hi folks,
 

 I have some Compass (CCOS) executables and files as loose files on a DOS machine here, and I'd like to copy it to a disk that my non-DOS, CCOS (GRiDos-based) compass can read.
 

 What's the best way to do this? I tried GRiDterm and GRiDvt100 but it appears they can't receive binary files.
 

 I was just going to dial them up and a modem them over.
 

 In conclusion, how do I get loose files between a Compass / CCOS formatted volume on an 11XX grid and a DOS machine or anything else?
 

 Thanks,
 

 - Ian




Yahoo! Message number: 3197
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2016 07:57:25 -0400

From: shawn 

Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass?

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Ian,
I think a program like ProcommPlus would work. You would have to use a null modem cable, but I think it would work.
In fact, any terminal program should work.
Good luck and let us know how it works out.
-Shawn

-------- Original message --------
From: "ianfinder@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> 
Date:10/26/2016  02:00  (GMT-05:00) 
To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com 
Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass? 



Hi folks,



I have some Compass (CCOS) executables and files as loose files on a DOS machine here, and I'd like to copy it to a disk that my non-DOS, CCOS (GRiDos-based) compass can read.



What's the best way to do this? I tried GRiDterm and GRiDvt100 but it appears they can't receive binary files.



I was just going to dial them up and a modem them over.



In conclusion, how do I get loose files between a Compass / CCOS formatted volume on an 11XX grid and a DOS machine or anything else?



Thanks,



- Ian







Yahoo! Message number: 3198
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2016 10:02:48 -0700

From: Ian Finder 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass?

text/plain; charset=utf-8



These are Compass machines, running CCOS natively. They can't run ProComm. And the internal terminal software can't download files.


You can run a hacky MS DOS 2.0 on the compass but as far as I know there is not a way to interchange the files with CCOS

Again, this is not a PC compatible GRiDcase- I'm talking about getting files in and out of an 1101 or similar.

I wish it was as easy as procomm :(




Yahoo! Message number: 3199
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2016 02:15:55 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass?

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Sorry, Ian. I do not know how to write to bubble memory. You don't have the 2101 external drive, right? I guess you don't. If you did, you would be asking about transfers, right?I wish I could help you.-Shawn

      From: "Ian Finder ianfinder@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Wednesday, October 26, 2016 1:02 PM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass?

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| These are Compass machines, running CCOS natively. They can't run ProComm. And the internal terminal software can't download files.


You can run a hacky MS DOS 2.0 on the compass but as far as I know there is not a way to interchange the files with CCOS

Again, this is not a PC compatible GRiDcase- I'm talking about getting files in and out of an 1101 or similar.

I wish it was as easy as procomm :( |







Yahoo! Message number: 3200
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2016 04:39:28 +0000 (UTC)

From: Ian Finder 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass?

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



I have tons of floppy drives for the compass. The compass doesn't read or write DOS formatted floppies, unless it is running MS-DOS. I'm trying to run CCOS / GRiD-OS, so although I have the floppy drive, I have no (known) way to write a CCOS formatted floppy.

    On Wednesday, October 26, 2016 7:16 PM, "Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


     Sorry, Ian. I do not know how to write to bubble memory. You don't have the 2101 external drive, right? I guess you don't. If you did, you would be asking about transfers, right?I wish I could help you.-Shawn

      From: "Ian Finder ianfinder@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Wednesday, October 26, 2016 1:02 PM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass?




| These are Compass machines, running CCOS natively. They can't run ProComm. And the internal terminal software can't download files.


You can run a hacky MS DOS 2.0 on the compass but as far as I know there is not a way to interchange the files with CCOS

Again, this is not a PC compatible GRiDcase- I'm talking about getting files in and out of an 1101 or similar.

I wish it was as easy as procomm :( |


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Yahoo! Message number: 3201
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2016 04:49:18 +0000 (UTC)

From: Ian Finder 

Subject: Restoring a Compass 2101 Floppy & Hard drive - Looking for the CCOS / GRiD OS media: GRiDtransfer / GRiDpartition

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



 Paging mr. Klyball - let's please collaborate on this stuff, as it seems few other people have Compass gear.
Folks, I've been restoring two 2101 disk systems - the hard drive / floppy drive combo for the Compass computers.Unfortunately, the original drives (ST-412s) are broken.
I've replaced the drives with identical drives, and can use them under MS-DOS 2.00 for the compass.I'd like to use them under GRiD OS however.
Reading the MS-DOS manual mentions that to partition / format the drives for GRiD OS, there is a different utility that must be run. Further research indicates that this utility is part of the following media pack:
 35 GRiDTransfer/Partition    21210
So if anyone has a lead on the GridTransfer / Partition media pack for the compass, we need to archive that ASAP.
Anyone with a working 2101 disk system will eventually have the drive die, and without a copy of this, they will be totally dead in the water and unable to format a replacement. (Unless they're content using DOS on a Compass... Eww...)
Honestly, the RuGrid list has done a good job archiving the GRiDcase stuff, but there is a miserable gap on archiving Compass stuff.If we want any record of the compass, and the ability to run meaningful software on them in the future, now is the time to act.
This stuff won't be image-able forever- consider this a plea for anyone with compass floppies to speak up and get them read into something safe and stable.
Thanks,
- Ian
Citations / Compass software lists:
http://www.1000bit.it/ad/bro/grid/GRID-1984-PriceList.pdfGoogle Groups - Grid Stuff

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Google Groups
 Google Groups allows you to create and participate in online forums and email-based groups with a rich experienc...  |  |

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Yahoo! Message number: 3202
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2016 07:50:24 -0400

From: Justin 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Restoring a Compass 2101 Floppy & Hard drive - Looking for the CCOS / GRiD OS media: GRiDtransfer / GRiDpartition





Yahoo! Message number: 3203
Date: 27 Oct 2016 07:55:02 -0700

From: androgenoide@...

Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Some years ago, when the Kermit for DOS page was still being maintained there was a note about a tiny file transfer utility... let me quote it in its entirety;

; To: kermit@columbia.edu 
; Subject: Small ASCII encoded comm program for DOS
; Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2002 16:41:37 -0600 (MDT)
; From: carruth@ece.utah.edu (Brent Carruth)
;
; I have put together ASM code that generates a small ASCII encoded comm
; program for DOS. It may prove useful to others and so I am sending it
; to you for inclusion in the MS-KERMIT software repository. Included below
; is a file which I have named TCOMTXT.ASM. If you need to rename the file,
; then a few lines in the commented source code need to reflect this change.
;
; Brent L. Carruth, Ph.D.
; ----------------------------------------------------------------------
; This program is useful in copying files to a computer using only the
; serial port and starting with only the COPY command.
;
; Use this program to generate TCOM.COM for MS-DOS with the commands:
;
;   TASM TCOMTXT
;   TLINK TCOMTXT /T
;   TCOMTXT > TCOM.COM
;
; The resulting TCOM.COM file is encoded with only printable 7-bit ASCII
; characters. It can be entered as plain text (shown below) and executed.
; TCOM is a 185 byte (with CRLFs) comm program that sets port 1 to 300
; baud and polls it. To set port 2 replace 'ss' with 'ts'. To set 2400 baud
; replace '26' with 'V'. On 25MHz+ computers 2400 baud works fine.
;
; XPHPD[0GG0G,0G51G31GB'(G+(G:u'0g?(G>(GE1G@arwIV_F*=US@<1|_,5wXNg-7muTu(4
; 1m0ss1k260s@3G1g360@3G0i7t2g3A1g350@3G2E1=0C1g350@3T2M0^\1g3>0@3T=1s2g0T
; 1g3;0@3ToN2g391g0t@3G0^F1k0s2?0@3T4
;
;
; The loader and builder portions of this program were written by
; Dan Norstedt, Stockholm, Sweden on 17 Feb 1990 who placed them in the
; public domain. He notes that they may be useful for other programs, too.
;
;
; The source code for the comm program portion of this program was modified
; from a debug listing of the TINYCOMM.COM program shown and explained in an
; article describing it (along with other related matters, including a tiny
; comm program in BASIC) in a 26911-byte file named TINYCOMM.TXT dated 13 Dec
; 1986. Unfortunately, no author is listed in this article. However, the
; author of the article is presumably Charles Petzold because, when assembled
; with debug, the TINYCOMM program described in the article is byte-for-byte
; identical to the first 49 bytes of the 103 byte TINYCOMM program dated
; 1 Jun 1988 from PC-MAG Utilities and the last 54 bytes includes the string
; ' by Charles Petzold - (c) 1988 Ziff Communications Co.'
;
;
; I have changed the source code for TINYCOMM in two trivial, but significant,
; ways related to file transfers. The first is that COM1 is initialized to 300
; baud but may be readily changed to either COM2 and/or 2400 baud. The second
; is that the program exits by pressing Esc. This makes it possible to use
; TCOM to download a file from another computer connected with a fully-wired
; null modem cable with 'TCOM > filename' and pressing Esc when done. I use
; MS-Kermit on the other computer to upload the file with the commands "set
; port 1, set speed 300, set local-echo on, set transmit line-feeds-sent on,
; set transmit prompt \0, transmit filename". To get TCOM on the first
; computer to begin with, carefully type it in using the standard DOS
; 'COPY CON TCOM.COM' command and pressing Ctrl-Z when done. MSBPCG.ASM is
; another program by Dan Norstedt that generates a 557 byte 7-bit ASCII encoded
; program named MSBPCT.COM that decodes standard Kermit bootstrap or "BOO"
; files. The first BOO file downloaded should be a small, reliable file trans-
; fer program. Thus, starting with a DOS boot disk having only the system files
; and COMMAND.COM it is possible to get other files copied to this disk using
; only the serial port and starting with only the DOS 'COPY' command.
;
;
; Brent L. Carruth, Ph.D.
; 9 April 2002

    CODE    SEGMENT PUBLIC

    ASSUME    CS:CODE,DS:CODE

    ORG    100H

START:    JMP    GENCOM

    ORG    100H+72+1    ; Address where loader starts loading

CODARE:

;----------------------- beginning of PROGRAM code area -----------------------

;TCOM.ASM -- assemble with TASM v1.0
;58 byte communications program that polls COM1 at 300 baud.
;Esc key exits. Avoid Ctrl-P.
;Major portions attributable to Charles Petzold.
;
;Brent L. Carruth, Ph.D.
;18 April 2002
;
;CODE    SEGMENT    PARA
;    ASSUME    CS:CODE,DS:CODE
;    ORG    100H

BEGIN:    MOV    DX,0        ; 0 FOR COM1 (1 FOR COM2)
    MOV    AX,43H        ; SET PORT 300,N,8,1 (0A3H FOR 2400,N,8,1)
    INT    14H
TC_1:    MOV    AH,03        ; GET COMM PORT STATUS
    INT    14H
    TEST    AH,01        ; IF NO DATA READY, GO ON
    JZ    TC_2
    MOV    AH,02        ; READ CHARACTER FROM COMM PORT
    INT    14H
    PUSH    DX
    MOV    DL,AL
    MOV    AH,02        ; WRITE TO DISPLAY
    INT    21H
    POP    DX
    JMP    TC_1        ; LOOP AROUND
TC_2:    MOV    AH,0BH        ; CHECK KEYBOARD
    INT    21H
    OR    AL,AL
    JZ    TC_1
    MOV    AH,08        ; IF CHAR, READ IT
    INT    21H
    CMP    AL,1BH        ; IS IT ESC KEY ?
    JZ    QUIT        ; YES, QUIT
    MOV    AH,01        ; NO, SEND TO MODEM
    INT    14H
    JMP    TC_1        ; LOOP AROUND
QUIT:    MOV    AX,4C00H    ; EXIT TO DOS
    INT    21H
;CODE    ENDS
;    END    BEGIN

;-------------------------- end of PROGRAM code area --------------------------

CODEND:

;-- Loader starts here; don't touch unless you REALLY know what's going on --

FIXUP    MACRO    LABL,OFFS,DAT,DA2,DAS
    ORG    $+(OFFS)
LABL    Label    Byte
    IFNB    <DAS>
     IFNB    <DA2>
      DB     (((DAS) OR 65H)-((DAS) AND 65H)) AND 0FFH,0FFH-(DA2)
      ORG     $-1H
     ELSE
      DB     ((DAS)+65H) AND 0FFH
     ENDIF
    ELSE
     DB    0FFH-((DAT) AND 0FFH)
     IFNB    <DA2>
      DB     0FFH-(DA2)
      ORG     $-1H
     ENDIF
    ENDIF
    ORG    $-(OFFS)-1H
    ENDM

FIXBYT    MACRO    ADDR     ; Generate "XOR [BX+ADDR-0FFH],AL" with 8-bit offset
    DB    30H,47H,(Offset ADDR-Offset LOADER+100H)-0FFH
    ENDM

FIXBYH    MACRO    ADDR     ; Generate "XOR [BX+ADDR-0FFH],AH" with 8-bit offset
    DB    30H,67H,(Offset ADDR-Offset LOADER+100H)-0FFH
    ENDM

FIXWRD    MACRO    ADDR     ; Generate "XOR [BX+ADDR-0FFH],AX" with 8-bit offset
    DB    31H,47H,(Offset ADDR-Offset LOADER+100H)-0FFH
    ENDM

FIXSUB    MACRO    ADDR     ; Generate "SUB [BX+ADDR-0FFH],AL" with 8-bit offset
    DB    28H,47H,(Offset ADDR-Offset LOADER+100H)-0FFH
    ENDM

LOADER:    POP    AX
    PUSH    AX
    DEC    AX        ; Load AX with 0FFFFH
    PUSH    AX        ; Now FF FF 00 00 on stack
    INC    SP
    POP    BX        ; Load BX with 00FF
    FIXBYT    XORBXX        ; Fix up end of loader code
    FIXBYT    XORB1
    FIXBYT    XORB2
    FIXWRD    XORW1
    FIXWRD    XORW2
    DAA            ; Load AL with 65H
    FIXSUB    SUBB1
    FIXSUB    SUBB2
    JNZ    J0JMP        ; Break pipeline
J0DST:    FIXBYH    XORB3
    FIXSUB    SUBB3
    FIXSUB    SUBB4
    FIXWRD    XORX1

; FC
    CLD            ; Set LODSB direction
    FIXUP    SUBB1,-1H,,,0FCH
; 8D7749  LEA    SI,[BX+DATA-0FFH] ; Point at 100H+72
    DB    8DH,77H,(Offset DATA-Offset LOADER+100H)-0FFH
    FIXUP    XORB1,-3H,8DH
; 56
    PUSH    SI        ; Copy SI -> DI
; 5F
    POP    DI
; 46
    INC    SI
J2DST:
; 2AC2
    SUB    AL,DL        ; Compute real code/data byte
; AA
    STOSB            ; Save it
    FIXUP    XORW1,-2H,0C2H,0AAH
J1DST:
J3DST:
; AC
    LODSB            ; Get an encoded data byte
    FIXUP    XORB2,-1H,0ACH
; 40
    INC    AX
; 3C31
    CMP    AL,31H        ; Printable and >= '0'?
; 7CFA
    JL    J1DST
J1SRC:    FIXUP    SUBB2,-1H,,,J1DST-J1SRC
; 2C35
    SUB    AL,'4'+1    ; Yes, '0'-'3' (or '4' = exit code) ?
; 77F3
    JA    J2DST        ; No, store with current prefix code
J2SRC:    FIXUP    SUBB3,-1H,,,J2DST-J2SRC
; B102
    MOV    CL,2H
    FIXUP    XORB3,-2H,0B1H
; D2C8
    ROR    AL,CL
    FIXUP    XORX1,-3H,,0D2H,2H
; 92
    XCHG    DX,AX        ; Yes, just save shifted value
    FIXUP    XORW2,-2H,0C8H,92H
; 75EF
    JNZ    J3DST        ; No, contine loop
J3SRC:    FIXUP    SUBB4,-1H,,,J3DST-J3SRC
; 75D7
J0JMP:    JNZ    J0DST        ; (Dummy branch used to clear prefetch queue)
J0SRC:    FIXUP    XORBXX,-1H,J0DST-J0SRC
    DB    34H        ; Skip over next byte (34H = XOR AL,nn opcode)

DATA:    DB    "$"        ; CRLF data to make sure JL J1DST taken first time

GENCOM:    PUSH    CS            ; Allow use without EXE2BIN
    POP    DS
    MOV    DX,Offset LOADER    ; Output LOADER code (!)
    MOV    AH,9H
    INT    21H
    CLD
    MOV    SI,Offset CODARE    ; Pointer to real PROGRAM code
    XOR    BP,BP            ; Reset columns left counter
    MOV    BH,17            ; Assure that BH not in range '0'-'3'
BYTLOP:    MOV    AX,0C01H
    SUB    AL,[SI]            ; Convert PROGRAM code to loader format
    INC    SI
    MOV    CL,2H
    SHL    AX,CL            ; First byte is top 2 bits of byte+43H
    NOT    AL
    SHR    AL,CL            ; Second byte is low 6 bits of -byte-3
    ADD    AL,35H            ; Based value is '5' for second byte
    CMP    AH,BH            ; Same prefix as previous byte?
    MOV    BH,AH
    XCHG    DX,AX
OUTBYT:    XCHG    DH,DL            ; Swap output order
    JZ    OUTNHI            ; Skip unnecessary prefix byte
    DEC    BP
    JG    OUTNCR            ; Not 72 chars on the line yet
    PUSH    DX
    MOV    DX,Offset CRLF        ; 72 chars on line, add CR LF
    MOV    AH,9H
    INT    21H
    MOV    BP,48H            ; Restart line pointer
    POP    DX
OUTNCR:    MOV    AH,2H            ; Output a byte
    INT    21H
OUTNHI:    XOR    DL,DL            ; Clear out used code byte
    AND    DH,DH            ; Anything more to print?
    JNZ    OUTBYT
    CMP    SI,Offset CODEND    ; End of area?
    JNZ    BYTLOP
    MOV    DX,Offset ENDTXT    ; Yes, add trailer: 34H and CR LF
    MOV    AH,9H
    INT    21H
    MOV    AH,4CH            ; End GENCOM program section
    INT    21H

ENDTXT    DB    34H            ; End of file marker for loader
CRLF    DB    0DH,0AH,"$"

CODE ENDS
    END    START



Yahoo! Message number: 3204
Date: 27 Oct 2016 08:58:55 -0700

From: androgenoide@...

Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I know that it talks about using the program with DOS but, realistically, if you have DOS why not use something like Laplink?  The way I see this is that; if you have an 8086 compatible processor and UART, if you can type in a 185 character line, save it as a 7bit ASCII text file, rename that file as an executable and run it... then you have a tiny, primitive file transfer utility.  I've never had occasion to try this but I have to admire the ingenuity of the guy who wrote it.



Yahoo! Message number: 3205
Date: 27 Oct 2016 12:43:58 -0700

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Hi Ian
 

 What I have done in the past is burn them onto a rom with rombuild from the files section then you could write them to floppy or move them to bubble under grid-os.
 

 





Yahoo! Message number: 3206
Date: 29 Oct 2016 09:18:44 -0700

From: touchetek@...

Subject: Re: Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Explore lap link.
I have version 5 which has a remote install feature.
On the GRiD side you only need to do a copy command,
with output directed to a file.  Then on the other computer you invoe
laplinks remote install feature. 
laplink shuttles a copy of itself over to the other machine,
which you then can launch and use the facilities of lap link
on both sides.
I hope there are details in the help for you cause
I can't find a post about in with google right now.



Yahoo! Message number: 3207
Date: 29 Oct 2016 09:47:28 -0700

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



The compass uses a not so common DE19 connector , if you look at the photo stream I posted the pinout for it
 

 Grant





Yahoo! Message number: 3208
Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2016 10:43:32 -0700

From: Chris Hanson 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass?

text/plain; charset=us-ascii



On Oct 29, 2016, at 9:18 AM, touchetek@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
> Explore lap link.

Is there a version that runs on CCOS, or has access to the CCOS filesystem?

  -- Chris

>





Yahoo! Message number: 3209
Date: 30 Oct 2016 06:36:38 -0700

From: androgenoide@...

Subject: Re: Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



The Laplink remote install feature assumes that the target computer is running DOS.   It relies on a DOS internal command that allows you to set the console to the serial port.  In this case the target computer is running a DOS-like operating system with unknown capabilities and there's no reason to suppose it would work.



Yahoo! Message number: 3210
Date: 30 Oct 2016 10:50:33 -0700

From: androgenoide@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I doubt that there was much written for CCOS. It would be nice to know the capabilities of the OS... DOS was intended to be used on a variety of different computers so there are internal commands that allow the user to resize the screen and define the location and characteristics of the console.  If CCOS was written specifically for the Compass without thought of porting it to another machine there would be no good reason to include such options.  It does seem odd that Gridterm would not have a file transfer option though... most terminal emulators have something that will do the job.
Do either of these (CCOS or Gridterm) respond to "?" or "H" or "help"... a lot of software has some option to display all the commands it recognizes as valid.



Yahoo! Message number: 3211
Date: 30 Oct 2016 21:14:29 -0700

From: klyball@...

Subject: GRiD Tempest setup




I had my Tempest setup out the other day, thought I would post a pic.
 

 The printer is a HP 2225A ThinkJet  repackage in a tempest case.
 

 

 


This is part 2 of a multi-part message.




Attached image/jpeg file not shown; stay tuned!





Yahoo! Message number: 3212
Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2016 21:34:54 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GRiD Tempest setup [1 Attachment]





  
    
  
  
    Nice! and a little bit Awesome!

    Where can one source one of those printers? In the Tempest case?

    

    Asa Jay

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
& Shelley Marie
Spokane, WA
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 10/30/2016 9:14 PM, klyball@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
    

      
      
          

            
            
I had my Tempest setup out the other day, thought I
                would post a pic.

            
              


              

              
The printer is a HP 2225A ThinkJet repackage in a
                tempest case.

              


              

              


              

              


              

             

          
      
      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3213
Date: 31 Oct 2016 06:49:25 -0700

From: touchetek@...

Subject: Re: Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Yes. Regrettably I jumped to a conclusion due to having fielded the "how can I get files off my old PC' question many times.  A careful read would have avoided that.



Yahoo! Message number: 3214
Date: 31 Oct 2016 06:50:24 -0700

From: touchetek@...

Subject: Re: GRiD Tempest setup

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Nice.  !



Yahoo! Message number: 3215
Date: 31 Oct 2016 13:50:35 -0700

From: colin.nuke@...

Subject: Gridcase Battery Specs

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Hi everyone!
 

 I've taken a look through the forum but haven't found the specific rating for the lead acid battery that came with the Gridcase 1,2,3, etc. series. Does anyone happen to know the voltage and current rating? Is it the same as the charger (16.25v DC and 1.25 amps)?
 

 Thanks for the help!




Yahoo! Message number: 3216
Date: 31 Oct 2016 13:56:07 -0700

From: colin.nuke@...

Subject: Gridcase Battery Specs




Hello everyone!
 

 I'm new to the forum and have been working on getting acquainted with as much info as I can before posting. With that said, I'm new to the world of GRiD computers with respect to working with them. I've wanted one for quite some time but it's only recently that I've been able to acquire one... sort of. Unfortunately, thanks to the USPS, the one I purchased arrived in a few pieces, so I'm still on the hunt.
 

 Despite that setback, I've been actively working on designing a replacement battery of sorts. I know the Gridcase (1,2,3) series utilized lead acid batteries and for the most part worked similarly to how current batteries work. I've seen folks open up these batteries and do a re-cell, usually with NiCd or NiMH cells. What I've been working on is a brand new battery case loaded with LiFeO4 batteries. This should work as a direct replacement, save for the fact that you won't be able to charge them while in the laptop. They would have to be removed for charging due to the differences between lead acid and LeFeO4 (Lithium Iron Phosphate).
 

 The info I'm looking for to help move this project along involves the battery specs from the original lead acid ones. I've seen the chargers and I'm aware that they input 16.25v DC at around 1.25 amps. What I don't know is if the batteries produced the same voltage and current. Does anyone have this info handy?
 

 I appreciate any help I can get! Thanks much.

This is part 2 of a multi-part message.




Attached image/jpeg file not shown; stay tuned!


This is part 3 of a multi-part message.




Attached image/jpeg file not shown; stay tuned!





Yahoo! Message number: 3217
Date: 31 Oct 2016 13:57:26 -0700

From: colin.nuke@...

Subject: Re: Gridcase Battery Specs

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Apologies... this is the first topic I thought I sent, but it never posted on my end. Please disregard the other post.



Yahoo! Message number: 3218
Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 23:17:13 +0100

From: "fabio.gerosa206" 

Subject: R: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Gridcase Battery Specs [2 Attachments]

text/plain; charset=utf-8



HiMy Gridcase 3 came originally with ni-cd battery with I have successfully swapped twice in last 20 years always with Ni-Cd 1.2V elements. If I recall well there were 12 elements in total for 18v.I was not aware or lead acid batteries for Gridcase. Fabio


Inviato da smartphone Samsung Galaxy.
-------- Messaggio originale --------Da: "colin.nuke@gmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Data: 31/10/16  21:56  (GMT+01:00) A: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com Oggetto: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Gridcase Battery Specs [2 Attachments] 

 



  


    
      
              
        [Attachment(s) from colin.nuke@gmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop] included below]
        
      
      Hello everyone!
I'm new to the forum and have been working on getting acquainted with as much info as I can before posting. With that said, I'm new to the world of GRiD computers with respect to working with them. I've wanted one for quite some time but it's only recently that I've been able to acquire one... sort of. Unfortunately, thanks to the USPS, the one I purchased arrived in a few pieces, so I'm still on the hunt.
Despite that setback, I've been actively working on designing a replacement battery of sorts. I know the Gridcase (1,2,3) series utilized lead acid batteries and for the most part worked similarly to how current batteries work. I've seen folks open up these batteries and do a re-cell, usually with NiCd or NiMH cells. What I've been working on is a brand new battery case loaded with LiFeO4 batteries. This should work as a direct replacement, save for the fact that you won't be able to charge them while in the laptop. They would have to be removed for charging due to the differences between lead acid and LeFeO4 (Lithium Iron Phosphate).
The info I'm looking for to help move this project along involves the battery specs from the original lead acid ones. I've seen the chargers and I'm aware that they input 16.25v DC at around 1.25 amps. What I don't know is if the batteries produced the same voltage and current. Does anyone have this info handy?
I appreciate any help I can get! Thanks much.

    
     

    
    






Yahoo! Message number: 3219
Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 23:20:17 +0100

From: "fabio.gerosa206" 

Subject: R: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Gridcase Battery Specs

text/plain; charset=utf-8



14.4 volts sorry


Inviato da smartphone Samsung Galaxy.
-------- Messaggio originale --------Da: "'fabio.gerosa206' fabio.gerosa206@tiscali.it [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Data: 31/10/16  23:17  (GMT+01:00) A: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com Oggetto: R: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Gridcase Battery Specs 

 



  


    
      
      
      HiMy Gridcase 3 came originally with ni-cd battery with I have successfully swapped twice in last 20 years always with Ni-Cd 1.2V elements. If I recall well there were 12 elements in total for 18v.I was not aware or lead acid batteries for Gridcase. Fabio


Inviato da smartphone Samsung Galaxy.
-------- Messaggio originale --------Da: "colin.nuke@gmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Data: 31/10/16  21:56  (GMT+01:00) A: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com Oggetto: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Gridcase Battery Specs [2 Attachments] 

 



    
      
              
      
      Hello everyone!
I'm new to the forum and have been working on getting acquainted with as much info as I can before posting. With that said, I'm new to the world of GRiD computers with respect to working with them. I've wanted one for quite some time but it's only recently that I've been able to acquire one... sort of. Unfortunately, thanks to the USPS, the one I purchased arrived in a few pieces, so I'm still on the hunt.
Despite that setback, I've been actively working on designing a replacement battery of sorts. I know the Gridcase (1,2,3) series utilized lead acid batteries and for the most part worked similarly to how current batteries work. I've seen folks open up these batteries and do a re-cell, usually with NiCd or NiMH cells. What I've been working on is a brand new battery case loaded with LiFeO4 batteries. This should work as a direct replacement, save for the fact that you won't be able to charge them while in the laptop. They would have to be removed for charging due to the differences between lead acid and LeFeO4 (Lithium Iron Phosphate).
The info I'm looking for to help move this project along involves the battery specs from the original lead acid ones. I've seen the chargers and I'm aware that they input 16.25v DC at around 1.25 amps. What I don't know is if the batteries produced the same voltage and current. Does anyone have this info handy?
I appreciate any help I can get! Thanks much.

    
     

    



    
     

    
    






Yahoo! Message number: 3220
Date: 31 Oct 2016 15:42:50 -0700

From: colin.nuke@...

Subject: Re: R: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Gridcase Battery Specs

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Interesting. I guess I had some bad info. If that's the case then it will be a fair bit easier to put this all together. And I can use the built in charge feature! 

 Thanks!




Yahoo! Message number: 3221
Date: Tue, 1 Nov 2016 02:59:49 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: R: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Gridcase Battery Specs

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Colin,As you know, nominal voltage is 16 volts DC. I would be curious to know how well your Grid will perform with 14 volts. Several years ago, I was doing some experiments with a 1550SX. I wanted to see if I could run it from a 12V supply. I have a variable 0-20 VDC supply.My experience was that if booted the Grid from about 14 volts, I could decrease the voltage to about 10 volts and it would still function. The Grid was not doing any intense computing. It was idle. But, the 1550 would not boot up from voltages less than about 13 volts. I do not know if your Gridcase will behave the same or not. So, you might be on the edge of it booting.If 14 cells fit in the case, you might get more reliable booting performance.
Another point to consider: Ni-MH cells. Ni-MH will hold their voltage longer and give you more current. The downside is their overall life is not as long as Ni-Cd's. In most cases, you can use the same charger. Here is something I pulled from another forum:
The primary problem is that NiMH batteries do not like to be force-fed/overcharged, and
that is exactly what NiCd "low-end" chargers do: they are basically constant-current
"trickle" chargers (low current, takes many hours to charge, then keep feeding this
same charging current even after the NiCd is fully charged). NiCd batteries just shrug
off this excess charging current, but it will eventually "cook" your NiMHs.

That said, NiMH will pack much more punch into given size...so if you don't leave it on
constant charge (drain it, charge it overnight, then unplug it once "properly" charged)
it should work quite well.

Of course if you ditch the crappy little wallwart "charger" and hook it up to a proper
NiMH charger, it'll work Great!

As we say here in the US, "Your mileage may vary..." :)Good luck to you, and I'd be interested to hear what works for you.-Shawn 


      From: "colin.nuke@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Monday, October 31, 2016 6:42 PM
 Subject: Re: R: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Gridcase Battery Specs

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Interesting. I guess I had some bad info. If that's the case then it will be a fair bit easier to put this all together. And I can use the built in charge feature!
Thanks!









Yahoo! Message number: 3223
Date: 06 Nov 2016 16:27:52 -0800

From: klyball@...

Subject: Lets see what we have

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



our combined collection





Yahoo! Message number: 3224
Date: 06 Nov 2016 16:47:49 -0800

From: shawnerz@...

Subject: Re: Lets see what we have

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Grant, The problem is I have 3 (maybe 4), 1520's; 2, 1139's; and 1, 1550SX. I voted, but they all got 1 vote. I hope that's what you wanted. :)




Yahoo! Message number: 3225
Date: 06 Nov 2016 16:56:19 -0800

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: Lets see what we have

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



there does not seem to be away to do multi but it will be a general sampling



Yahoo! Message number: 3226
Date: 06 Nov 2016 20:25:01 -0800

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: Lets see what we have

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Well,
 

 How do you think you would count units? I have 1520's, 1530's, 1535's, and 1550's. Is that four points, or is the number of units a factor also?





Yahoo! Message number: 3227
Date: 07 Nov 2016 09:11:27 -0800

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: Lets see what we have

text/plain; charset=utf-8



[RuGRiD-Laptop] An existing poll has been modified, check it out.
Enter your vote now! https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/polls/poll/3226376


Not a complete list but add what you have if not here
Created by: klyball


1. gridcase 4 (tempest) 1307 https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/polls/poll/3226376#22346621 (added by: hercule0164 . November 7, 2016)
2. Grid 286 N https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/polls/poll/3226376#22346622 (added by: hercule0164 . November 7, 2016)
3. Grid 1660 https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/polls/poll/3226376#22346623 (added by: hercule0164 . November 7, 2016)






Thanks!








Yahoo! Message number: 3228
Date: 07 Nov 2016 09:39:40 -0800

From: walton.david@...

Subject: Re: Lets see what we have

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Hi. I have a gridcase 4 tempest (1307), gridpad, grid 286n and grid 1660.



Yahoo! Message number: 3229
Date: 07 Nov 2016 12:48:35 -0800

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: Lets see what we have

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



We can't count multiples but it will give an idea of what's out there, I too have multiples of many units.



Yahoo! Message number: 3230
Date: 15 Nov 2016 16:38:06 -0800

From: jenniferpiercegs@...

Subject: Gridcase 1530 & CDROM question

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Is it possible to attach an old style CDROM to the Gridcase 1530 via the parallel port and get it to work?

I am also trying to figure out how to possibly attach an external 5.25" floppy drive as well.

Any pointers would be greatly appreciated!

Jennifer
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3231
Date: 15 Nov 2016 19:22:45 -0800

From: wd8cyv@...

Subject: Re: Gridcase 1530 & CDROM question

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



cd via the printer port would be a problem as there were probably no drivers written to support
it
or the port is limited in its talk back from the printer

floppy drivers also never written  

dave wd8cyv

these things are old tech   and old history    i am surprised any of them still work
some day i will see if i can get the Dallas clock chip in mine to live again and use it for ham radio rtty



Yahoo! Message number: 3232
Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2016 00:19:19 -0500

From: shawn 

Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Gridcase 1530 & CDROM question

text/plain; charset=utf-8



I know at one time, I had an external CDROM with a 25 pin connector. 
I do not remember if it was serial or parallel. I think it was parallel.
I may still have it in storage. However, as Dave pointed out, finding the correct driver would be the problem.
It will take a couple of weeks, but I will look to see what I have.
But to answer you question, yes, I think you can do it.
-Shawn

-------- Original message --------
From: "wd8cyv@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> 
Date:11/15/2016  22:22  (GMT-05:00) 
To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com 
Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Gridcase 1530 & CDROM question 



cd via the printer port would be a problem as there were probably no drivers written to support
it
or the port is limited in its talk back from the printer

floppy drivers also never written  

dave wd8cyv

these things are old tech   and old history    i am surprised any of them still work
some day i will see if i can get the Dallas clock chip in mine to live again and use it for ham radio rtty 





Yahoo! Message number: 3233
Date: 15 Nov 2016 22:06:55 -0800

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: Gridcase 1530 & CDROM question

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Sorry, Shawn,
 

 AFAIK you can't connect a CDROM directly to a 1530. The reason for this is because MSDOS is limited in its ability to address large capacity media drives. The 1530 has a 32 bit CPU, but the motherboard is still configured as a 16 bit machine. Therefore addressing has all the expected 16 bit problems on addressing such large capacity media. The only way I found to connect a CD drive, which has to address something like 720 MB is to use a SCSI adapter by Adaptec which in turn has its own method of addressing these larger capacity media devices, and then using a SCSI CDROM reader to connect to it. Adaptec made one which is a small portable unit that connects directly to the parallel port of the 1530, and which you can then attach six devices to run off of that. The SCSI interface facilitates all the addressing needs of looking at all those devices. If you do have a driver that can actually directly connect the CDROM to the 1530, I would love to get it, but I don't think that would be the case due to the limits of DOS to even see such a device.
 

 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3234
Date: 15 Nov 2016 22:15:56 -0800

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: Gridcase 1530 & CDROM question

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Hi, Jennifer,
 

 As I noted to Shawn, a CDROM, even an old one, can't be connected to a 1530 directly. There is a portable SCSI Adaptec Interface, if you can find one, that will connect to the parallel port that will let you connect a SCSI CDROM drive. As far as connecting external floppy drives, GRiD had a proprietary method for doing this. There is a proprietary 25 pin connector in the back with pin #1 permanently blocked meant to connect both 5.25" and 3.5" external floppy drives made by GRiD, but you would have to find those particular floppy drives out there. I have seen them on ebay and other places on occasion. Trying to connect a non-GRiD floppy through the regular parallel port is something I never tried, but I suppose it is possible. I've never heard of anyone making a device that would do that though, as it would normally be redundant. But never say never.. Hope that helps.





Yahoo! Message number: 3235
Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2016 01:35:36 -0500

From: shawn 

Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Gridcase 1530 & CDROM question

text/plain; charset=utf-8



I guess I am wrong.
Sorry about that.
-Shawn

-------- Original message --------
From: "Jeriddian@msn.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> 
Date:11/16/2016  01:06  (GMT-05:00) 
To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com 
Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Gridcase 1530 & CDROM question 



Sorry, Shawn,



AFAIK you can't connect a CDROM directly to a 1530. The reason for this is because MSDOS is limited in its ability to address large capacity media drives. The 1530 has a 32 bit CPU, but the motherboard is still configured as a 16 bit machine. Therefore addressing has all the expected 16 bit problems on addressing such large capacity media. The only way I found to connect a CD drive, which has to address something like 720 MB is to use a SCSI adapter by Adaptec which in turn has its own method of addressing these larger capacity media devices, and then using a SCSI CDROM reader to connect to it. Adaptec made one which is a small portable unit that connects directly to the parallel port of the 1530, and which you can then attach six devices to run off of that. The SCSI interface facilitates all the addressing needs of looking at all those devices. If you do have a driver that can actually directly connect the CDROM to the 1530, I would love to get it, but I don't think that would be the case due to the limits of DOS to even see such a device.



Phil







Yahoo! Message number: 3236
Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2016 23:04:35 -0800

From: Chris Hanson 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Gridcase 1530 & CDROM question

text/plain; charset=utf-8



On Nov 15, 2016, at 10:06 PM, Jeriddian@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
> The 1530 has a 32 bit CPU, but the motherboard is still configured as a 16 bit machine. Therefore addressing has all the expected 16 bit problems on addressing such large capacity media.
>

This is so incorrect it’s painful to read. What matters is what functionality the operating system, its device drivers, and its filesystem implement, not whether the CPU is 16- or 32-bit.

  -- Chris (who started working on operating systems literally decades ago)






Yahoo! Message number: 3237
Date: 16 Nov 2016 07:07:08 -0800

From: androgenoide@...

Subject: Re: Gridcase 1530 & CDROM question

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I have used a Backpack CD ROM in DOS but I've never tried it on a Grid.  The only problem I can think of is that the Grid hardware is very old and might not support high speed bidirectional operation on the parallel port.
If that is a problem it would be a problem with the Adaptec SCSI as well.  Otherwise... if you can find a Backpack CD the software drivers shouldn't be a problem.  That said... it occurs to me that there were several models and it's possible that the newest one, the one that has an optional USB connection) may not have DOS drivers... (MAYBE)  It's worth experimenting.   I can't really dig a 1530 out of storage right away so it's not worth the trouble to wait for me to test it.



Yahoo! Message number: 3238
Date: 16 Nov 2016 09:38:58 -0800

From: androgenoide@...

Subject: Re: Gridcase 1530 & CDROM question

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Clarification
I just looked at the file on the latest Backpack CD ROM drive and, yes, it does have DOS drivers.   
Neither the USB driver nor the DVD drivers work under DOS but the it should be possible to use the CD under DOS 6.2, bios permitting.  Older versions of DOS and older bios versions may impose size limits on the drive that make a CD too large to see.



Yahoo! Message number: 3239
Date: 16 Nov 2016 09:58:46 -0800

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: Gridcase 1530 & CDROM question

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Thanks, Andro,
  
 I forgot about those BackPack drives. I used to have one way back then myself, although I used it on another DOS computer, so I suppose it should work on a GRiD. However, the problem is still not the DOS version, but the fact you're dealing with essentially a 16 bit machine, which had hardwiring limitations on addressing. I think the backpack I used was connected to a true 32 bit machine, but to be honest, I'm not sure. It's certainly worth a try with a GRiD though. It would be great if it worked.
  
 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3240
Date: 16 Nov 2016 11:33:46 -0800

From: androgenoide@...

Subject: Re: Gridcase 1530 & CDROM question

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



It's the addressing limits that I'm uncertain about... I don't think the 16 bits is the real issue so much as the BIOS...if the BIOS permits seeing a drive larger than 504MB there should be no problem... if it doesn't there might be a way to do it with a drive overlay?   Just depends how much work a person wants to do.



Yahoo! Message number: 3241
Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2016 10:44:04 -0800

From: Chris Hanson 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Gridcase 1530 & CDROM question

text/plain; charset=us-ascii



On Nov 16, 2016, at 9:58 AM, Jeriddian@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>
> However, the problem is still not the DOS version, but the fact you're dealing with essentially a 16 bit machine, which had hardwiring limitations on addressing.

Stop saying this.

CPU word width is not where limitations on the size of attachable mass storage come from.

An 8-bit or 16-bit system can use a CD-ROM drive or even a multi-gigabyte hard disk (or card) just fine, if the operating system and filesystem support doing so. For example, plenty of Apple II users are able to attach CD-ROM drives and hard drives to their systems.

  -- Chris






Yahoo! Message number: 3242
Date: 17 Nov 2016 07:27:02 -0800

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Gridcase 1530 & CDROM question

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Very well, Chris
 

 If I am wrong, then I am wrong. This was how it was explained to me when I researched it. As far as Apple OS is concerned, that is not DOS, and does not confirm that DOS itself is capable of large capacity addressing. But you say DOS can do ti too. Fine. I am willing to learn. Don't just tell me to stop. Please explain why I should stop, i.e. exactly how it does it. Thank You.
 

 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3243
Date: 02 Dec 2016 13:48:38 -0800

From: jenniferpiercegs@...

Subject: Gridcase 1530 & RTC battery

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I (like a lot of you it appears) have a dead Dallas RTC.

I (perhaps foolishly) removed the dead chip and replaced it with the modern equivalent.

Now however when I start the computer I get the dreaded beep, beep, beepbeepbeep which indicates a read/write error tied to the RTC chip.

Since I've read the post manuals (thanks whoever did that) it seems that these beasts first check the RTC chip prior to all else at boot - which explains why I have the same result without the screen or keyboard attached.

Anyone have any ideas?  I would dearly love to get this thing working 100% again.

Thanks in advance!

    Jennifer
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3244
Date: 02 Dec 2016 14:00:21 -0800

From: jenniferpiercegs@...

Subject: RTC replacement document?

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There are several references to a RTC replacement document, but the site where it is shown as "home" isn't alive anymore...

www.omnipulsemedia.com/GRiD_files/Removing and Replacing the 1287A RTC Timing Chip.pdf

Anyone have this perhaps?

Jennifer
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3245
Date: 02 Dec 2016 16:22:35 -0800

From: wd8cyv@...

Subject: Re: RTC replacement document?

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try a search at you tube for Dallas 1278 chip mods dave




Yahoo! Message number: 3246
Date: 02 Dec 2016 16:32:36 -0800

From: jenniferpiercegs@...

Subject: RTC Replacement ?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



So I had followed another user's advice and replaced the dead Dallas 1287 with a Dallas 12887A chip - and no luck - I get 1 beep, 1 beep, 3 beeps indicating the computer can't read/write to the RTC.

Searching the archives I found this gem:

Dallas Semiconductor does make a modern replacement for the 1287A, called the 12887A, however you cannot use this chip in the GRiD's. The reason is because the 12887A has a 64 bit capacity memory, whereas the 1287 and 1287A only have 32 bits. If you try to use the 12887A, the BIOS of the computer cannot address it correctly and it becomes useless, and the computer simply won't boot. The only thing that will work is a 1287 or 1287A. It may be that if we could re-engineer the BIOS, we can rewrite the code for addressing the RTC so that a 12887A would work, but not with the original BIOS.

If this is true, then it explains why I am "stuck" atm.

I just ordered a 1287A (they still make these??) and am hoping it will solve the problem.

Is there perchance a FAQ for these computers and their care/repair/maintenance anywhere?

Thanks again!

Jennifer
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3247
Date: 02 Dec 2016 16:34:08 -0800

From: jenniferpiercegs@...

Subject: Re: RTC replacement document?

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Yep saw those - but I always try to fix things the "right" way so I decided to replace the old Dallas 1287 with a new version.

Lo and behind I found this afterwards:

"Dallas Semiconductor does make a modern replacement for the 1287A, called the 12887A, however you cannot use this chip in the GRiD's. The reason is because the 12887A has a 64 bit capacity memory, whereas the 1287 and 1287A only have 32 bits. If you try to use the 12887A, the BIOS of the computer cannot address it correctly and it becomes useless, and the computer simply won't boot. The only thing that will work is a 1287 or 1287A. It may be that if we could re-engineer the BIOS, we can rewrite the code for addressing the RTC so that a 12887A would work, but not with the original BIOS."

So the 12887A might be the cause of my issues, I just removed it and ordered a 1287A and am hoping that solves my current issue.

Jennifer



Yahoo! Message number: 3248
Date: 02 Dec 2016 18:45:34 -0800

From: wd8cyv@...

Subject: Re: RTC replacement document?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



there is code in the 1287 that has to be there or the combuter is a paper weight 

 the butcher job on the chip is it or its just a big paper weight
 dave




Yahoo! Message number: 3249
Date: 03 Dec 2016 01:28:50 -0800

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: RTC replacement document?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Hi, Jennirfer,
 

 Sorry I didn't see this earlier. This text you found comes from one of my earlier posts. I went through the same problem you did and tried a 12887 several years ago, and found it didn't work. I did the research and found out why. As I noted, the 12887 has a 64 bit memory bank, as opposed to the 1287A's 32 bit memory bank, and for some reason, the GRiD BIOS will only address the last 32 bits of the memory, whereas the data gets stored in the first 32 bits. How this happens, I do not know, butt that is what I found out, thus the original 1287/1287A is the only usable Dallas RTC chip in this computer. 
 

 I apologize for your not being able to access the "Removing and Replacing the 1287A RTC Timing Chip.pdf" file, but I had inadvertently forgotten to keep my domain names registered on my server host site. I have corrected this, and you should be able to access that file now if you wish. However, it appears you already figured out how to remove the chip on your own. 
 

 Fortunately, you can replace the 1287A in a 1530 and it will work. I have done it several times. The 1530 BIOS code somehow allows for that. It is different for a 1520 though. Trying to change the 1287A in that unit could lock the computer into an unbreakable loop that never allows it to boot, thus drilling the chip and putting in a new CMOS battery is the only answer there. I found that out the hard way as well. But you don't have to worry about that thankfully. 
 

 Hope that helps.
 

 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3250
Date: 03 Dec 2016 05:41:18 -0800

From: touchetek@...

Subject: Re: RTC Replacement ?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Jennifer:

A few years ago I went through this with a 1530.
Probably all the folks here have. 
Hopefully the 1287a you get works for you.
You might be doing something like this.

Reworking the DS1287 / DS1387 RTC chip http://www.mcamafia.de/mcapage0/dsrework.htm
 
 
 http://www.mcamafia.de/mcapage0/dsrework.htm 
 
 Reworking the DS1287 / DS1387 RTC chip http://www.mcamafia.de/mcapage0/dsrework.htm Reworking the DS1287 / DS1387 RTC chip 
 
 
 
 View on www.mcamafia.de http://www.mcamafia.de/mcapage0/dsrework.htm 
 Preview by Yahoo 
 
 
  

Like a lot of others, I blogged about it here- but just showed the results.
GRiD 1530: My first vintage computer project https://abitoutofplace.wordpress.com/2012/08/01/grid-1530-my-first-vintage-computer-project/ 
 
 https://abitoutofplace.wordpress.com/2012/08/01/grid-1530-my-first-vintage-computer-project/ 
 
 GRiD 1530: My first vintage computer project https://abitoutofplace.wordpress.com/2012/08/01/grid-1530-my-first-vintage-computer-project/  In July 2012 I had a stroke of luck finding this GRiD 1530 at a local recycling facility.  I brought it home and found that it was a very nice item, with some acce...
 
 
 
 View on abitoutofplace.word... https://abitoutofplace.wordpress.com/2012/08/01/grid-1530-my-first-vintage-computer-project/ 
 Preview by Yahoo 
 
 
  




Yahoo! Message number: 3251
Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2016 18:42:02 -0500

From: Justin 

Subject: 1520 Power supply repair - coil replacement?





Yahoo! Message number: 3252
Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2016 06:09:15 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520 Power supply repair - coil replacement?

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Justin,The short answer to your question is 'no'. Sorry. 

I like helping. But some details or a picture would have been nice. As luck would have it, I happened to have a 1520 near my workbench me and the cover was off. I wasn't sure if you meant the DC - DC converter power supply, or AC to DC power supply. I took both apart and I think I see you mean the AC to DC power supply.
I took both power supplies apart and I think you meant the bifilar wound toroid that's in the goop with the 220 uF capacitor. You might have meant the large transformer towards the rear. But either way, I don't have any info for you.
I think the easiest solution would be to find a donor 1520. I did a Google search and you could wind your own. It's a stab in the dark, but it could work.16  volts is ideal, but it should work from 15 volts. 15V power supplies on Digikey are here: http://www.digikey.com/product-search/en/power-supplies-external-internal-off-board/ac-dc-converters/590377?k=&pkeyword=&pv183=7547&FV=fff40009%2Cfff80229%2C15c0002%2C17d40096&mnonly=0&newproducts=0&ColumnSort=0&page=1&quantity=0&ptm=0&fid=0&pageSize=25Or, contact a company like Murata or Coilcraft, and as, "Hey, do you have something close to this?"
Sorry I couldn't be of more help. Good luck,-Shawn
      From: "Justin shadow@darksideresearch.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Sunday, December 4, 2016 6:42 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520 Power supply repair - coil replacement?

Does anyone know an appropriate replacement for the coil between C1 and C4 in the power supply?  I apparently damaged the leg on the green side of the coil while freeing C1 from the gooped on hot glue.

Thanks,

Justin






Yahoo! Message number: 3253
Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2016 08:52:49 -0500

From: Justin 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520 Power supply repair - coil replacement?





Yahoo! Message number: 3254
Date: Mon, 05 Dec 2016 07:46:25 -0800

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520 Power supply repair - coil replacement?

text/plain; charset=utf-8



If it were me, I'd first see about soldering the two leads back together.  They are coated so you'll have to scrape the coating off to get the solder to stick.  If that fails, I'd probably unwind one wrap and solder the lead back in the hole, again scraping the coating off.  One wrap may not affect the supply that much, but I don't know for certain.  My last option would be to re-wrap it, but I'm lazy.

Asa


Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks

"Justin shadow@darksideresearch.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

>I should have done a better job of describing the part.  Yes, it is the AC-DC power supply from a 1520.  There are two paper film filter cap assemblies, C1 and C4 next to the AC power cord socket marked as 0.15uF X2 safety rating on top (assuming yours hasn’t yellowed over or had the shell crack), with a coil sandwiched in between.  The coil has a red winding and a green winding.  During removal of C1, I must’ve hit the leg from the green coil while cutting through the hot glue that had locked C1 into place.  It was impossible to see anything because the caps had leaked all over the old hot glue, rendering it a nearly opaque brown.  I don’t see any markings on the coil at all.
>
>I’ve attached a photo FWIW.  I’m thinking rewinding it might be the only option but that seems pretty tedious.  Getting a separate 1520 power supply doesn’t seem like a great solution since I’d still have the same 26 year old leaking caps probably held in with random glue, which means risking breaking something again anyway.
>
>
>> On Dec 5, 2016, at 01:09, Shawnerz shawnerz@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Justin,
>> The short answer to your question is 'no'. Sorry. 
>> 
>> I like helping. But some details or a picture would have been nice. As luck would have it, I happened to have a 1520 near my workbench me and the cover was off. I wasn't sure if you meant the DC - DC converter power supply, or AC to DC power supply. I took both apart and I think I see you mean the AC to DC power supply.
>> 
>> I took both power supplies apart and I think you meant the bifilar wound toroid that's in the goop with the 220 uF capacitor. You might have meant the large transformer towards the rear. But either way, I don't have any info for you.
>> 
>> I think the easiest solution would be to find a donor 1520. 
>> I did a Google search and you could wind your own. It's a stab in the dark, but it could work.
>> 16  volts is ideal, but it should work from 15 volts. 15V power supplies on Digikey are here: http://www.digikey.com/product-search/en/power-supplies-external-internal-off-board/ac-dc-converters/590377?k=&pkeyword=&pv183=7547&FV=fff40009%2Cfff80229%2C15c0002%2C17d40096&mnonly=0&newproducts=0&ColumnSort=0&page=1&quantity=0&ptm=0&fid=0&pageSize=25
>> Or, contact a company like Murata or Coilcraft, and as, "Hey, do you have something close to this?"
>> 
>> Sorry I couldn't be of more help. 
>> Good luck,
>> -Shawn
>> 
>> From: "Justin shadow@darksideresearch.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
>> To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com 
>> Sent: Sunday, December 4, 2016 6:42 PM
>> Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520 Power supply repair - coil replacement?
>> 
>> Does anyone know an appropriate replacement for the coil between C1 and C4 in the power supply?  I apparently damaged the leg on the green side of the coil while freeing C1 from the gooped on hot glue.
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> 
>> Justin
>> 
>> 
>> 
>




Yahoo! Message number: 3255
Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2016 02:33:22 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520 Power supply repair - coil replacement? [1 Attachment]

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Justin,Yeah, what Asa Jay said. :)I guessed the wrong coil in my email. Good luck,-Shawn

      From: "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Monday, December 5, 2016 10:46 AM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520 Power supply repair - coil replacement? [1 Attachment]

<!--#yiv9110637324 #yiv9110637324 .yiv9110637324ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv9110637324 div.yiv9110637324ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv9110637324 div.yiv9110637324photo-title a, #yiv9110637324 div.yiv9110637324photo-title a:active, #yiv9110637324 div.yiv9110637324photo-title a:hover, #yiv9110637324 div.yiv9110637324photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv9110637324 div.yiv9110637324attach-table div.yiv9110637324attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv9110637324 div.yiv9110637324attach-table div.yiv9110637324attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv9110637324 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv9110637324 div.yiv9110637324ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv9110637324 div.yiv9110637324attach-table div.yiv9110637324attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv9110637324 div.yiv9110637324attach-table div.yiv9110637324attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv9110637324 div.yiv9110637324ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv9110637324 --> <!--#yiv9110637324 #yiv9110637324ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv9110637324 #yiv9110637324ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv9110637324 #yiv9110637324ygrp-mkp #yiv9110637324hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv9110637324 #yiv9110637324ygrp-mkp #yiv9110637324ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv9110637324 #yiv9110637324ygrp-mkp .yiv9110637324ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv9110637324 #yiv9110637324ygrp-mkp .yiv9110637324ad p {margin:0;}#yiv9110637324 #yiv9110637324ygrp-mkp .yiv9110637324ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}-->[Attachment(s) from Asa Jay Laughton included below]

If it were me, I'd first see about soldering the two leads back together.  They are coated so you'll have to scrape the coating off to get the solder to stick.  If that fails, I'd probably unwind one wrap and solder the lead back in the hole, again scraping the coating off.  One wrap may not affect the supply that much, but I don't know for certain.  My last option would be to re-wrap it, but I'm lazy.
Asa

Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks






Yahoo! Message number: 3256
Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2016 23:04:01 -0500

From: Justin 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520 Power supply repair - coil replacement?





Yahoo! Message number: 3257
Date: Sat, 10 Dec 2016 15:36:37 -0500

From: Justin 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520 Power supply repair - coil replacement?





Yahoo! Message number: 3258
Date: Sun, 11 Dec 2016 06:44:32 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520 Power supply repair - coil replacement?




Great work! And even more amazing photography!!! What did you use for the macro shot?Glad to know it's working again.-Shawn

      From: "Justin shadow@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Saturday, December 10, 2016 3:36 PM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520 Power supply repair - coil replacement?

Well it worked.  I had to undo two loops because the wire had been stressed at some point and broke almost on contact after undoing the first loop.  The power supply no longer stinks like hell when power is applied to it.  Some of the capacitors are mil spec components and have export controls FWIW.
I took a macro photo of the coil wire as I was deleting the insulation.

Here are the filter capacitor assemblies, in case anyone wants to know what the current replacement looks like instead of trying to read the destroyed mess they are likely to find on disassembly.

One of the weirder things I found is that the internal ground wire has a donut choke and cylindrical ones hidden under some heat shrink.  I needed to expose some more wire to solder the wire end back on, so I preshrunk it.  This is mostly a heads up for anyone disassembling it (as you can see, I nicked one of the cylindrical magnets).


And victory of sorts. I still need to do the DS1287A mod to see if the hard drive is dead or just the clock, but it boots to a DOS floppy.


On Dec 5, 2016, at 21:33, Shawnerz shawnerz@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:












This is part 2 of a multi-part message.




Attached image/jpeg file not shown; stay tuned!





Yahoo! Message number: 3259
Date: Sun, 11 Dec 2016 13:07:44 -0500

From: Justin 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520 Power supply repair - coil replacement? [1 Attachment]





Yahoo! Message number: 3260
Date: Sun, 11 Dec 2016 13:33:30 -0800

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520 Power supply repair - coil replacement?




Nice photos and I'm glad you got it running.  It looks like that ground 
wire probably has ferrites on it, which most likely help cut down on 
spurious emissions introduced via ground.  The mil-spec units were 
supposed to be TEMPEST safe and I imagine those beads and the choke are 
all part of it.

Again, glad you got it working,
Asa  Jay

Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
&  Shelley Marie
Spokane, WA
******************************
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com


On 12/10/2016 12:36 PM, Justin shadow@... 
[RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
> Well it worked.  I had to undo two loops because the wire had been 
> stressed at some point and broke almost on contact after undoing the 
> first loop.  The power supply no longer stinks like hell when power is 
> applied to it.  Some of the capacitors are mil spec components and 
> have export controls FWIW.
>
> I took a macro photo of the coil wire as I was deleting the insulation.
>
> Here are the filter capacitor assemblies, in case anyone wants to know 
> what the current replacement looks like instead of trying to read the 
> destroyed mess they are likely to find on disassembly.
>
> One of the weirder things I found is that the internal ground wire has 
> a donut choke and cylindrical ones hidden under some heat shrink.  I 
> needed to expose some more wire to solder the wire end back on, so I 
> preshrunk it.  This is mostly a heads up for anyone disassembling it 
> (as you can see, I nicked one of the cylindrical magnets).
>
> And victory of sorts. I still need to do the DS1287A mod to see if the 
> hard drive is dead or just the clock, but it boots to a DOS floppy.
>
>





Yahoo! Message number: 3261
Date: 11 Dec 2016 13:43:25 -0800

From: klyball@...

Subject: grid pad 2050 power supply pinout

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Like the title says . need the pinout for the kycon connector
 

 Please
 

 Thanks
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3262
Date: Sun, 11 Dec 2016 22:02:39 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] grid pad 2050 power supply pinout

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



"kycon"? Do you mean keyboard/mouse connector? Or is that the name of the power connector?Either way, I don't have any info.Sorry.-Shawn

      From: "klyball@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2016 4:43 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] grid pad 2050 power supply pinout

<!--#yiv6109887223 #yiv6109887223 .yiv6109887223ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv6109887223 div.yiv6109887223ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv6109887223 div.yiv6109887223photo-title a, #yiv6109887223 div.yiv6109887223photo-title a:active, #yiv6109887223 div.yiv6109887223photo-title a:hover, #yiv6109887223 div.yiv6109887223photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv6109887223 div.yiv6109887223attach-table div.yiv6109887223attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv6109887223 div.yiv6109887223attach-table div.yiv6109887223attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv6109887223 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv6109887223 div.yiv6109887223ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv6109887223 div.yiv6109887223attach-table div.yiv6109887223attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv6109887223 div.yiv6109887223attach-table div.yiv6109887223attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv6109887223 div.yiv6109887223ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv6109887223 --> <!--#yiv6109887223 #yiv6109887223ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv6109887223 #yiv6109887223ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv6109887223 #yiv6109887223ygrp-mkp #yiv6109887223hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv6109887223 #yiv6109887223ygrp-mkp #yiv6109887223ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv6109887223 #yiv6109887223ygrp-mkp .yiv6109887223ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv6109887223 #yiv6109887223ygrp-mkp .yiv6109887223ad p {margin:0;}#yiv6109887223 #yiv6109887223ygrp-mkp .yiv6109887223ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}-->

Like the title says . need the pinout for the kycon connector
Please
Thanks









Yahoo! Message number: 3263
Date: 11 Dec 2016 15:11:10 -0800

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] grid pad 2050 power supply pinout

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Its the 4 pin power connector



Yahoo! Message number: 3264
Date: Wed, 21 Dec 2016 15:40:44 -0800

From: =?windows-1252?Q?Justin_Cordesman?= 

Subject: Battery disassembly




Before I blindly tear into it, is there a graceful way to take apart the battery pack for a 1520 or is it glued together? I plan to attempt a rebuild using lithium ion batteries inside the original housing.

Thanks,

Justin





Yahoo! Message number: 3265
Date: Thu, 22 Dec 2016 04:34:25 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Battery disassembly

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Justin,I *think* it's glued. If you have a heat gun, I'd try to locate a seam, apply hot air and see if the glue loosens up.If not, you might have to use a Dremel type tool and do some delicate cutting. :(Good luck,-Shawn

      From: "Justin Cordesman shadow@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: "RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> 
 Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2016 6:40 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Battery disassembly
   
Before I blindly tear into it, is there a graceful way to take apart the battery pack for a 1520 or is it glued together? I plan to attempt a rebuild using lithium ion batteries inside the original housing.

Thanks,

Justin



   




Yahoo! Message number: 3266
Date: 21 Dec 2016 21:00:59 -0800

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: Battery disassembly

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Hi, Justin,
 

 Unfortunately, there is no easy way to take a battery pack apart. You would have to use a dremel tool to carefully cut it apart and then glue it back together again. 
 

 However, there is a more important problem. You mention you want to use Lithium Ion batteries. I do not think that will work. The charging system for the battery pack is designed to charge NiCad's, which is different than trying to charge Lithium Ion. They require different algorithms for the charging cycle and trying to use the charging system of the 1520 to charge Lithium Ion would not work. But MORE IMPORTANTLY....it is dangerous. Chances are good you will overcharge the Lithium Ion with a NiCad charger and it could blow up and catch fire. If you replace the used up NiCad batteries, you must replace them with new NiCad's. That is your only safe option.
 

 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3267
Date: Thu, 22 Dec 2016 07:57:51 -0500

From: Justin 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Battery disassembly





Yahoo! Message number: 3268
Date: Thu, 22 Dec 2016 08:12:43 -0500

From: Justin 

Subject: 1520 RAM, 80287, and EPROM socket questions





Yahoo! Message number: 3269
Date: 22 Dec 2016 08:06:40 -0800

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: 1520 RAM, 80287, and EPROM socket questions

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HI, Justin,
 

 Yes, the 80287 socket does work. The 1520 computer runs at 20 MHz, with the socket designed to accept an 80287 at 10 MHz. The 12 MHz should also work, of course skipping one cycle out of every six.. (FYI, the 1530 runs at 25 MHz, so its 80387 should be a 12.5 MHz chip, just in case you ever work on one of those). 
 

 The SIPP sockets are designed to accept either 256K or 1Mb SIPPs. The acceptable configurations are for either 1 Mb RAM (four 256K), 2 MB RAM) (eight 256K), 4 MB RAM (four 1Mb), or 8 MB (eight 1Mb). If only four sticks are used, they should be inserted in slots 1,3,5,and 7 normally. The slowest acceptable time for the computer is 120 ns, although you will find that virtually all of the sticks are either 70 ns or 80 ns. The maximum RAM is 8MB. DOS itself would allow for 16MB max, but the motherboard itself is hardwired to a maximum of only 8 MB RAM.
 

 The EPROM sockets are designed to accept either 28 pin or 32 pin chips, of memory of 16K, 32K, 64K, or 128K capacity. There were some commercial chips made to fit these, mostly for those being 1520's which did not have a hard drive, and usually had the OS installed on them (usually MSDOS or GRiD DOS 3.2 or 3.3). Occasionally you found some EPROM's with other programs such as Lotus or a word processor. I've only found the ones with an OS on them. However, it is possible to burn these chips yourself with whatever programs you want on them. When the computer sees these chips, they are considered part of the A: drive, i.e. the programs on an EPROM of 128K capacity would be added to the directory of whatever disk is in the floppy drive, making its total capacity 1.56 MB total. If no disk is present, the A: drive has a capacity of 128K, showing the programs on the chip. I do not know how to properly configure the code to burn these chips myself however. I would like to find out though.
 

 Hope that helps.
 

 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3270
Date: 22 Dec 2016 08:24:40 -0800

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: 1520 RAM, 80287, and EPROM socket questions

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HI, Justin,
 

 Yes, the 80287 socket does work. The 1520 computer runs at 20 MHz, with the socket designed to accept an 80287 at 10 MHz. The 12 MHz should also work, of course skipping one cycle out of every six.. (FYI, the 1530 runs at 25 MHz, so its 80387 should be a 12.5 MHz chip, just in case you ever work on one of those). 
 

 The SIPP sockets are designed to accept either 256K or 1Mb SIPPs. The acceptable configurations are for either 1 Mb RAM (four 256K), 2 MB RAM) (eight 256K), 4 MB RAM (four 1Mb), or 8 MB (eight 1Mb). If only four sticks are used, they should be inserted in slots 1,3,5,and 7 normally. The slowest acceptable time for the computer is 120 ns, although you will find that virtually all of the sticks are either 70 ns or 80 ns. The maximum RAM is 8MB. DOS itself would allow for 16MB max, but the motherboard itself is hardwired to a maximum of only 8 MB RAM.
 

 The EPROM sockets are designed to accept either 28 pin or 32 pin chips, of memory of 16K, 32K, 64K, or 128K capacity. There were some commercial chips made to fit these, mostly for those being 1520's which did not have a hard drive, and usually had the OS installed on them (usually MSDOS or GRiD DOS 3.2 or 3.3). Occasionally you found some EPROM's with other programs such as Lotus or a word processor. I've only found the ones with an OS on them. However, it is possible to burn these chips yourself with whatever programs you want on them. When the computer sees these chips, they are considered part of the A: drive, i.e. the programs on an EPROM of 128K capacity would be added to the directory of whatever disk is in the floppy drive, making its total capacity 1.56 MB total. If no disk is present, the A: drive has a capacity of 128K, showing the programs on the chip. I do not know how to properly configure the code to burn these chips myself however. I would like to find out though.
 

 Hope that helps.
 

 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3271
Date: Thu, 22 Dec 2016 13:08:50 -0500

From: Justin 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520 RAM, 80287, and EPROM socket questions





Yahoo! Message number: 3272
Date: 22 Dec 2016 11:41:03 -0800

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 1520 RAM, 80287, and EPROM socket questions

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Unfortunately, no, you can't mix and match. All the sticks must be the same type or you will get an error, or least it did when I tried it. The manuals also say you have to have all the same type. So you are limited to 1MB, 2MB, 4MB, or 8MB, which I do know is hard to do as the 1MB are really hard to find. Also whatever 1MB sticks you find really need to be those sticks that have only two or three chips on them with a low profile. The ones that have eight or nine chips on them tend to be too tall to fit underneath the keyboard bezel and make it stick up. 
 

 I always wondered if it were possible to rig a system up to use something else in the SIPP slots. Back in the 90's there was a company called Pyramid which manufactured a specific adapter to plug into those slots and one was able to plug in a 4MB or 8 MB SIMM to take the place of all those SIPP's. I would like to be able to construct something like that, but I don't have the knowledge to design such a circuit.
 

 As to the EPROM's, I don't know if you could fit a 6.22 OS over two 128K chips, but I don't see why not. After all, both chips will be considered part of the A: drive so as far as the computer is concerned it will see them both as on the same disk. It might be worth a shot.
 

 Good Luck
 

 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3273
Date: Fri, 23 Dec 2016 03:55:38 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Battery disassembly

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I like that approach. I wished I had thought of it!-ShawnP.S. We need a +1 button here in the group! :)Or...maybe move the group to Facebook....

    

As for using lithium ion, my plan was to build the charge management circuitry into the battery case.  That way the built in charging system in the GRiD doesn’t need to know what a lithium ion battery is.  It provides whatever its output voltage is, and the circuitry inside the case handles safely charging and discharging the lithium ion cells.  I’ve seen this approach in a few replacement battery packs lately, for example on Amazon you can find lithium ion replacement battery packs for the Neato XV series vacuuming robots that use this approach.  


  




Yahoo! Message number: 3274
Date: 23 Dec 2016 21:59:02 -0800

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Battery disassembly

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Ah, I see.
 

 My apologies. I should have realized you already understood the problem when I warned about the charging problems. Your solution would be very interesting to see. I hope you get it to work out. 
 

 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3275
Date: 23 Dec 2016 22:11:47 -0800

From: jenniferpiercegs@...

Subject: Re: RTC replacement document?

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So would a ds1287a+ be the same?  Having difficulty finding a ds1287a... 

 Jennifer




Yahoo! Message number: 3276
Date: 24 Dec 2016 13:28:55 -0800

From: wd8cyv@...

Subject: Re: RTC replacement document?

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the only option i have ever heard is to grind the top out and replace only the battery 

 the chip has code common only to that computer and no one seems to knoe how to write a new
 one dave wd8cyv




Yahoo! Message number: 3277
Date: 25 Dec 2016 13:15:35 -0800

From: jenniferpiercegs@...

Subject: Re: RTC replacement document?

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Yeah - so I thought the "right" way was to replace the DS1287 with a DS1287A but I can't find any of them with recent date codes - so putting one in that's already 8 years old seems foolish to me.

So I guess I am doing the grinding thing on the 2 pins and attaching some wires to a CR2032 battery.  (Seems like the most effective long term solution)

Thanks to all!

Happy Holidays!!

Jennifer



Yahoo! Message number: 3278
Date: 26 Dec 2016 09:49:15 -0800

From: touchetek@...

Subject: Re: RTC replacement document?

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Its been a long time since I did the mod.  At that time I was squeemish about removing a part from board.  Today if I could find a part that had the clock chip without the battery, I'd remove the old part and put that in.
I don't recall if there was such a thing.  
Today I might also work with the package differently, like try to 
grind down an area to install the battery on top of rather than running the
wires around the board.  There isn't much space available above the
clock chip, being so thick.



Yahoo! Message number: 3279
Date: Mon, 26 Dec 2016 12:55:01 -0500

From: Justin 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RTC replacement document?





Yahoo! Message number: 3280
Date: 26 Dec 2016 21:30:08 -0800

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RTC replacement document?

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It should fit there, Justin. It sounds like you have no intention of utilizing those EPROM sockets. Even though it requires me to partially disassemble the computer (no more than two screws and removing the back cover, display and bezel, which takes about 30 seconds), I put my 2032 in the same spot where the Tadiran CMOS battery would be. There is room for it and with a 1/4" nylon spacer, I can glue the battery holder easily into place. 
 

 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3281
Date: 26 Dec 2016 21:32:52 -0800

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: RTC replacement document?

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You would have to be sure and drill all the way down to the point of damaging the 1287 because there is absolutely no space between it and the keyboard, which literally sits right on top of the RTC chip. It is still best to locate the new battery somewhere else.



Yahoo! Message number: 3282
Date: 26 Dec 2016 21:34:49 -0800

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: RTC replacement document?

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Hi, Jennifer.
 

 The 1287 and the 1287A are identical with the exception that the 1287A has a RESET feature on it to clear the old data from the memory banks, nothing more. They are completely interchangeable on the GRiD computers.





Yahoo! Message number: 3283
Date: 30 Dec 2016 17:13:27 -0800

From: jenniferpiercegs@...

Subject: Booting...

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I did the repair of the DS1287 where you grind through the outer coating to expose the + and - leads from the existing battery, and ran leads off to a CR2032 making sure to connect - to - and + to +.  I then flipped this thing over and did the reset by connecting and holding pin 12 to pin 18 for 10+ seconds.

I put it all back together and it fires up, but says:

"Time-of-day clock stopped - please set current time"

The hard disk light is lit, but I cannot enter anything - if I press enough keys it starts to beep (guess I filled up the buffer).

Any thoughts on possible next steps?  This is in a Gridcase 1530.

Many, many thanks!

Jennifer
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3284
Date: Fri, 20 Jan 2017 12:27:11 -0500

From: Justin 

Subject: Capacitor and RTC replacement





Yahoo! Message number: 3285
Date: Fri, 20 Jan 2017 23:30:39 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Capacitor and RTC replacement




Justin,Very nice job and very clean soldering. Great work there!Also, thanks for posting the parts list. That is very helpful. I'm also glad to know you can see the hard drive now.Great job!-Shawn

      From: "Justin shadow@darksideresearch.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Friday, January 20, 2017 12:27 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Capacitor and RTC replacement

I actually finished the repairs to my 1520 this back in December so I thought I’d actually write it up and post a few photos.
My 1520 had a nearly dead power supply that smelled like hell when power was applied (as in, plugged into the wall) due to most of the capacitors in it leaking.  this was a crappy job to do since hot glue was gooped into it when it was built, making extraction of components difficult.  Replacing all the caps and rinsing it out with isopropyl and circuit board cleaner resolved these issues.  I selected capacitors based on fitting correctly into the correct location and then prioritizing their service temperature and operating hours.
To that end, here is a component list for replacing all the capacitors with Digikey part numbers.  Due to the way the circuit board is labelled it can be hard to tell what the correct Cxx number is, so for some I did not put the Cxx number and instead labelled as to their physical location.  There are mostly unique per location so it is pretty hard to mix them up.
(2) Filter Caps: 399-7484-ND CAP FILM 0.15UF 10% 275VAC RAD(1) Side Cap:  P19603CT-ND CAP ALUM 100UF 20% 25V RADIAL(2) Center Caps: 1189-2835-ND CAP ALUM 220UF 20% 200V SNAP(1) C10: 1189-2589-NDCAP ALUM 1000UF 20% 25V RADIAL(1) C11: 565-1587-ND CAP ALUM 1800UF 20% 35V RADIAL 
My next steps were to deal with the RTC to see if that would get the hard drive boot working again, and I chose to preemptively replace all the electrolytic capacitors in the machine in the process.  Repairing the RTC allowed the system to detect and boot from the hard drive, on which I found a collection of old DOS games.
These are the capacitors required for the board I refer to as the Backplane that sits between the hard drive cage and the I/O ports, and then the motherboard. In one of these I ordered in quantity 10 even though that is more than needed because the price break made it cheaper than ordering the smaller correct amount.
Backplane:(3) C19, C2, C61: 1189-2589-ND CAP ALUM 1000UF 20% 25V RADIAL(1) C5: P14382-ND CAP ALUM 2200UF 20% 10V RADIAL(1) C27: 1189-1869-ND CAP ALUM 470UF 20% 25V RADIAL(1) C73: 732-9274-1-ND CAP 470 UF 20% 16 V(10) C60, C51, C75, C53, C6, C16: 493-10324-1-ND CAP ALUM 10UF 20% 25V RADIAL(2) C72, C3: 1189-2239-ND CAP ALUM 100UF 20% 25V RADIAL(1) C1: 732-9282-1-ND CAP 150 UF 20% 25 V(1) C20: 1189-1662-1-ND CAP ALUM 100UF 20% 50V RADIAL(1) C74: 732-9517-1-ND .36000 CAP 220 UF 20% 25 V(1) C4: 493-1714-ND CAP ALUM 3300UF 20% 6.3V RADIAL
Motherboard:(1) Battery holder: BH32T-C-G-ND HOLDER CELL 2032 W/GOLD PINS(1) C11A: P5115-ND CAP ALUM 1000UF 20% 6.3V RADIAL(3) C16, C29, C37, C: 4183PHCT-ND CAP ALUM 100UF 20% 6.3V AXIAL(2) C12, C26: 4214PHCT-ND CAP ALUM 47UF 20% 25V AXIAL
I completely desoldered the RTC in order to try to mill it as cleanly as possible, but it could be done even cleaner.  I chose to relocate the battery holder to a location on the side of the power supply frame and pin the wire down with some kapton tape.  I used small amounts of hot glue to relieve stress on the soldered connections to the RTC.

Here is the reworked Backplane board with all the new caps in place:
Here are shots of the locations for replacement caps on the motherboard (new caps are already in place):



On Dec 26, 2016, at 12:55, Justin shadow@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

I am planning to wire the battery holder in under the EPROM door for ease of access when I do the mod sometime this week.

Justin


On Dec 26, 2016, at 12:49, touchetek@gmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Its been a long time since I did the mod.  At that time I was squeemish about removing a part from board.  Today if I could find a part that had the clock chip without the battery, I'd remove the old part and put that in.
I don't recall if there was such a thing.  
Today I might also work with the package differently, like try to 
grind down an area to install the battery on top of rather than running the
wires around the board.  There isn't much space available above the
clock chip, being so thick.










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Yahoo! Message number: 3286
Date: 20 Jan 2017 18:02:33 -0800

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Capacitor and RTC replacement

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Wow, Justin,
 

 Damn good work there. I love it. I am very interested in the replacement of the capacitors now, because I do have several motherboards that are just plain dead, and simply will not fire up. I am hoping that these caps have not shorted out to the point that other components are burned out with them, but unfortunately that may be the case. I was planning on using a scope to try and determine why these boards aren't firing up, but I just haven't gotten around to it due to my work load. I really haven't had hardly any spare time to do any of this. 
 

 But I wonder if anyone has dealt with a dead MoBo yet in this manner, and tried to get it up and running again (provided of course if the backplane power board isn't dead itself). I think I need to try that first, replace the caps on the backplane board on the dead units, and see what happens, provided I can find the output voltages test points and test them to see if there is juice in them. Do you know here to check the power outputs on that backplane, Justin?
 

 Also, on the Backplane board, those caps are strange looking to me, looking more like power transistors, but  they do seem to be replacing capacitors judging from the connection points. Am I right about that? Well, maybe one of these days....
 

 Well, done, Justin!
 

 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3287
Date: 26 Jan 2017 15:46:18 -0800

From: wd8cyv@...

Subject: yahoo changes

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lot of yahoo groups moving to group.io  
is there any original moderators around that can move us if they pull the plug on us here
at grid    wd8cyv at yahoo.com 
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3288
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 2017 05:48:17 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] yahoo changes

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Hello there, Dave.I'm not sure what group.io is. I tried to go there, but it is not a valid domain.I have heard about the Verizon/Yahoo acquisition. I did not even consider that if it goes through, that Verizon would shut down the groups. It is a possibility that I should consider, eh?The *long time* members might remember that this group used to be on egroups.com. Then Yahoo bought egroups.com and changed the domain to Yahoogroups.I assume that if the Verizon-Yahoo deal goes through, and if any domain changes are made, it will be something similar to the previous change. Perhaps the group will be rugrid-laptop@.... Who knows...I have thought about following other groups and moving this to Facebook. How do other members feel about moving this group to Facebook?It's just an idea. I am not making any plans.Thanks,-Shawn
      From: "wd8cyv@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2017 6:46 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] yahoo changes

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lot of yahoo groups moving to group.io 
is there any original moderators around that can move us if they pull the plug on us here
at grid    wd8cyv at yahoo.com












Yahoo! Message number: 3291
Date: 27 Jan 2017 18:24:31 -0800

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] yahoo changes

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Hi, Shawn,
 

 I typed a response out there, but it looks like it didn't go through. So you may see a duplication.
 

 I don't use Facebook myself. I never understood the need to document every single moment of my life onto the internet like the younger kids do, but I do understand the power of its connectivity. I don't really want to sign unless I have to do so.
 

 Nonetheless, I would like to throw out another idea out there. What about taking the group to a private forum with tis own protected URL (https:)? My idea is to use a paid software package which I already own to set up a forum to which the group can transfer the entire database already here on this yahoo group. I have some experience with this as I presently am administrating a small forum with vBulletin software. I already have a license, so there is no cost in using it again for a second forum. I already have an IT guy who helps me with my forum. I can check with him and see how easy it would be to do this. I'm sure we can do this actually, because I already did it before with the forum I run now. There would be some advantages to doing this. No advertisements popping up, more security for the forum, more storage capacity for files and data (much more). SSL certification, which will give us better exposure to the search engines for people seeking us out for advice on GriD computers. and more.
 

 However, it's just a suggestion in case Verizon/Yahoo does plan on deep sixing the yahoo groups as suggested. I would like to throw it out there for your consideration.
 

 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3292
Date: 28 Jan 2017 13:47:27 +0000

From: wd8cyv@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] yahoo changes

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when you go to face book you will loose me  as i will trash all my grids  before i go to face book
to keep them running

there a bunch of snoopers
dave



Yahoo! Message number: 3293
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2017 09:05:13 -0600

From: shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] yahoo changes

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Whoa, Dave. Slow down for a minute. Don't do anything drastic. There is nothing definite.  My plan is to keep things as they are until I am forced to change.As I said in my response to your email, Facebook was just an idea I was thinking about.Another possibilty is talking with the moderators of Vintage Computer Forums and perhaps dedicating a forum for Grid's.Again, just like Phil's response, Facebook, and VCF, there are possibilities *IF* the Yahoo-Verizon deal goes through, and *IF* Verizon shuts down Yahoo Groups.I have  no chamges planned for the near future.-ShawnP.S. Before you throw away your Grid's, you think you could send them to me? ;-)
-------- Original message --------From: "wd8cyv@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Date: 1/28/17  7:47 AM  (GMT-06:00) To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] yahoo changes 













when you go to face book you will loose me  as i will trash all my grids  before i go to face book
to keep them running

there a bunch of snoopers
dave




















Yahoo! Message number: 3294
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2017 09:10:04 -0600

From: Justin 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] yahoo changes





Yahoo! Message number: 3295
Date: 29 Jan 2017 19:07:08 +0000

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] yahoo changes




Something along the lines of osiweb with its forum might be the way to go




Yahoo! Message number: 3296
Date: 29 Jan 2017 23:05:54 +0000

From: wd8cyv@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] yahoo changes

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not ready to give up on the grids yet i use them for rtty (teletype) on ham radio
   
but wanted to draw attention to the fact we may need a place to go..   
and it would be nice if we could take the past posts with us

my grid stuff is on a back burner   as i have a lot of repair to do 
to the house    and a collection of 11 motorcycles to depose of 
many of them toooo rare to just junk or give away
dave wd8cyv a t  yahoo.com

my bad taste with facebook results from them spying  and left wing \
politics



  



Yahoo! Message number: 3297
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2017 20:49:10 -0800

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] yahoo changes





  
    
  
  
    I'm not a fan of facebook, then again, I'm old fashioned. I get
    messages from this group directly to my email inbox, where they are
    then filtered into a specific folder. I read them, keep what I'm
    interested in and delete the rest.

    

    I treat it very much like a Mailman email list.

    

    Another Yahoo group I was with, recently moved to Google groups. I
    configured it the same way, sending all traffic to my email inbox
    and filtering it.

    

    If you were to move away from Yahoo groups, I would want similar
    functionality. If I were to write this as requirements, it would
    look something like this:

    - Ability to receive individual or digest emails

    - Ability to attach photos or other important documents

    - Ability to search archives on-line (either like Mailman or in the
    form of an on-line forum)

    - A repository for documents and photos on-line

    

    If I were doing the move, I would probably consider an on-line forum
    such as v-bulletin, or use Google groups. The fact is, no matter
    what you choose, there may be some who don't like it. If you move
    to facebook, I won't like it, but it will be up to me to adapt or
    drop out.

    

    Whatever you do, please announce it early, give plenty of warning,
    and have the new one up and running, ready for people move when you
    make the first announcement.

    

    Just my two cents (adjusted for inflation),

    Asa Jay

    

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
& Shelley Marie
Spokane, WA
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 1/26/2017 9:48 PM, Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]
    wrote:
    

      
      
          

            

              
Hello
                  there, Dave.

              
I'm not
                  sure what group.io is. I tried to go there, but it is
                  not a valid domain.

              
I
                have heard about the Verizon/Yahoo acquisition. I did
                not even consider that if it goes through, that Verizon
                would shut down the groups. It is a possibility that I
                should consider, eh?

              
The
                *long time* members might remember that this group used
                to be on egroups.com. Then Yahoo bought egroups.com and
                changed the domain to Yahoogroups.

              
I
                assume that if the Verizon-Yahoo dea l goes through, and
                if any domain changes are made, it will be something
                similar to the previous change. Perhaps the group will
                be rugrid-laptop@.... Who knows...

              
I
                have thought about following other groups and moving
                this to Facebook. How do other members feel about moving
                this group to Facebook?

              
It's
                just an idea. I am not making any plans.

              
Thanks,

              
-Shawn

              


              

              

                

                  

                    
 
                        
 From: "wd8cyv@...
                        [RuGRiD-Laptop]"
                        

                        To:
                        RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com 

                        Sent:
                        Thursday, January 26, 2017 6:46 PM

                        Subject:
                        [RuGRiD-Laptop] yahoo changes

                       

                    


                      

                        

                          

                          

                          lot of yahoo groups moving to group.io 

                          is there any original moderators around that
                          can move us if they pull the plug on us here

                          at grid  wd8cyv at yahoo.com 

                          


                            

                          

                          

                        

                        

                        

                      

                    

                  

                

              

            

          

          
      
      
No virus found
        in this message.

        Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

        Version: 2016.0.7998 / Virus Database: 4749/13859 - Release
        Date: 01/29/17

      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3298
Date: 03 Feb 2017 06:04:04 +0000

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] yahoo changes

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Shawn,
 

 Can you give me some information, please. I am just looking into possibilities here. I see the forum has 274 registered members. About how many regular users would you say are there? Also how many total posts are there in the forum? Do we keep all of the jpeg pictures that have been posted?. With this information, I can see how easily it might be to transfer to a vBulletin type forum. Again, I'm not saying we should do this, guys. But it doesn't hurt to look at the possibility.
 

 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3299
Date: 04 Feb 2017 09:15:16 +0000

From: bobsayers2000@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] yahoo changes




It's worth noting that quite a few groups who have moved over to the io platform are reporting quite large shortfalls in membership once the change has been made, presumably due to email addresses on the old platform which were no longer valid.

Other than that, the moves to io seem to have been painless and there is a lot of praise for the level of support.


Bob




Yahoo! Message number: 3300
Date: 13 Feb 2017 03:17:02 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /GRiD Compass Owners Guide.pdf
  Uploaded by : rou021 <rou021@...>
  Description : A brief overview of the GRiD Compass hardware.


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiD%20Compass%20Owners%20Guide.pdf


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


rou021 <rou021@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3301
Date: 13 Feb 2017 03:20:23 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: GRiD Compass manual added and more to come.

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I was going through some files on an old hard drive and found a .pdf of the GRiD Compass Owner's Guide. It's been so long, I can't even remember were I got it (otherwise I'd credit its origin). The guide itself is fairly brief and doesn't really delve into the software, but there's probably still some useful stuff in there.

I also have a number of other GRiD manuals and documentation as well. There's a lot of good stuff on GRiD-OS, InteGRiD, and related software. Unfortunately, I have to scan them all myself and they're quite lengthy. As such, it will probably be a few months until I have the time to scan and sort everything. Rest assured they'll be posted sometime in the next several months.

Additionally, I also have some GRiD software which I should be able to upload much sooner. I just have to organize it all. 





Yahoo! Message number: 3302
Date: Mon, 13 Feb 2017 03:34:11 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GRiD Compass manual added and more to come.

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Hello  Rou,Thank you for the uploads. I looked through the Compass manual. In the Appendix, under Testing the Modem, there is a phone number listed. I wonder if a modem is still connected to that number? ;-)It would be area code 510 (and not 415) now. Maybe if I get bored, I'll call it one day. :)It is a shame that Grid didn't list the pinout of the 15 pin serial connector.
Thank you again for posting. :)-Shawn 

      From: "rou021@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Sunday, February 12, 2017 8:20 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GRiD Compass manual added and more to come.

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I was going through some files on an old hard drive and found a .pdf of the GRiD Compass Owner's Guide. It's been so long, I can't even remember were I got it (otherwise I'd credit its origin). The guide itself is fairly brief and doesn't really delve into the software, but there's probably still some useful stuff in there.

I also have a number of other GRiD manuals and documentation as well. There's a lot of good stuff on GRiD-OS, InteGRiD, and related software. Unfortunately, I have to scan them all myself and they're quite lengthy. As such, it will probably be a few months until I have the time to scan and sort everything. Rest assured they'll be posted sometime in the next several months.

Additionally, I also have some GRiD software which I should be able to upload much sooner. I just have to organize it all.









Yahoo! Message number: 3303
Date: 13 Feb 2017 04:07:27 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Ian,

Since this is an old thread, I'm not sure if you were able to solve your problem. Nonetheless, there is a way to transfer files between GRiD-OS and MS-DOS. You just have to run InteGRiD in DOS and then run the GBridge utility within InteGRiD. GBridge will allow InteGRiD to read GRiD-OS format disks and files after it's been activated. You can then use GRiDManager (within InteGRiD) to transfer files back and forth from one disk to another. I've been able to do this without many issues. Keep in mind that transferring files from GRiD-OS to MS-DOS can result in changing of the file name though. GBridge should be on one of the InteGRiD disks in the file section. 

There's another GRiD-OS/InteGRiD utility that performs a related function called GRiDTranslate. It'll convert files for certain GRiD programs (e.g. GRiDWrite, GRiDPlan, GRiDFile etc.) to work with their DOS equivalent, such as Lotus 1-2-3,  dBase II, and the like. I've never used this, so I can't comment on how to use it (or how well it works). I might have a copy if you need it.

I have some manuals that explain a bit more about GBridge and GRiDTranslate that I'll be uploading down the road. If you have any questions, however, I can dig them out and take a few pictures of the relevant pages if need be. 

Hope this helps.

Chris



Yahoo! Message number: 3304
Date: 13 Feb 2017 04:33:14 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: Gridserver

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Grant,

How's the restoration going? If you're still have trouble, I have some GRiD manuals that mention connecting to some of the various peripherals. I don't know if this will help, but according to one of the GRiD-OS ones, the Compass needs specific files to access certain external devices. Here's the excerpt:

 "CAUTION: The following files are always needed, regardless of the application you use:

CCOS
Common
Executive

The following additional files are needed for GRiD Central and external file server devices as noted.

GRiD Central: GRiDManager, PhoneLink, and Modem.

External file server device: GRiDManager, and GRiDLink (when connected by a cable link) or GRiDManager, Modem, and PhoneLink (when connected over telephone lines)."


I also have a GRiD Server for MS-DOS and PC-DOS User's Guide. I intend to scan it with all of my other GRiD documents in a few months, but if there's anything specific you want me to look up in it, let me know.

Chris
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3305
Date: 13 Feb 2017 04:50:29 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] GRiD Compass manual added and more to come.

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



A shame indeed. Let me know if you ever call that number. I'm curious what's on the other end now.

Chris



Yahoo! Message number: 3306
Date: 13 Feb 2017 04:51:27 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: GRiDMAN

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Ian and Grant,

Would either one of you be able to send me some copies of the Compass software on floppy disk? I suspect you may have a lot of the GRiD software I've been trying to find for year. I can pay for shipping and the cost of the disks if you need me to. I can also transfer them over to DOS to work with InteGRiD and upload them to file section to help with archiving.

Thanks,

Chris



Yahoo! Message number: 3307
Date: 14 Feb 2017 01:58:49 +0000

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: Gridserver

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Any documents on grid server would be helpfull, I have not got up the guts to do the head swap on the grid server drive.



Yahoo! Message number: 3308
Date: 14 Feb 2017 02:01:33 +0000

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: GRiDMAN

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Do you have a way to make floppies with imd .? I archived all my disks and sent Ian a copy to verify that they are good archives. I'm out of 5 1/4 right now but your best bet is to burn new ones from the imd images.



Yahoo! Message number: 3309
Date: 15 Feb 2017 05:43:59 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: GRiDMAN

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Unfortunately, I can't really make floppies from .imd images. Every time I try on my setup, I always run into issues. I just can't seem to make a working disk. Even the MS-DOS 2.0 image in the files section gives me problems. Maybe I'm doing something wrong, I'm not sure. As result, I figured floppies might be easier. If you need any, I can send you a bunch of blank 5.25" floppies (I can also include some of the GRiD-OS software I have with them, if there's any you don't).



Yahoo! Message number: 3310
Date: 16 Feb 2017 03:56:58 +0000

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: GRiDMAN

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I have no problem making disks for you if you send some but im in canada and if your in us it might be easier and more cost effective if some one in the us does it.

Cheers



Yahoo! Message number: 3311
Date: 22 Feb 2017 05:55:25 +0000

From: bigbrassring@...

Subject: Double check GRiD board

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Thought I'd let you all know I still read this...
Well, probably posted this in the wrong place.  Please correct, it's been a long time since I've had 10 minutes to share without hearing nagging in the background.

To Shawn;
Anytime one can cull up these files and post them - Bravado!
Even if they're repeated, they can not be found anywhere else but from enthusiasts here on a board like this one.  And there could be variations.  You might put them into a unique folder on the board?

I need to do this myself for all of you in the group.  I have a few batch files that shortcut stuff, and techniques for low level formatting the old Conner/JVC drives.  I could only do it using DR DOS 7 in the 1230's, and it wasn't exactly intuitive.  But - it worked, and one could change numerous parameters.  I need to pull it all together.  

Most of my hard drives now have stiction, and not really sure how to address that. I don't think WD40 would help in the least, folks please don't do that. Bearing swap is an obvious no. For those that have it, a slap on the back at boot time (while the drive is clicking trying to wind up the platter) would sometimes get the baby breathing, but can't be a good long term sign.  Long time running afterwards once running helps.  Let's face it, it's not my "go to" PC, and I don't use them often enough.

Anyone else have LL formatting or drive tips and tricks (especially for stiction?}?  These were 20MB JVC drives in the 1230's.  That was my forte into GRiD. 

Somewhere I have the PROM chips for 3.2.  Always wanted to get at least 3.3, maybe even 5.0 on the Gridcase 1230 Prom board.  Never spent enough time to figure out how.  I thought 5.0 wouldn't even fit. Anyone?  Lots of features in 5.0 that couldn't be used, so you could exclude them in the 1230's.

Damn Dallas chips didn't help, either.  I haven't done the mod but do hope it works.   Still have to enter date/time to be accurate NMW.

I have some pen units, but it seems impossible to find the damn touch pens.  What happened to all of them?  
I have one I bought as an AST.  That was during the closeout era.  Still works perfect, just the moniker is replastered on it.  And that pen works...

Keep posting, we're still here :)

Cheers, Gene
AKA Hugh :))

Apologize if I have my inventory model numbers wrong, I'm going from memory... (SIPPing some Johnny Walker)

1230
1520
1530
1550
1560
1570 





Yahoo! Message number: 3312
Date: 22 Feb 2017 05:51:21 +0000

From: bigbrassring@...

Subject: Re: GRiD Compass manual added and more to come.

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Well, probably posted this in the wrong place.  Please correct, it's been a long time since I've had 10 minutes to share here without hearing nagging in the background.

Shawn;
Anytime one can cull up these files and post them - Bravado!
Even if they're repeated, they can not be found anywhere else but from enthusiasts here on a board like this one.  And there could be variations.  You might put them into a unique folder on the board?

I need to do this myself for all of you in the group.  I have a few batch files that shortcut stuff, and techniques for low level formatting the old Conner/JVC drives.  I could only do it using DR DOS 7, and it wasn't always exactly intuitive.  But - it worked, and one could change numerous parameters,  I need to pull it all together.  

Most of my hard drives now have stiction, and not really sure how to address that. I don't think WD40 would help in the least, folks please don't do that. Bearing swap is an obvious no. For those that have it, a slap on the back at boot time (while the drive is clicking trying to wind up the platter) would sometimes get the baby breathing, but can't be a good long term sign.  Long time running afterwards once running helps.  Let's face it, it's not my "go to" PC, and I don't use them often enough.

Anyone else have LL formatting or drive tips and tricks (especially for stiction?}?  These were 20MB JVC drives in the 1230's.  That was my forte into GRiD. 

Somewhere I have the PROM chips for 3.2.  Always wanted to get at least 3.3, maybe even 5.0 on the Gridcase 1230 Prom board.  Never spent enough time to figure out how.  I thought 5.0 wouldn't even fit. Anyone?  Lots of features in 5.0 that couldn't be used, so you could exclude them in the 1230's.

Damn Dallas chips didn't help, either.  I haven't done the mod but do hope it works.   Still have to enter date/time to be accurate NMW.

I have some pen units, but it seems impossible to find the damn touch pens.  What happened to all of them?  
I have one I bought as an AST.  That was during the closeout era.  Still works perfect, just the moniker is replastered on it.  And that pen works...

Keep posting, we're still here :)

Cheers, Gene
AKA Hugh :))

Apologize if I have my inventory model numbers wrong, I'm going from memory... (SIPPing some Johnny Walker)

1230
1520
1530
1550
1560
1570



Yahoo! Message number: 3313
Date: 22 Feb 2017 18:33:26 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: GRiDMAN

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Good point. In light of that, I tried to make working disks from some of the images in the file section again this past weekend. The good news is I was able to make a working copy of the GRiD MS-DOS 2.0 image. It took some trial and error, but I got it written and it's working just fine on my Compass (it's great to finally be able to use DOS on one). Sadly, this was not the case for any of the GRiD-OS images. I can't seem to get one successfully written yet.
 

 One of the main issues is I can't get ImageDisk to run on my one GRiDCASE that can use the external 5.25" floppy. I have to run it from the 3.5" drive to write directly to the 5.25". Unfortunately, it seems to always crash or give me errors when ImageDisk is run from floppy (the same thing happens on my other GRiDs). I don't have this issue when I run it from one with a hard drive, but those only have 3.5" drives. So to get it to work, I have to run ImageDisk from the hard drive and write the 5.25" 320k image (also on the hard drive) to a 3.5" 720k floppy disk. So far, this has only worked for the MS-DOS image. I'm not sure if I'm using the wrong settings, it needs a 5.25" drive for writing GRiD-OS stuff, or something else. I just can't figure out why it's not working.
 

 I have a 10-year-old PC and an internal 5.25" floppy drive tucked away. I don't know if it'll make a difference, but I'll try to dig that out and see if I can get the disks made with it in the next few days. We'll see if that works first. Fingers crossed.
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3314
Date: 23 Feb 2017 05:45:48 +0000

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: GRiDMAN

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I would setup your old pc and write to the 5.25,  if its a 1.2 drive make sure you use double step 

Its nice to keep a legacy system going for working with old images

in the workshop i run a sbc core 2 duo E7600 ,4gb ram with 8 isa, 8 pci,4 serial, 2 parallel 6 usb, combination of 360 , 1.2, 720 or 1.44 drives
1tb sata main drive with removable tray for old ide drives still trying to get it to run mfm drive's

win 98 ,xp and debian , covers just about everything i need to do with retro stuff

good luck and keep us posted



Yahoo! Message number: 3315
Date: 26 Feb 2017 05:52:32 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: GRiDMAN

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



My gaming rig circa 2006 still has some usefulness. Looks like the old PC worked...sort of. It took a while to get the 5.25" portion of the drive to work (I have one of those 5.25/3.5 combo drives), but I got the PC to recognize it. After that, I booted from a USB drive (formatted to boot DOS), ran ImageDisk (using double step like you suggested), and was able to write the images to disk. Finally, GRiD-OS read the disks. I did run into some issues though.

First, I couldn't boot directly from the GRiD-OS disk (GRIDOS.IMD). It gave me a "checksum error". It was odd because, if you booted from something else, you could read the files and run the programs on this disk just fine.

Next was a peculiar issue with GRiDPlan on the GRIDMT image. I could run it just fine from my 1101, but when I ran it from my GRiDCase Plus, all the cells would say "error". It happened with every worksheet file, including the new blank one you get when you start GRiDPlan up. Initially, I thought that maybe the first version of GRiDPlan couldn't run on GRiDCases. Then I remembered, however, a demo copy I have of GRiDPlan doesn't have this issue. None of the other programs on the disk seem to have issues.

I don't know what the issue could be. Maybe I chose some of the wrong settings? Here are the ImageDisk settings I used with my 1.2MB drive:

Drive: A
Cylinders: 40
Sides: Two
Double-step: On
R/W gap: Calculated
Format gap: Calculated
Format fill: E5
Full analysis: Yes
Interleave: Best Guess
Retries: 5
Keep bad sector: No
500kbps -> 500kbps
300kbps -> 300kbps
250kbps -> 300kbps

The fact that I was able to write the GRiD-OS disk images and have them work at all is at least a step in the right direction though. If you have any additional GRiD disk images already, I might finally be able to try them out now. Whether or not everything on the resultant disks work exactly as they're supposed to is a different matter.



Yahoo! Message number: 3316
Date: 28 Feb 2017 02:01:18 +0000

From: wd8cyv@...

Subject: Re: GRiDMAN

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



dave here  been years since i been on here   i have image disks for a 4 or 5 disk build set of a combo of dos6 and 622 any one intrested   i think the images can be burnd to new floppies on an xp machine
 i may have a 98 that can be made to work
 a compleate address is needed to snale mail them to    i will look for the master cd
 

 make a good box to work on the old grid stuff and i may have an image of 3,3 grid dos 
 in with the whole thing
 dave     wd8cyv    at   yahoo doot com
 

 dave





Yahoo! Message number: 3317
Date: 28 Feb 2017 03:30:43 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: GRiDMAN

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Thanks for the offer, Dave. I think winworldpc.com already has images for MS-DOS 6.0 and 6.22, but if you have an image for GRiD MS-DOS 3.3, you can always upload it to the files section here.



Yahoo! Message number: 3318
Date: 28 Feb 2017 23:16:11 +0000

From: wd8cyv@...

Subject: Re: GRiDMAN

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



it used to be on here for the 3.3 grid dos but some one erased it or i can not find it dave




Yahoo! Message number: 3319
Date: 28 Feb 2017 23:37:59 +0000

From: wd8cyv@...

Subject: Re: GRiDMAN

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



i found them   about 21 down the page is a text file and about 3 or 4 up from the bottom of page is the image builder file
 may need a win 98 or older computer and is image for 1.44 meg empty floppies 
 formatted and  tested     bad floppy equals bad disk
 

 lots of info about grid 1520's in the 3.3 os help files   
 and the big dos 5 book is a good reference for the custom version of 6/6.22
 

 asking me questions may not work to good as i had a motor cycle wreck in dec 2007 
 and was out of service for about 5 days on life support   some of its still in me some of it is missing
 

 in the poster column look for wd8cyv
 and the version of dos 6/6.22 i have are setup disks that combine the 2 systems and erase the junk that causes problems   its a stable load of dos for old machines with cd support and you can load win 3,1 on top
 good luck dave wd8cyv        




Yahoo! Message number: 3320
Date: Tue, 28 Feb 2017 21:40:57 -0700

From: shawnerz 

Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRiDMAN

text/plain; charset=utf-8



For the record, I haven't erased anything.-Shawn
-------- Original message --------From: "wd8cyv@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Date: 2/28/17  4:16 PM  (GMT-07:00) To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRiDMAN 













it used to be on here for the 3.3 grid dos but some one erased it or i can not find itdave




















Yahoo! Message number: 3321
Date: 01 Mar 2017 08:52:36 +0000

From: ianfinder@...

Subject: Re: GRiDMAN




The images Grant made appear to work beautifully.
I can try writing out a media set- I'm located in Seattle.



Yahoo! Message number: 3322
Date: 01 Mar 2017 08:54:44 +0000

From: ianfinder@...

Subject: Re: GRiDMAN




Grant: would you upload the IMDs you took to this group? Or do you mind if I do? I also have mediaformat here. I want to get organized and put all the compass stuff together.



Yahoo! Message number: 3323
Date: 01 Mar 2017 19:23:32 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: GRiDMAN

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Ian,

To make things a bit easier, I can try the .IMDs first if Grant would be okay with you sharing them. 

BTW, were you still looking for copies of GRiDTransfer and MediaPartition? I think I might have those. I already have some GRiD-OS software, including some later issue GRiDCase stuff from ROM and 3.5" floppies. For example, I have a GRiD-OS system disk that's as late as version 3.1.6E. If there's anything you're after, let me know. I intend to catalog all of the GRiD software I currently have. Once I take inventory so I know what's what, I'll upload everything here. In the meantime, if there's something in particular you're after, let me know, I'll try to get it to you.

I intend to do the same thing for all of the GRiD documentation I have before I scan everything. Off the top of my head, I know a large portion of it is from the Compass era, in addition to some later stuff. Considering how much I have, that's going to take far longer than the software. As such, I probably won't get started scanning for a couple of months (I should have plenty of free time for it then). Nonetheless, I hope to share as much of it as possible as some of the GRiD software (and hardware) can be quite cryptic without it--not to mention the historical value.

Chris



Yahoo! Message number: 3324
Date: 02 Mar 2017 01:12:40 +0000

From: klyball@...

Subject: Re: GRiDMAN

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Ian:

add it your compass stuff and put it up all together be more organized that way

Grant



Yahoo! Message number: 3325
Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2017 19:38:26 -0700

From: shawnerz 

Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRiDMAN

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Thank you very much in advance for all of your work. I know many people will appreciate it.-Shawn
-------- Original message --------From: "rou021@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Date: 3/1/17  12:23 PM  (GMT-07:00) To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRiDMAN 













Ian,

To make things a bit easier, I can try the .IMDs first if Grant would be okay with you sharing them. 

BTW,
 were you still looking for copies of GRiDTransfer and MediaPartition? I
 think I might have those. I already have some GRiD-OS software, 
including some later issue GRiDCase stuff from ROM and 3.5" floppies. 
For example, I have a GRiD-OS system disk that's as late as version 
3.1.6E. If there's anything you're after, let me know. I intend to 
catalog all of the GRiD software I currently have. Once I take inventory
 so I know what's what, I'll upload everything here. In the meantime, if
 there's something in particular you're after, let me know, I'll try to 
get it to you.

I intend to do the same thing for all of the GRiD 
documentation I have before I scan everything. Off the top of my head, I
 know a large portion of it is from the Compass era, in addition to some
 later stuff. Considering how much I have, that's going to take far 
longer than the software. As such, I probably won't get started scanning
 for a couple of months (I should have plenty of free time for it then).
 Nonetheless, I hope to share as much of it as possible as some of the 
GRiD software (and hardware) can be quite cryptic without it--not to 
mention the historical value.

Chris




















Yahoo! Message number: 3326
Date: 03 Mar 2017 02:20:17 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRiDMAN

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I'm just happy to help out. I also know what it's like to be on the other end. Without some of the manuals, I'd have been pretty lost with GRiD-OS, InteGRiD, and the hardware. The same goes for some of the GRiD software I have. I figure hoarding all my stuff doesn't do anyone any good and this could be helpful to somebody. 

It's also wise to get some sort of archive or record of this stuff for historical reasons. While some of it may have survived a few decades, it won't last forever.



Yahoo! Message number: 3327
Date: 07 Mar 2017 23:53:33 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Packet Driver

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Does anybody know the proper packet driver to use with a Grid 1520s modem?





Yahoo! Message number: 3328
Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2017 17:20:52 -0700

From: shawnerz 

Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Packet Driver

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Packet driver? This must be beyond my skill level.In the past, I used Procomm Plus to talk to it. It used standard Hayes 'at' commands.-Shawn
-------- Original message --------From: "joshuaparkour@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Date: 3/7/17  4:53 PM  (GMT-07:00) To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Packet Driver 













Does anybody know the proper packet driver to use with a Grid 1520s modem?





















Yahoo! Message number: 3329
Date: 08 Mar 2017 00:41:33 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Packet Driver

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I would use Kermit to talk directly to it if need be. 
 I was seeing if I could get my 1520 online using a packet driver to be able to use TCP/IP to go online with a version of DOSLynx. 






Yahoo! Message number: 3331
Date: 08 Mar 2017 02:48:59 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /GRiD-OS 3.1.5D Disk.zip
  Uploaded by : rou021 <rou021@...>
  Description : Contains GRiD-OS 3.1.5D disk image, DOS disk imaging utility, and a list of the disk's contents.


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiD-OS%203.1.5D%20Disk.zip


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


rou021 <rou021@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3332
Date: 08 Mar 2017 02:54:52 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Found and uploaded a GRiD-OS 3.1.5 disk image

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While we're waiting for that batch of disk images to get added, I uploaded a GRiD-OS disk image I found on an old hard drive. Like the Compass Owner's Guide, I have no idea where I found it (I've probably had it more than ten years and forgot about it), so I can't credit the source. It seems to be a system disk for GRiD-OS 3.1.5D. The volume label also has "Windows" in the title, so I assume it supports the multitasking window function like in InteGRiD (I never realized GRiD-OS itself supported this feature before). 

I've listed the disk contents in a text file with the .zip. I believe this was from a 360KB, 5.25" disk so it would probably be best to write to that. To actually write the image, you'll need to use DISKPC.exe included in the .zip file (it's the floppy image utility for DOS that came with it). 

Hopefully, I can get around to archiving and uploading my own disks soon as well. 

 

 Chris

 





Yahoo! Message number: 3333
Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2017 23:43:44 -0700

From: shawnerz 

Subject: RE: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Found and uploaded a GRiD-OS 3.1.5 disk image

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Thanks for the upload, Chris!
-------- Original message --------From: "rou021@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Date: 3/7/17  7:54 PM  (GMT-07:00) To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Found and uploaded a GRiD-OS 3.1.5 disk image 













While we're waiting for that batch of disk images to get added, I uploaded a GRiD-OS disk image I found on an old hard drive. Like the Compass Owner's Guide, I have no idea where I found it (I've probably had it more than ten years and forgot about it), so I can't credit the source. It seems to be a system disk for GRiD-OS 3.1.5D. The volume label also has "Windows" in the title, so I assume it supports the multitasking window function like in InteGRiD (I never realized GRiD-OS itself supported this feature before). 

I've listed the disk contents in a text file with the .zip. I believe this was from a 360KB, 5.25" disk so it would probably be best to write to that. To actually write the image, you'll need to use DISKPC.exe included in the .zip file (it's the floppy image utility for DOS that came with it). 

Hopefully, I can get around to archiving and uploading my own disks soon as well. 

Chris






















Yahoo! Message number: 3334
Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2017 05:09:50 +0000 (UTC)

From: Ian Finder 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Copying files from DOS or a modern system to a GRiD compass?

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Thanks, Chris.I did get this to work. Grant sent me his CCOS media set which included a utility that can read/write DOS-formatted floppies on the Compass. Woohoo!

    On Sunday, February 12, 2017 8:07 PM, "rou021@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


     Ian,

Since this is an old thread, I'm not sure if you were able to solve your problem. Nonetheless, there is a way to transfer files between GRiD-OS and MS-DOS. You just have to run InteGRiD in DOS and then run the GBridge utility within InteGRiD. GBridge will allow InteGRiD to read GRiD-OS format disks and files after it's been activated. You can then use GRiDManager (within InteGRiD) to transfer files back and forth from one disk to another. I've been able to do this without many issues. Keep in mind that transferring files from GRiD-OS to MS-DOS can result in changing of the file name though. GBridge should be on one of the InteGRiD disks in the file section.

There's another GRiD-OS/InteGRiD utility that performs a related function called GRiDTranslate. It'll convert files for certain GRiD programs (e.g. GRiDWrite, GRiDPlan, GRiDFile etc.) to work with their DOS equivalent, such as Lotus 1-2-3,  dBase II, and the like. I've never used this, so I can't comment on how to use it (or how well it works). I might have a copy if you need it.

I have some manuals that explain a bit more about GBridge and GRiDTranslate that I'll be uploading down the road. If you have any questions, however, I can dig them out and take a few pictures of the relevant pages if need be.

Hope this helps.

Chris  #yiv5221855233 #yiv5221855233 -- #yiv5221855233ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv5221855233 #yiv5221855233ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv5221855233 #yiv5221855233ygrp-mkp #yiv5221855233hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv5221855233 #yiv5221855233ygrp-mkp #yiv5221855233ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv5221855233 #yiv5221855233ygrp-mkp .yiv5221855233ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv5221855233 #yiv5221855233ygrp-mkp .yiv5221855233ad p {margin:0;}#yiv5221855233 #yiv5221855233ygrp-mkp .yiv5221855233ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}#yiv5221855233 #yiv5221855233ygrp-sponsor #yiv5221855233ygrp-lc {font-family:Arial;}#yiv5221855233 #yiv5221855233ygrp-sponsor #yiv5221855233ygrp-lc #yiv5221855233hd {margin:10px 0px;font-weight:700;font-size:78%;line-height:122%;}#yiv5221855233 #yiv5221855233ygrp-sponsor #yiv5221855233ygrp-lc .yiv5221855233ad {margin-bottom:10px;padding:0 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Yahoo! Message number: 3335
Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2017 05:21:02 +0000 (UTC)

From: Ian Finder 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRiD Compass manual added and more to come.

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You don't happen to have the Pascal compiler, the Assembler, the PL/M compiler, or any of that stuff do you? I have development foundations but none of the frontend assemblers or compilers.

    On Tuesday, February 21, 2017 10:04 PM, "bigbrassring@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


     Well, probably posted this in the wrong place.  Please correct, it's been a long time since I've had 10 minutes to share here without hearing nagging in the background.

Shawn;
Anytime one can cull up these files and post them - Bravado!
Even if they're repeated, they can not be found anywhere else but from enthusiasts here on a board like this one.  And there could be variations.  You might put them into a unique folder on the board?

I need to do this myself for all of you in the group.  I have a few batch files that shortcut stuff, and techniques for low level formatting the old Conner/JVC drives.  I could only do it using DR DOS 7, and it wasn't always exactly intuitive.  But - it worked, and one could change numerous parameters,  I need to pull it all together. 

Most of my hard drives now have stiction, and not really sure how to address that. I don't think WD40 would help in the least, folks please don't do that. Bearing swap is an obvious no. For those that have it, a slap on the back at boot time (while the drive is clicking trying to wind up the platter) would sometimes get the baby breathing, but can't be a good long term sign.  Long time running afterwards once running helps.  Let's face it, it's not my "go to" PC, and I don't use them often enough.

Anyone else have LL formatting or drive tips and tricks (especially for stiction?}?  These were 20MB JVC drives in the 1230's.  That was my forte into GRiD.

Somewhere I have the PROM chips for 3.2.  Always wanted to get at least 3.3, maybe even 5.0 on the Gridcase 1230 Prom board.  Never spent enough time to figure out how.  I thought 5.0 wouldn't even fit. Anyone?  Lots of features in 5.0 that couldn't be used, so you could exclude them in the 1230's.

Damn Dallas chips didn't help, either.  I haven't done the mod but do hope it works.   Still have to enter date/time to be accurate NMW.

I have some pen units, but it seems impossible to find the damn touch pens.  What happened to all of them? 
I have one I bought as an AST.  That was during the closeout era.  Still works perfect, just the moniker is replastered on it.  And that pen works...

Keep posting, we're still here :)

Cheers, Gene
AKA Hugh :))

Apologize if I have my inventory model numbers wrong, I'm going from memory... (SIPPing some Johnny Walker)

1230
1520
1530
1550
1560
1570  #yiv1254046151 #yiv1254046151 -- #yiv1254046151ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv1254046151 #yiv1254046151ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv1254046151 #yiv1254046151ygrp-mkp #yiv1254046151hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv1254046151 #yiv1254046151ygrp-mkp #yiv1254046151ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv1254046151 #yiv1254046151ygrp-mkp .yiv1254046151ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv1254046151 #yiv1254046151ygrp-mkp .yiv1254046151ad p {margin:0;}#yiv1254046151 #yiv1254046151ygrp-mkp .yiv1254046151ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}#yiv1254046151 #yiv1254046151ygrp-sponsor #yiv1254046151ygrp-lc {font-family:Arial;}#yiv1254046151 #yiv1254046151ygrp-sponsor #yiv1254046151ygrp-lc #yiv1254046151hd {margin:10px 0px;font-weight:700;font-size:78%;line-height:122%;}#yiv1254046151 #yiv1254046151ygrp-sponsor #yiv1254046151ygrp-lc .yiv1254046151ad {margin-bottom:10px;padding:0 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Yahoo! Message number: 3336
Date: 09 Mar 2017 05:34:38 +0000

From: ianfinder@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] RS-232 serial port

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Hey Grant, sorry I've been off the yahoo group for a while. What document did these come from? Do you have a technical reference or repair manual? theory of operation? something like that?




Yahoo! Message number: 3337
Date: 09 Mar 2017 05:59:28 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRiD Compass manual added and more to come.

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I'm afraid I don't have any GRiD development software (outside of the floppies someone posted in the file section awhile back). The same goes for development documentation. 

 Chris




Yahoo! Message number: 3338
Date: 10 Mar 2017 03:09:56 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /GRiD 1660 Disks.zip
  Uploaded by : rou021 <rou021@...>
  Description : MS-DOS 5.0 and Utility Disks for the GRiD 1660/1660c. Images are in .ima format (WinImage).


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiD%201660%20Disks.zip


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


rou021 <rou021@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3339
Date: 10 Mar 2017 03:31:28 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /GRiD 2260 Utilities and Diagnostics Disk.zip
  Uploaded by : rou021 <rou021@...>
  Description : GRiD 2260 Bootable Utility Disk. Image is in .ima format (WinImage). 


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiD%202260%20Utilities%20and%20Diagnostics%20Disk.zip


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


rou021 <rou021@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3340
Date: 10 Mar 2017 04:10:56 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Floppy images for GRiD 1660 and 2260 added

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



 I've added images of my GRiD 1660 disks, which included the three MS-DOS 5.0 disks and a utility disk. I also added the Utilities and Diagnostics disk for the 2260. I have the two install disks for Windows for Pen Computing 1.0 for the 2260, but I figured adding that would be redundant since we already seem to have the contents of them in the file section. I may have some other DOS-based GRiD software, but I'll have to root around for it. If I do, however, it won't be images directly from the official disks (they'll probably just be assorted files).
 

 I also have several GRiD-OS 3.5" floppies I've yet to upload. They contain later version software intended for use with the GRiDCase series (though most of it still works perfectly fine on the Compass series). One of the disks is a GRiD-OS boot disk (version 3.1.6E), which contains a newer version of Initialize Media. This is quite useful since the older versions of the utility made for the Compass don't work properly for 720KB floppies.

 

 Given that these disks are formatted for GRiD-OS, I can't use WinImage to archive them. As such, I'll have to take the time to figure how to make proper images with ImageDisk (and then test them to make sure they work). Once I do that, I'll upload them. Like the remaining DOS stuff, I have some additional GRiD-OS software too, but I'll have to got through my files to see what's what. 

 

 Chris





Yahoo! Message number: 3341
Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2017 07:44:40 +0000 (UTC)

From: Ian Finder 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRiD Compass manual added and more to come.

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



I have the docs. I will upload them soon. For now, I uploaded the GRiD Compass MS-DOS development manual and the GRiD CCOS Basic Manuals

    On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 9:59 PM, "rou021@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


     I'm afraid I don't have any GRiD development software (outside of the floppies someone posted in the file section awhile back). The same goes for development documentation.
Chris  #yiv2457034398 #yiv2457034398 -- #yiv2457034398ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv2457034398 #yiv2457034398ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv2457034398 #yiv2457034398ygrp-mkp #yiv2457034398hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv2457034398 #yiv2457034398ygrp-mkp #yiv2457034398ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv2457034398 #yiv2457034398ygrp-mkp .yiv2457034398ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv2457034398 #yiv2457034398ygrp-mkp .yiv2457034398ad p {margin:0;}#yiv2457034398 #yiv2457034398ygrp-mkp .yiv2457034398ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}#yiv2457034398 #yiv2457034398ygrp-sponsor #yiv2457034398ygrp-lc {font-family:Arial;}#yiv2457034398 #yiv2457034398ygrp-sponsor #yiv2457034398ygrp-lc #yiv2457034398hd {margin:10px 0px;font-weight:700;font-size:78%;line-height:122%;}#yiv2457034398 #yiv2457034398ygrp-sponsor #yiv2457034398ygrp-lc .yiv2457034398ad {margin-bottom:10px;padding:0 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Yahoo! Message number: 3342
Date: 10 Mar 2017 07:45:33 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /GRiD CCOS - GRiDbasic Reference/GRiDbasic-0-UpgradeNotes.pdf
  Uploaded by : ianfinder <ianfinder@...>
  Description : 


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiD%20CCOS%20-%20GRiDbasic%20Reference/GRiDbasic-0-UpgradeNotes.pdf


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


ianfinder <ianfinder@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3343
Date: 10 Mar 2017 07:46:26 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /GRiD CCOS - GRiDbasic Reference/GRiDbasic-1.pdf.zip
  Uploaded by : ianfinder <ianfinder@...>
  Description : 


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiD%20CCOS%20-%20GRiDbasic%20Reference/GRiDbasic-1.pdf.zip


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


ianfinder <ianfinder@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3344
Date: 10 Mar 2017 07:46:46 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /GRiD CCOS - GRiDbasic Reference/GRiDbasic-2.pdf.zip
  Uploaded by : ianfinder <ianfinder@...>
  Description : 


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiD%20CCOS%20-%20GRiDbasic%20Reference/GRiDbasic-2.pdf.zip


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


ianfinder <ianfinder@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3345
Date: 10 Mar 2017 07:47:43 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /GRiDcompass-MSDOS-technical.pdf.zip
  Uploaded by : ianfinder <ianfinder@...>
  Description : 


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiDcompass-MSDOS-technical.pdf.zip


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


ianfinder <ianfinder@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3346
Date: 10 Mar 2017 23:57:02 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRiD Compass manual added and more to come.

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Thanks for the document uploads, Ian! These are quite helpful. It should make it easier to figure out GRiDBASIC. I also didn't realize there were custom GRiD versions of WordStar, Multiplan, and Lotus 1-2-3. Interesting. I guess that's more elusive GRiD software to track down. I can't wait to see what's on those floppy images too. 

Chris



Yahoo! Message number: 3347
Date: 11 Mar 2017 17:43:41 +0000

From: rz221ebay@...

Subject: Re: Looking to buy any GRiD in any condition except LCD-based.

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I have a 1520 red that boots from the floppy, HD is bad. Bad On/Off switch (bridged the connection) Otherwise pretty good.



Yahoo! Message number: 3348
Date: 11 Mar 2017 17:50:17 +0000

From: vladimirhadzic@...

Subject: Re: Looking to buy any GRiD in any condition except LCD-based.

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Hi, rz221ebay, i'm interested in it. But i'm not the thread owner and i think he get's first dibs :). So i he passes i'm interested.

How much is it? And are you willing to ship it to europe by any chance?

Thank you in advance.



Yahoo! Message number: 3349
Date: 11 Mar 2017 19:36:19 +0000

From: rz221ebay@...

Subject: GridCase 1520 Hard Drive matches?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I saw a message that 6 Conner HD models will work with the OE Bios.
 Mine (dead) is a CP-3024, a friend says he has a working CP-3044.
 The pic he sent looks like the same board!
 I'm hoping that's one of them.
 Also, is there a chance the CMOS battery will recharge with plug-in time?
 If not, where/what is it?




Yahoo! Message number: 3350
Date: 14 Mar 2017 22:10:49 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /GRiD-OS disks for GRiDCase.zip
  Uploaded by : rou021 <rou021@...>
  Description : Contains GRiD-OS system software, applications, and utilities intended for use with the GRiDCase series.


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiD-OS%20disks%20for%20GRiDCase.zip


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


rou021 <rou021@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3351
Date: 14 Mar 2017 22:17:38 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Uploaded newer GRiD-OS software for GRiDCase

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I finally made disk images from the 3.5" GRiD-OS disks I had for the GRiDCase and uploaded them to the files section. The disks were:

GRiD-OS v3.1.6E
GRiD-OS/MS-DOS Utilities v3.1.7
GRiDAccess 3.1.6
GRiDMaster 3.1.7
Getting Started w/ GRiDMaster 3.1.5

The Getting Started disk also has demo versions of some of the Management Tools programs. This demo version of GRiDPlan works just fine on all of my GRiDCases. The older version of GRiDPlan doesn't seem to work on ones without an 8087 (Too bad the newer one is only a demo). The Utilities disk has the GRiD-OS/MS-DOS partitioning program along with GRiDTransfer. The GRiD-OS disk, while having newer versions of the files on the earlier Compass disk (like the formatting utility that actually works with 3.5" floppies), also has a virtual floppy utility called Temporary Disk, ScanCase for GRiD-OS, some GRiDCase specific drivers for GRiD-OS, and a ton of fonts. This disk will also let you boot into GRiD-OS on a GRiDCase from a 3.5" floppy. I've included a text file that has a complete list of all the contents with the disk images.

The images worked fine on my end, including the GRiD-OS disk, which successfully booted on my GRiDCases. Nonetheless, it would great if someone else could test them out to make sure the images turned out fine.

 

 Chris


 





Yahoo! Message number: 3352
Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2017 04:05:03 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Uploaded newer GRiD-OS software for GRiDCase

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Awesome work, Chris!Thank you very much!-Shawn

      From: "rou021@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2017 4:23 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Uploaded newer GRiD-OS software for GRiDCase

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I finally made disk images from the 3.5" GRiD-OS disks I had for the GRiDCase and uploaded them to the files section. The disks were:

GRiD-OS v3.1.6E
GRiD-OS/MS-DOS Utilities v3.1.7
GRiDAccess 3.1.6
GRiDMaster 3.1.7
Getting Started w/ GRiDMaster 3.1.5

The Getting Started disk also has demo versions of some of the Management Tools programs. This demo version of GRiDPlan works just fine on all of my GRiDCases. The older version of GRiDPlan doesn't seem to work on ones without an 8087 (Too bad the newer one is only a demo). The Utilities disk has the GRiD-OS/MS-DOS partitioning program along with GRiDTransfer. The GRiD-OS disk, while having newer versions of the files on the earlier Compass disk (like the formatting utility that actually works with 3.5" floppies), also has a virtual floppy utility called Temporary Disk, ScanCase for GRiD-OS, some GRiDCase specific drivers for GRiD-OS, and a ton of fonts. This disk will also let you boot into GRiD-OS on a GRiDCase from a 3.5" floppy. I've included a text file that has a complete list of all the contents with the disk images.

The images worked fine on my end, including the GRiD-OS disk, which successfully booted on my GRiDCases. Nonetheless, it would great if someone else could test them out to make sure the images turned out fine.

Chris











Yahoo! Message number: 3353
Date: 15 Mar 2017 21:09:42 +0000

From: walton.david@...

Subject: GridPad 1900 user manual

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Hi. I have a gridpad 1900 and managed to get it to boot by replacing the battery pack. However I cant seem to get the pen to work and plan to open it up to replace the CMOS battery. Does anyone have a user manual or maintenance guide? I can scan it and upload to the files section if someone is willing to post a copy.





Yahoo! Message number: 3354
Date: 16 Mar 2017 02:25:52 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: GridPad 1900 user manual

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I just browsed through some of my documents and, while I don't have a manual for the 1900, I do have a user manual for the 2260. I don't know if there are any commonalities with the 1900, but I can check and see what it says about the stylus for you, if you'd like. 

Chris



Yahoo! Message number: 3355
Date: 17 Mar 2017 15:35:45 +0000

From: walton.david@...

Subject: Grid 286N memory




Hi. I managed to rebuild the battery pack for my Grid 286N but in order to boot it up I need to obtain some memory as all four SIMM slots are empty. To my surprise it seems to need 35 pin SIMMs not 30pin. Does anyone have any memory for the laptop or a user manual? Photo attached. Regards, David.


This is part 2 of a multi-part message.




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Yahoo! Message number: 3356
Date: 17 Mar 2017 15:43:20 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /Grid 1660 BIOS/1660bios.zip
  Uploaded by : hercule0164 <walton.david@...>
  Description : BIOS program and update for Grid 1660


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/Grid%201660%20BIOS/1660bios.zip


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


hercule0164 <walton.david@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3357
Date: 17 Mar 2017 15:48:58 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /Grid 1450/conf1450.exe
  Uploaded by : hercule0164 <walton.david@...>
  Description : Configuration utility


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/Grid%201450/conf1450.exe


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


hercule0164 <walton.david@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3358
Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2017 12:07:11 -0600

From: shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Grid 286N memory [1 Attachment]

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Dave,I'm a little confused. '286N'? Did you mean the 1520 that has a 80286 processor, or is that another Grid model?The memory map for the 1520 is in the service guide for the 1520-which is in the Files area.I can tell you which section and page later tonight...assuming thats what you are looking for.-Shawn
-------- Original message --------From: "walton.david@sky.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Date: 3/17/17  9:35 AM  (GMT-07:00) To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Grid 286N memory [1 Attachment] 






[Attachment(s) from walton.david@sky.com [RuGRiD-Laptop] included below]







Hi. I managed to rebuild the battery pack for my Grid 286N but in order to boot it up I need to obtain some memory as all four SIMM slots are empty. To my surprise it seems to need 35 pin SIMMs not 30pin. Does anyone have any memory for the laptop or a user manual? Photo attached. Regards, David.





















Yahoo! Message number: 3359
Date: 17 Mar 2017 21:48:53 +0000

From: walton.david@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Grid 286N memory [1 Attachment]




Shawn
 The model number is 286N but it looks identical to a Grid 1720 or a Tandy 2810. Here is a photo. The problem is when I try to switch it on the LEDs by the power switch all light up green for a flash, then go off and am left with the LCD screen left on. Unsure if this is due to no memory installed or something else like a short circuit. I know the Tandy 2810 has 1MB standard and four 1MB SIMM slots making a maximum of 5MB - so possibly my Grid already has 1MB soldered onto the motherboard and its not due to lack of memory.
 David.
 

 http://support.radioshack.com/support_computer/doc1/1803.htm http://support.radioshack.com/support_computer/doc1/1803.htm (Tandy 2810-20)
  

This is part 2 of a multi-part message.




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This is part 3 of a multi-part message.




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Yahoo! Message number: 3360
Date: 17 Mar 2017 15:53:29 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /Grid 1550/conf1550.exe
  Uploaded by : hercule0164 <walton.david@...>
  Description : Configuration utility


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/Grid%201550/conf1550.exe


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


hercule0164 <walton.david@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3361
Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2017 22:42:16 +0000

From: D Walton 

Subject: Fwd: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Grid 286N memory [2 Attachments]

text/plain; charset=utf-8



FYI

Begin forwarded message:

> From: "walton.david@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
> Date: 17 March 2017 at 21:48:53 GMT
> To: <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Grid 286N memory [2 Attachments]
> Reply-To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
>
> [Attachment(s) from walton.david@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] included below]
> Shawn
> The model number is 286N but it looks identical to a Grid 1720 or a Tandy 2810. Here is a photo. The problem is when I try to switch it on the LEDs by the power switch all light up green for a flash, then go off and am left with the LCD screen left on. Unsure if this is due to no memory installed or something else like a short circuit. I know the Tandy 2810 has 1MB standard and four 1MB SIMM slots making a maximum of 5MB - so possibly my Grid already has 1MB soldered onto the motherboard and its not due to lack of memory.
> David.
>
> http://support.radioshack.com/support_computer/doc1/1803.htm (Tandy 2810-20)
>
>





Yahoo! Message number: 3362
Date: 18 Mar 2017 20:57:38 +0000

From: rz221ebay@...

Subject: Re: GridCase 1520 Hard Drive matches?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I got that CP-3044 and installed it but there's still no notice in FDISK that a drive is installed in the 1520. Any tips?
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3363
Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2017 21:13:41 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GridCase 1520 Hard Drive matches?

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Hello there.A couple tips:I imagine you've tried this, but I'll mention it. If you haven't already, use ctrl-alt-del rather than cold boot (power on/off) and see if that changes anything.
If you don't already have it, In the Files section in the Yahoogroup, download conf1520.exe. You'll have to get it on to a floppy. Once the 1520 is booted try conf1520.exe harddrive=on and see if that helps.
Can you hear the drive spin up at power on? Are the 5V and 12V supplies good?
The hard drive mates to an interface board that then mates to the motherboard. Are those connections solid? It is possible the drive is bad. But even if the drive platters and data may be bad, I would expect the main logic board on the hard drive to respond and be seen in fdisk.Good luck,-Shawn

      From: "rz221ebay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Saturday, March 18, 2017 2:59 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GridCase 1520 Hard Drive matches?

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I got that CP-3044 and installed it but there's still no notice in FDISK that a drive is installed in the 1520.Any tips?









Yahoo! Message number: 3364
Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2017 21:50:01 +0000 (UTC)

From: randy zimmer 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GridCase 1520 Hard Drive matches?

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Thanks Shawn, ctrl-alt-del didn't make a difference but I'll try the config file tomorrow when I get back to it.The drive is supposed to be new and unused, it spins fine.The ribbons are all clicked in but I'll wiggle them too.Is this HD on the list of 6?Thanks again! Randy Zimmer 


    On Saturday, March 18, 2017 5:16 PM, "Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


     Hello there.A couple tips:I imagine you've tried this, but I'll mention it. If you haven't already, use ctrl-alt-del rather than cold boot (power on/off) and see if that changes anything.
If you don't already have it, In the Files section in the Yahoogroup, download conf1520.exe. You'll have to get it on to a floppy. Once the 1520 is booted try conf1520.exe harddrive=on and see if that helps.
Can you hear the drive spin up at power on? Are the 5V and 12V supplies good?
The hard drive mates to an interface board that then mates to the motherboard. Are those connections solid? It is possible the drive is bad. But even if the drive platters and data may be bad, I would expect the main logic board on the hard drive to respond and be seen in fdisk.Good luck,-Shawn

      From: "rz221ebay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Saturday, March 18, 2017 2:59 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GridCase 1520 Hard Drive matches?



I got that CP-3044 and installed it but there's still no notice in FDISK that a drive is installed in the 1520.Any tips?




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Yahoo! Message number: 3365
Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2017 22:24:06 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GridCase 1520 Hard Drive matches?

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Randy,In looking through the BIOS code, it looks like if the checksum on the top of the BIOS EPROM are 4C73 and DD00, or 7A00 and 2F00, then yes, it is on the list of 6.Here is the list of support drive for these BIOS versions:CP3022 CP3024 CP3044 CP3042 CP344 CP3104R

If your EPROMs have checksums DE00 and 0B00 on their tops, they only support CP3022, CP344, and CP3104R.
New and unused drive that's over 25 years old?  HHmm...I wonder if it has to be low level formatted?You may have to google to look for low level format commands with fdisk. The friendly people over at Vintage Computer Forum (http://www.vcfed.org/forum/forum.php) may be able to help.Good luck and let us know how things work out,-Shawn

      From: "randy zimmer rz221ebay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: "RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 Sent: Saturday, March 18, 2017 3:52 PM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GridCase 1520 Hard Drive matches?

#yiv2999448403 #yiv2999448403 -- #yiv2999448403 .yiv2999448403ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv2999448403 div.yiv2999448403ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv2999448403 div.yiv2999448403photo-title a, #yiv2999448403 div.yiv2999448403photo-title a:active, #yiv2999448403 div.yiv2999448403photo-title a:hover, #yiv2999448403 div.yiv2999448403photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv2999448403 div.yiv2999448403attach-table div.yiv2999448403attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv2999448403 div.yiv2999448403attach-table div.yiv2999448403attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv2999448403 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv2999448403 div.yiv2999448403ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv2999448403 div.yiv2999448403attach-table div.yiv2999448403attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv2999448403 div.yiv2999448403attach-table div.yiv2999448403attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv2999448403 div.yiv2999448403ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv2999448403 #yiv2999448403

Thanks Shawn, ctrl-alt-del didn't make a difference but I'll try the config file tomorrow when I get back to it.The drive is supposed to be new and unused, it spins fine.The ribbons are all clicked in but I'll wiggle them too.Is this HD on the list of 6?Thanks again! Randy Zimmer 


    On Saturday, March 18, 2017 5:16 PM, "Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


     Hello there.A couple tips:I imagine you've tried this, but I'll mention it. If you haven't already, use ctrl-alt-del rather than cold boot (power on/off) and see if that changes anything.
If you don't already have it, In the Files section in the Yahoogroup, download conf1520.exe. You'll have to get it on to a floppy. Once the 1520 is booted try conf1520.exe harddrive=on and see if that helps.
Can you hear the drive spin up at power on? Are the 5V and 12V supplies good?
The hard drive mates to an interface board that then mates to the motherboard. Are those connections solid? It is possible the drive is bad. But even if the drive platters and data may be bad, I would expect the main logic board on the hard drive to respond and be seen in fdisk.Good luck,-Shawn

      From: "rz221ebay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Saturday, March 18, 2017 2:59 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GridCase 1520 Hard Drive matches?



I got that CP-3044 and installed it but there's still no notice in FDISK that a drive is installed in the 1520.Any tips?




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Yahoo! Message number: 3366
Date: 19 Mar 2017 19:31:55 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: Lets see what we have

text/plain; charset=utf-8



[RuGRiD-Laptop] An existing poll has been modified, check it out.
Enter your vote now! https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/polls/poll/3226376


Not a complete list but add what you have if not here
Created by: klyball


1. GridPad 1900 https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/polls/poll/3226376#23602893 (added by: hercule0164 . March 19, 2017)






Thanks!








Yahoo! Message number: 3367
Date: 19 Mar 2017 19:40:24 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /Grid 1680/set1680.exe
  Uploaded by : hercule0164 <walton.david@...>
  Description : Setup program for Grid 1680


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/Grid%201680/set1680.exe


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


hercule0164 <walton.david@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3368
Date: 19 Mar 2017 19:42:57 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /Grid 286 MFP/set286mfp.com
  Uploaded by : hercule0164 <walton.david@...>
  Description : Setup file for Grid 286 MFP


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/Grid%20286%20MFP/set286mfp.com


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


hercule0164 <walton.david@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3369
Date: 19 Mar 2017 19:36:48 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /Grid 1810/conf1810.exe
  Uploaded by : hercule0164 <walton.david@...>
  Description : Configuration file for 1810


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/Grid%201810/conf1810.exe


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


hercule0164 <walton.david@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3370
Date: 19 Mar 2017 19:39:08 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /Grid 1660/set1660.com
  Uploaded by : hercule0164 <walton.david@...>
  Description : Setup program for Grid 1660


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/Grid%201660/set1660.com


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


hercule0164 <walton.david@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3371
Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2017 04:34:23 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Thanks to Dave for the uploads!
I am curious. What is a 286 MFP?Thanks,-Shawn

      From: "RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Sunday, March 19, 2017 1:48 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop


Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /Grid 286 MFP/set286mfp.com
  Uploaded by : hercule0164 <walton.david@...>
  Description : Setup file for Grid 286 MFP


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/Grid%20286%20MFP/set286mfp.com


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


hercule0164 <walton.david@...>


------------------------------------

------------------------------------

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rugrid-laptop/
------------------------------------

Yahoo Groups Links





 




Yahoo! Message number: 3372
Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2017 07:10:14 +0000

From: D Walton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Hi Shawn

Apparently MFP stands for micro foot print desktop Grid computer.

Did you receive my reply post on my boot up problems with my 286N? Just getting used to posting messages.

Everything went very quiet.

David

> On 20 Mar 2017, at 04:34, Shawnerz shawnerz@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>
> Thanks to Dave for the uploads!
>
> I am curious. What is a 286 MFP?
> Thanks,
> -Shawn
>
>
> From: "RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
> To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Sunday, March 19, 2017 1:48 PM
> Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop
>
>
> Hello,
>
>
> This email message is a notification to let you know that
> a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
> group.
>
>
>   File        : /Grid 286 MFP/set286mfp.com
>   Uploaded by : hercule0164 <walton.david@...>
>   Description : Setup file for Grid 286 MFP
>
>
> You can access this file at the URL:
> https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/Grid%20286%20MFP/set286mfp.com
>
>
> To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
> https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
> hercule0164 <walton.david@...>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rugrid-laptop/
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>





Yahoo! Message number: 3373
Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2017 07:18:10 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Hey there.I saw them, I think. I didn't have any information to add to constructively contribute. So, I didn't add to them.Thanks,-Shawn

      From: "D Walton walton.david@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Monday, March 20, 2017 1:12 AM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop

#yiv9610134602 #yiv9610134602 -- #yiv9610134602 .yiv9610134602ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv9610134602 div.yiv9610134602ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv9610134602 div.yiv9610134602photo-title a, #yiv9610134602 div.yiv9610134602photo-title a:active, #yiv9610134602 div.yiv9610134602photo-title a:hover, #yiv9610134602 div.yiv9610134602photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv9610134602 div.yiv9610134602attach-table div.yiv9610134602attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv9610134602 div.yiv9610134602attach-table div.yiv9610134602attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv9610134602 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv9610134602 div.yiv9610134602ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv9610134602 div.yiv9610134602attach-table div.yiv9610134602attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv9610134602 div.yiv9610134602attach-table div.yiv9610134602attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv9610134602 div.yiv9610134602ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv9610134602 #yiv9610134602

Hi Shawn
Apparently MFP stands for micro foot print desktop Grid computer.
Did you receive my reply post on my boot up problems with my 286N? Just getting used to posting messages.
Everything went very quiet.
David






Yahoo! Message number: 3374
Date: 20 Mar 2017 13:18:57 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /Grid 1660/powr1660.com
  Uploaded by : hercule0164 <walton.david@...>
  Description : Power Management Program for the Grid 1660


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/Grid%201660/powr1660.com


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


hercule0164 <walton.david@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3375
Date: 20 Mar 2017 13:30:57 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /Grid 1720/1720old.com
  Uploaded by : hercule0164 <walton.david@...>
  Description : Setup program for 1720 with old BIOS


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/Grid%201720/1720old.com


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


hercule0164 <walton.david@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3376
Date: 20 Mar 2017 13:31:16 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /Grid 1720/1720new.com
  Uploaded by : hercule0164 <walton.david@...>
  Description : Setup program for 1720 with new BIOS


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/Grid%201720/1720new.com


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


hercule0164 <walton.david@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3377
Date: 20 Mar 2017 13:31:35 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /Grid 1720/pwr1720.com
  Uploaded by : hercule0164 <walton.david@...>
  Description : Power management program for 1720


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/Grid%201720/pwr1720.com


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


hercule0164 <walton.david@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3378
Date: 20 Mar 2017 14:15:35 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



The MFP was a desktop PC GRiD made in the '90s. Here's a link to the brochure: http://www.1000bit.it/ad/bro/grid/GridMFPseries.pdf http://www.1000bit.it/ad/bro/grid/GridMFPseries.pdf 

 BTW, there are a number of other GRiD brochures and documents at this link: http://www.1000bit.it/ad/bro/brochures.asp http://www.1000bit.it/ad/bro/brochures.asp
  




Yahoo! Message number: 3379
Date: 14 Apr 2017 21:07:16 +0000

From: lescovez@...

Subject: New website

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



http://vintage-laptops.com/?page_id=2&lang=en http://vintage-laptops.com/?page_id=2&lang=en

 

 GRiD List:

 GRiD 1450SX GRiD 1660 GRiD 1680 GRiD 1755 GRiD 1810 GRiD 4025NC GRiD Case 1520 GRiD Case 1550sx GRiD Case 1580 GRiD Case 1580 Tempest GRiD Compass 1100 GRiD Compass II 1121 GRiD Compass II 1139 GRiD Convertible 2270 GRiD Lite 1032 





Yahoo! Message number: 3380
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2017 04:56:19 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] New website

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



I went to the web site. It is very nice and there are many laptops!I remember seeing the advertisements for Bondwell Laptops in Computer Shopper in the late 1980's. I almost bought one. I ended up getting a 386SX from a company called "PC Brand."I still have it and it most of it works. :)Thanks for sharing the website.-Shawn

      From: "lescovez@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Friday, April 14, 2017 3:07 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] New website

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http://vintage-laptops.com/?page_id=2&lang=en

GRiD List:

| GRiD 1450SX |
| GRiD 1660 |
| GRiD 1680 |
| GRiD 1755 |
| GRiD 1810 |
| GRiD 4025NC |
| GRiD Case 1520 |
| GRiD Case 1550sx |
| GRiD Case 1580 |
| GRiD Case 1580 Tempest |
| GRiD Compass 1100 |
| GRiD Compass II 1121 |
| GRiD Compass II 1139 |
| GRiD Convertible 2270 |
| GRiD Lite 1032 |











Yahoo! Message number: 3381
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2017 15:39:58 +0000 (UTC)

From: =?UTF-8?B?0K7RgNC40Lkg0JvQtdGB0LrQvtCy0LXRhg==?= 

Subject: =?UTF-8?Q?=D0=9E=D1=82=D0=B2:_[RuGRiD-Laptop]_Re:_GRiDMAN?=

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Hi!

Can you make a short video of the game GRiDMAN?

It is very necessary.

Yuri

    четверг, 2 марта 2017 6:12 "klyball@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> писал(а):


     Ian:

add it your compass stuff and put it up all together be more organized that way

Grant  #yiv4081890460 #yiv4081890460 -- #yiv4081890460ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv4081890460 #yiv4081890460ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv4081890460 #yiv4081890460ygrp-mkp #yiv4081890460hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv4081890460 #yiv4081890460ygrp-mkp #yiv4081890460ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv4081890460 #yiv4081890460ygrp-mkp .yiv4081890460ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv4081890460 #yiv4081890460ygrp-mkp .yiv4081890460ad p {margin:0;}#yiv4081890460 #yiv4081890460ygrp-mkp .yiv4081890460ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}#yiv4081890460 #yiv4081890460ygrp-sponsor #yiv4081890460ygrp-lc {font-family:Arial;}#yiv4081890460 #yiv4081890460ygrp-sponsor #yiv4081890460ygrp-lc #yiv4081890460hd {margin:10px 0px;font-weight:700;font-size:78%;line-height:122%;}#yiv4081890460 #yiv4081890460ygrp-sponsor #yiv4081890460ygrp-lc .yiv4081890460ad {margin-bottom:10px;padding:0 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Yahoo! Message number: 3382
Date: 17 May 2017 23:03:43 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: GRiDMAN

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Ian,

I was wondering if you had gotten the chance to organize the Compass software yet? I'm currently going through my own GRiD-OS stuff before I make images and upload them here. I figured it might be a good idea to see what was on the images you and Grant have so I don't end up uploading all of the same stuff.

Chris



Yahoo! Message number: 3383
Date: 20 May 2017 23:09:46 +0000

From: klyball@...

Subject: Rare find i think




I pick up some grid stuff and in the pile were 5 roms in there original jewel cases with there little pamphlets in there carriers .
 


This is part 2 of a multi-part message.




Attached image/jpeg file not shown; stay tuned!





Yahoo! Message number: 3384
Date: Sat, 20 May 2017 23:12:47 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Rare find i think [1 Attachment]

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Very nice!Are all of the ROMs the same, or are there different OS's or applications?Thanks,-Shawn

      From: "klyball@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Saturday, May 20, 2017 5:09 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Rare find i think [1 Attachment]

<!--#yiv1201226825 #yiv1201226825 .yiv1201226825ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv1201226825 div.yiv1201226825ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv1201226825 div.yiv1201226825photo-title a, #yiv1201226825 div.yiv1201226825photo-title a:active, #yiv1201226825 div.yiv1201226825photo-title a:hover, #yiv1201226825 div.yiv1201226825photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv1201226825 div.yiv1201226825attach-table div.yiv1201226825attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv1201226825 div.yiv1201226825attach-table div.yiv1201226825attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv1201226825 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv1201226825 div.yiv1201226825ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv1201226825 div.yiv1201226825attach-table div.yiv1201226825attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv1201226825 div.yiv1201226825attach-table div.yiv1201226825attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv1201226825 div.yiv1201226825ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv1201226825 --> <!--#yiv1201226825 #yiv1201226825ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv1201226825 #yiv1201226825ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv1201226825 #yiv1201226825ygrp-mkp #yiv1201226825hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv1201226825 #yiv1201226825ygrp-mkp #yiv1201226825ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv1201226825 #yiv1201226825ygrp-mkp .yiv1201226825ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv1201226825 #yiv1201226825ygrp-mkp .yiv1201226825ad p {margin:0;}#yiv1201226825 #yiv1201226825ygrp-mkp .yiv1201226825ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}-->[Attachment(s) from klyball@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] included below]

I pick up some grid stuff and in the pile were 5 roms in there original jewel cases with there little pamphlets in there carriers .










Yahoo! Message number: 3385
Date: 24 May 2017 23:39:28 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Proper RTC Replacement

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This would be the proper clock to replace the dead one in my Gridcase 1520 correct?
 http://www.ebay.com/itm/DALLAS-DS1287A-DS1287A-TIMER-REAL-TIME-CLOCK-DIP18-DC-1134B1-/151628510351?hash=item234dc3748f:g:KZUAAOxyZwpSXeKV http://www.ebay.com/itm/DALLAS-DS1287A-DS1287A-TIMER-REAL-TIME-CLOCK-DIP18-DC-1134B1-/151628510351?hash=item234dc3748f:g:KZUAAOxyZwpSXeKV

  




Yahoo! Message number: 3386
Date: Thu, 25 May 2017 07:21:29 -0600

From: shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Proper RTC Replacement

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Josh,Sorry for not responding sooner. That looks to be the correct model. But here is a word of caution: I do not know the exact date, but close to 10 years go, Dallas was bought by TI. The RTC in the picture looks to be an original Dallas Semiconductor chip. If this is true, its internal battery is at least 10 years old.If all of this is true, best case scenario is you get the RTC and it lasts a couple years. Worst case, you get the RTC and its DOA.I'd be interested to hear if it works for you.Thanks,-Shawn
-------- Original message --------From: "joshuaparkour@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Date: 5/24/17  5:39 PM  (GMT-07:00) To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Proper RTC Replacement 













This would be the proper clock to replace the dead one in my Gridcase 1520 correct?http://www.ebay.com/itm/DALLAS-DS1287A-DS1287A-TIMER-REAL-TIME-CLOCK-DIP18-DC-1134B1-/151628510351?hash=item234dc3748f:g:KZUAAOxyZwpSXeKV
 




















Yahoo! Message number: 3387
Date: 27 May 2017 18:32:43 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Grid 2260 Manual

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Hello all
 I just purchased a Grid 2260 convertible and I am having some issues even though I can boot it.
 Does anyone have the manual for the Grid 2260?
 The touchscreen/stylus ability seems to not work and when I use the external floppy drives they freeze the computer when I insert an actual disk. 
 

 Any help would be appreciated.
 

 Thank you
 

 Joshua
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3388
Date: 28 May 2017 14:41:48 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: Grid 2260 Manual

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Hello Joshua,

I have a copy of the 2260 User Manual. I don't have it scanned yet, but I had intended to start scanning my all GRiD Manuals over the next week or so anyway. I can scan it first and get it uploaded for you sometime in the next couple of days. BTW, if you also need a 2260 bootdisk, utilities, or the tablet upgrade for Windows 3.1, they should be in the files section as well.

Chris



Yahoo! Message number: 3389
Date: 28 May 2017 14:45:37 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: Rare find i think

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That's a great find. What kind of software was on them? Do you have any more pictures?



Yahoo! Message number: 3390
Date: 28 May 2017 16:31:08 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: Rare find i think

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    It's in perfect condition with the stylus and two floppy drives and the optional working modem. I will post some pics in a little while. It has company emails on its hard drive that pertain to some Grid distribution center. It boots to Win 3.1 for pen computing but I can't get the stylus to work or draw anything on the screen. I think the batteries in the stylus must be dead. The battery doesn't hold a charge and I can't get the floppy drives to work which sucks when trying to transfer files. The drive will give me a read error if I try to access it with no disk inside but when there is a floppy of any size in the drive the green light on the drive will come on like it's trying to access the disk but then the computer hangs and I have to restart it.
 

 Any tips on cleaning / replacing the floppy drives or fixing some software setting would be appreciated.
 Those BBS downloads are so unreliable.
 

 Joshua





Yahoo! Message number: 3391
Date: 28 May 2017 16:32:01 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: Grid 2260 Manual

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Thank you Chris



Yahoo! Message number: 3392
Date: Sun, 28 May 2017 18:25:01 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Rare find i think

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That's too bad.Perhaps a cotton swab with a drop or two of rubbing (isopropyl) alcohol over the read/write heads might help. I don't know.There are cleaning floppy's out there: https://www.amazon.com/Cables-Unlimited-Acc-6000-Floppy-Cleaning/dp/B0028B7138
It is possible the heads may be out of alignment.
I'm not familiar with the 2260. Did you happen to put a 1.44MB floppy in, but the drive can only read 720K? I don't mean to be insulting. Sometimes, the simple things get us. :)
Good luck,-Shawn

      From: "joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2017 10:31 AM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Rare find i think

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     It's in perfect condition with the stylus and two floppy drives and the optional working modem. I will post some pics in a little while. It has company emails on its hard drive that pertain to some Grid distribution center. It boots to Win 3.1 for pen computing but I can't get the stylus to work or draw anything on the screen. I think the batteries in the stylus must be dead. The battery doesn't hold a charge and I can't get the floppy drives to work which sucks when trying to transfer files. The drive will give me a read error if I try to access it with no disk inside but when there is a floppy of any size in the drive the green light on the drive will come on like it's trying to access the disk but then the computer hangs and I have to restart it.
Any tips on cleaning / replacing the floppy drives or fixing some software setting would be appreciated.Those BBS downloads are so unreliable.
Joshua









Yahoo! Message number: 3393
Date: 28 May 2017 21:17:52 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Rare find i think

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



    I tried both 720kb formatted and 1.4 meg floppies. In the operating system which is Windows 3.1 but doesn't say for pen computing on it actually. The OS shows that it should be able to format both. I am going to try what you said with the swab though. 
 

     I managed to get the stylus working and it's really amazingly accurate. I will post some pics of it. The handwriting rec actually works and is pretty fast although not as fast as typing on the keyboard but is pretty cool. Turning natural handwriting to text at a reasonable rate? Sounds pretty futuristic for 1992.





Yahoo! Message number: 3394
Date: Sun, 28 May 2017 14:31:56 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Rare find i think





  
    
  
  
    Remember, if you're using 1.4M floppies, you need to tape over the
    1.4M hole. 720K floppies only had one hole with the write-protect
    slider, the other hole didn't exist at the time. I think this only
    matters when you need to read it in a more modern system, but can't
    recall for certain.

    

    Asa

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
Spokane County ARES/RACES Net Manager
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 5/28/2017 2:17 PM, joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
    

      
      
          

            
  I tried both 720kb formatted and 1.4 meg floppies.
              In the operating system which is Windows 3.1 but doesn't
              say for pen computing on it actually. The OSshows that it
              shouldbe able to format both. I am going to try what you
              said with the swab though. 

            


            

            
 I managed to get the stylus working and it's really
              amazingly accurate. I will post some pics of it. The
              handwriting rec actually works and is pretty fast although
              not as fast as typing on the keyboard but is pretty cool.
              Turning natural handwriting to text at a reasonable rate?
              Sounds pretty futuristic for 1992.

            

          

          
      


        

          
            

              
              Virus-free.
                www.avg.com
              
            

          
        

         

      
      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3395
Date: 31 May 2017 18:06:26 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Rare find i think

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I really can't make heads or tails of the floppy drives. I opened one up and cleaned the head with a cotton swab today. I was a little nervous as the interior seemed extremely dust free. Sure enough nothing changed on the drive. It still freezes the computer if I try to format the drive if there is a disk in it and doesn't even sound like it is spinning when there is a disk in it. 
 

 The green light goes on for a few seconds and nothing happens and the computer locks up. It sounds like it checks for a disk when there is no disk in the drive and will give me and error if I try with no disk inserted.
 

 Any help would be appreciated.
 

 Joshua





Yahoo! Message number: 3396
Date: Wed, 31 May 2017 20:11:38 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Rare find i think





  
    
  
  
    From my (non-GRiD) experience.

    

    Any computer will -scan- the floppy on boot. Most computers
    including the GRiD of that era, look on the floppy drive first, for
    a bootable disk. If not found then it looks to the next object in
    BIOS that is listed for a bootable device (typically a hard drive).
    In my case, my GRiD only has a floppy, so if a bootable floppy isn't
    present it gives me the no operating system found message and it's
    done.

    

    So, without a floppy in the drive I would expect the green light is
    going to come on, and the drive is going to cycle, attempting to
    look for a floppy. This is normal.

    

    Okay, next question. Are you inserting a 720K floppy or a 1.4meg
    floppy? There is a distinct difference. However, a 720K floppy
    drive shouldn't care if it's a 1.4M floppy, it should just ignore
    the extra hole.

    

    Which kind of floppy are you inserting?

    

    Is the write-protect hole open or closed on the floppy? There is a
    small slide on the back of the floppy that closes or opens a small
    square hole. Open is in write-protect mode, closed is in write
    mode. You probably already know this but we need to look at the
    basics. It's possible if the write-protect is on and you try to do
    a format, the format routine doesn't know what to do and goes into
    the weeds. I wouldn't consider this uncommon in a very early
    computer.

    

    Do you have a bootable floppy? If so, insert it and see if it boots
    to the floppy. Any operating system will do, old DOS 2, DOS 3, DOS
    5 or DOS 6 (Microsoft, FreeDos, DrDOS, or GRiD DOS, doesn't
    matter). Any of those should either boot or throw a different error
    message. If the system boots to the floppy, then the drive is
    functioning properly and it's probably a problem with the formatting
    executable potentially being corrupt.

    

    Does the drive look like it's original GRiD? Or does it look like
    someone replaced it at some point in the past? If it looks like
    it's been replaced, it may be it's an incompatible drive.

    

    Answer the questions you can from above, try to reply -with- the
    previous message info intact in order to provide context and a trail
    (I'm only reading these in email, -not- looking at the on-line
    thread).

    

    With the above questions answered, we can help draw more
    hypothetical conclusions.

    

    Asa Jay

    

    

    

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
Spokane County ARES/RACES Net Manager
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 5/31/2017 11:06 AM, joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]
    wrote:
    

      
      
          

            
I really can't make heads or tails of the floppy
              drives. I opened one up and cleaned the head with a cotton
              swab today. I was a little nervous as the interior seemed
              extremely dust free. Sure enough nothing changed on the
              drive. It stillfreezes the computer if I try to format
              the drive if there is a disk in it and doesn't even sound
              like it is spinning when there is a disk in it. 

            


            

            
The green light goes on for a few seconds and nothing
              happens and the computer locks up. It sounds like it
              checks for a disk when there is no disk in the drive and
              will give me and error if I try with no disk inserted.

            


            

            
Any help would be appreciated.

            


            

            
Joshua

            

          

          
      


        

          
            

              
              Virus-free.
                www.avg.com
              
            

          
        

         

      
      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3397
Date: 01 Jun 2017 21:07:04 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Rare find i think

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



So, without a floppy in the drive I would expect the green light is going to come on, and the drive is going to cycle, attempting to look for a floppy.  This is normal.
 

 Yes, without a floppy in the drive the drive lights up and spins and the system boots off the hard disk if I am booting the computer or a read error if I am trying to format the drive.
 

Okay, next question.  Are you inserting a 720K floppy or a 1.4meg floppy?  There is a distinct difference.  However, a 720K floppy drive shouldn't care if it's a 1.4M floppy, it should just ignore the extra hole
Which kind of floppy are you inserting?

 

 I have tried both a 1.4 meg floppy and a 720kb formatted floppy that I use on my 1520. Both times the floppy drive spins like it's trying to read for about eight seconds with the green light on then the drive stops and the computer just doesn't respond. It doesn't give me an error or anything.
 
Is the write-protect hole open or closed on the floppy?  There is a small slide on the back of the floppy that closes or opens a small square hole.  Open is in write-protect mode, closed is in write mode.  You probably already know this but we need to look at the basics.  It's possible if the write-protect is on and you try to do a format, the format routine doesn't know what to do and goes into the weeds.  I wouldn't consider this uncommon in a very early computer.
 

 I have tried reading the floppies in both modes.
 

Do you have a bootable floppy?  If so, insert it and see if it boots to the floppy.  Any operating system will do, old DOS 2, DOS 3, DOS 5 or DOS 6 (Microsoft, FreeDos, DrDOS, or GRiD DOS, doesn't matter).  Any of those should either boot or throw a different error message.  If the system boots to the floppy, then the drive is functioning properly and it's probably a problem with the formatting executable potentially being corrupt.

 

 I have tried to boot from my old 720kb GRiD DOS 3.3 as well as a 1.44meg Win98 Dos Recovery disk the same thing happens with both of them.
 
Does the drive look like it's original GRiD?  Or does it look like someone replaced it at some point in the past?  If it looks like it's been replaced, it may be it's an incompatible drive.

 

 I have two floppy drives both labeled Grid 2260 floppy drives and they are both external and connect to a strange port, I think its and ANT connection, I will post some pics. They are both like new, no scratches or dings and seem to be original. Sadly the one I took apart has the face now prone to fall off (crude).
 

 Thank you for your help.



---In RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com, <asajay@...> wrote :

 From my (non-GRiD) experience.
 
 Any computer will -scan- the floppy on boot.  Most computers including the GRiD of that era, look on the floppy drive first, for a bootable disk.  If not found then it looks to the next object in BIOS that is listed for a bootable device (typically a hard drive).  In my case, my GRiD only has a floppy, so if a bootable floppy isn't present it gives me the no operating system found message and it's done.
 
 So, without a floppy in the drive I would expect the green light is going to come on, and the drive is going to cycle, attempting to look for a floppy.  This is normal.
 
 Okay, next question.  Are you inserting a 720K floppy or a 1.4meg floppy?  There is a distinct difference.  However, a 720K floppy drive shouldn't care if it's a 1.4M floppy, it should just ignore the extra hole.
 
 Which kind of floppy are you inserting?
 
 Is the write-protect hole open or closed on the floppy?  There is a small slide on the back of the floppy that closes or opens a small square hole.  Open is in write-protect mode, closed is in write mode.  You probably already know this but we need to look at the basics.  It's possible if the write-protect is on and you try to do a format, the format routine doesn't know what to do and goes into the weeds.  I wouldn't consider this uncommon in a very early computer.
 
 Do you have a bootable floppy?  If so, insert it and see if it boots to the floppy.  Any operating system will do, old DOS 2, DOS 3, DOS 5 or DOS 6 (Microsoft, FreeDos, DrDOS, or GRiD DOS, doesn't matter).  Any of those should either boot or throw a different error message.  If the system boots to the floppy, then the drive is functioning properly and it's probably a problem with the formatting executable potentially being corrupt.
 
 Does the drive look like it's original GRiD?  Or does it look like someone replaced it at some point in the past?  If it looks like it's been replaced, it may be it's an incompatible drive.
 
 Answer the questions you can from above, try to reply -with- the previous message info intact in order to provide context and a trail (I'm only reading these in email, -not- looking at the on-line thread).
 
 With the above questions answered, we can help draw more hypothetical conclusions.
 
 Asa  Jay
 
 
 
 Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
Spokane County ARES/RACES Net Manager
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com http://www.teampanteraracing.com 
 On 5/31/2017 11:06 AM, joshuaparkour@... mailto:joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:   I really can't make heads or tails of the floppy drives. I opened one up and cleaned the head with a cotton swab today. I was a little nervous as the interior seemed extremely dust free. Sure enough nothing changed on the drive. It still freezes the computer if I try to format the drive if there is a disk in it and doesn't even sound like it is spinning when there is a disk in it. 
 
 
 The green light goes on for a few seconds and nothing happens and the computer locks up. It sounds like it checks for a disk when there is no disk in the drive and will give me and error if I try with no disk inserted.
 
 
 Any help would be appreciated.
 
 
 Joshua
 
 
 
 http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient Virus-free. www.avg.com http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient #DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2
 




Yahoo! Message number: 3398
Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2017 16:39:41 -0600

From: shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Rare find i think

text/plain; charset=utf-8



I had a thought on this matter that I forgot to pass along.Is it possible that the stepper motor for the floppy drive is bad?IIRC, you said the disk never spins. I am wondering if the motor has failed.Thanks,-Shawn







Yahoo! Message number: 3399
Date: 01 Jun 2017 22:45:04 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Rare find i think

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



On one of the drives it doesn't seem like it spins much but on the other drive it seems like it spins but the end result is unfortunately the same for both drives. 
 

 Joshua





Yahoo! Message number: 3400
Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2017 19:14:34 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Rare find i think





  
    
  
  
    Alright, good answers. I don't know this system, but I'm assuming
    it has the capability (or was supposed to) to boot from the floppy,
    and you know the floppies are bootable.

    

    If you boot to the hard drive, are you able to "see" the floppy
    drive at all, even without a disk in it? Most computer will
    recognize a floppy drive without a disk, just not report on any
    files since there isn't one there.

    

    When you boot the hard drive, what operating system is it running?

    

    I did a quick search on the Internet for Grid 2260 floppy. Is it
    possible the BIOS needs to be set up correctly? Are you able to
    access the BIOS and does it indicate a floppy is supported/attached
    or something? Again, I have no idea on that model computer, I'm
    kind of shooting in the dark here.

    

    The other thing is that the drives might be bad. Can you take the
    guts out of the case and watch what's happening? These aren't
    optical drives so there is no laser danger, it's all magnetic and if
    you can take the covers off and still insert a floppy, you might
    find something new?

    

    I'm sorry I might not be much more help than this, it sounds like
    you've done everything right so far.

    

    Asa

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
Spokane County ARES/RACES Net Manager
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 6/1/2017 2:07 PM, joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
    

      
      
          

            
So, without a floppy in the drive I would expect the
                green light is going to come on, and the drive is going
                to cycle, attempting to look for a floppy. This is
                normal.

            


              

            
Yes, without a floppy in the drive the drive lights up
              and spins and the system boots off the hard disk if I am
              booting the computer or a read error if I am trying to
              format the drive.

            


              

              Okay, next question. Are you inserting a 720K floppy
                or a 1.4meg floppy? There is a distinct difference.
                However, a 720K floppy drive shouldn't care if it's a
                1.4M floppy, it should just ignore the extra hole

                Which kind of floppy are you inserting?

              

            


            

            
I have tried both a 1.4 meg floppy and a 720kb
              formatted floppy that I useon my 1520. Both times the
              floppy drive spins like it's trying to read for about
              eight seconds with the green light on then the drive stops
              and the compute r just doesn't respond. It doesn't give me
              an error or anything.

            


                Is the write-protect hole open or closed on the floppy?
                There is a small slide on the back of the floppy that
                closes or opens a small square hole. Open is in
                write-protect mode, closed is in write mode. You
                probably already know this but we need to look at the
                basics. It's possible if the write-protect is on and
                you try to do a format, the format routine doesn't know
                what to do and goes into the weeds. I wouldn't consider
                this uncommon in a very early computer.

            


            

            
I have tried reading the floppies in both modes.

            


                

                Do you have a bootable floppy? If so, insert it and see
                if it boots to the floppy. Any operating system will
                do, old DOS 2, DOS 3, DOS 5 or DOS 6 (Microsoft,
                FreeDos, DrDOS, or GRiD DOS, doesn't matter). Any of
                those should either boot or throw a different error
                message.  If the system boots to the floppy, then the
                drive is functioning properly and it's probably a
                problem with the formatting executable potentially being
                corrupt.

              

            


              

            
I have tried to boot from my old 720kbGRiD DOS 3.3 as
              well as a 1.44meg Win98 Dos Recovery disk the same thing
              happens with both of them.

            


                Does the drive look like it's original GRiD? Or does it
                look like someone replaced it at some point in the
                past? If it looks like it's been replaced, it may be
                it's an incompatible drive.

              

            


            

            
I have two floppy drives both labeled Grid 2260 floppy
              drives and they are both external and connect to a strange
              port, I think its and ANT connection, I will post some
              pics. They are both like new,no scratches or dings and
              seem to be original. Sadly the one I took apart has the
              face now prone to fall off (crude).

            


            

            
Thank you for your help.

            
            
              
            

        
      
      

    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3401
Date: 02 Jun 2017 03:37:41 +0000

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Rare find i think

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



If I remember correctly, the computer should check the floppy and the green (or red) light will turn on and you should hear the motor spinning. If a disk is in the drive then if it is a bootable drive it should start to read it and load the OS, or if not a bootable disk (or if there is no disk) will eventually stop trying to read the disk with the light turning off and the motor stopping, with the computer then, looking elsewhere for an OS to load, like a HDD. If the computer cannot find an OS anywhere, it will display the message like "No operating system found" ( or whatever that message is, I forget). However, in normal operation, the disk drive and its light should turn off after a few seconds if the computer cannot find what it wants in the drive. If the light stays on and the motor turns indefinitely, then there is a problem in the computer correctly reading the disk drive itself.
 

 Regarding the BIOS in the 2260 (first released in 1992, originally a 386 unit upgradable to a 486), if you have the original BIOS chips in the computer, I don't think that should be an issue, since I think there was no setup program of any kind for the BIOS in these old GRiDs (at least that was the case with the 1500 series,. I'm pretty sure the 2260's were not that far advanced enough that BIOS setup programs were available at the time either, but I could be wrong). The BIOS normally could not be altered anyway, without reprogramming them yourself and using EPROM's as we have sometimes done. I would assume it was functional in the capacity to properly access its floppy before the unit was sold back in the day, and should still be that way.
 

 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3402
Date: 02 Jun 2017 03:47:38 +0000

From: Jeriddian@...

Subject: Re: Proper RTC Replacement

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Shawn is right, Joshua. That is the correct unit. And he is also correct in that the unit is so old, there may not be much life left in its battery. 
 

 But you have another problem. The BIOS of some of the old 1520's are locked into the original Dallas RTC chip that came with the computer. I don't know how that happens exactly (some of the other guys may be able to explain it better), but I did run into it on a few of the 1520's I worked on. In replacing the RTC chip, the computer will not completely boot up and first asks for a password to the BIOS, which does not exist and thus can never be answered. When you escape that screen, the computer attempts to reboot, locking the computer into an irreversible loop such that it will never boot up at all. I actually went to the trouble of getting the BIOS altered to get rid of that problem, but that would of course involve burning EPROM's for new BIOS chips. It would probably still be better just to do the alteration of the original RTC chip by attaching an external battery to it.
 

 This issue, however, does not occur in the 1530's. You can freely replace the RTC's in those units.
 

 Phil





Yahoo! Message number: 3403
Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2017 21:17:33 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Proper RTC Replacement





  
    
  
  
    The posts on this forum:

    http://www.vcfed.org/forum/showthread.php?42696-GRID-2260-Bios-acces

    

    Appear to have information about a utility you can use to enter and
    modify the BIOS on a 2260. I'm not sure this applies, but at least
    one person found it useful. Of course, if it takes a floppy to do
    this, and the floppy is the problem, it probably won't work anyway.

    

    Asa 

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
Spokane County ARES/RACES Net Manager
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 6/1/2017 8:47 PM, Jeriddian@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
    

      
      
          

            
Shawn is right, Joshua. That is the correct unit. And he
              is also correct in that the unit is so old, there may not
              be much life left in its battery. 

            


            

            
But you have another problem. The BIOS of some of the old
              1520's are locked into the original Dallas RTC chip that
              came with the computer. I don't know how that happens
              exactly (some of the other guys may be able to explain it
              better), but I did run into it on a few of the 1520's I
              worked on. In replacing the RTC chip, the computer will
              not completely boot up and first asks for a password to
              the BIOS, which does not exist and thus can never be
              answered. When you escape that screen, the computer
              attempts to reboot, locking the computer into an
              irreversible loop such thatit will never boot up at all.
              I actually went to the trouble of getting the BIOS altered
              to get rid of that problem, but that would of course
              involve burning EPROM's for new BIOS chips. It would
              probably still be better just to do the alteration of the
              original RTC chipby attaching an external battery to it.

            


            

            
This issue, however, does not occur in the 1530's. You
              can freely replace the RTC's in those units.

            


            

            
Phil

            

          

          
      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3404
Date: 02 Jun 2017 20:48:14 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Proper RTC Replacement

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Sadly the program in that doesn't exist anymore but I think I know what it was. It  was a config 2260 program that I have on the hard disk of my Grid 2260. It will allow me to change boot order and stuff but I don't think that will help as I have already tried that. I think the floppy drives must require some sort of driver that I don't have?



Yahoo! Message number: 3405
Date: Fri, 02 Jun 2017 19:45:18 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Proper RTC Replacement





  
    
  
  
    I don't recall floppy drives needing drivers, but I could be wrong.
    Usually they are a BIOS-level driven thing which is why they
    typically can be boot from, otherwise, how would the computer know
    to look on the floppy for a driver to read the floppy... if it can't
    read the floppy.

    

    ;)

    

    It may be a hardware problem with the floppy drives, or it could be
    a hardware problem on the computer. You have an aged piece of
    equipment there, almost anything could be wrong. Do you have any
    photos of the drives outside of their case?

    

    I looked at the photos you posted, very nice! Can you post a photo
    of the -connector- that goes to the floppy?

    

    When you have a floppy drive connected, I assume it shows up as A:
    in the Windows File Manager. I also assume you've been using the
    Windows facility to try and format the drive. Is that correct?

    

    Have you tried running the format command from the command line?

    c:/> format a: 

    

    You might even try to see what switches are available by running
    "format /?" first.

    

    But getting back to basics, because I've lost track. Are you able
    to even put a floppy in the drive and have Windows see files on it,
    as-is?

    

    Asa

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
Spokane County ARES/RACES Net Manager
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 6/2/2017 1:48 PM, joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
    

      
      
          

            
Sadly the program in that doesn't exist anymore but I
              think I know what it was. It was a config 2260 program
              that I have on the hard disk of my Grid 2260. It will
              allow me to change boot order and stuff but I don't think
              that will help as I have already tried that. I think the
              floppy drives must require some sort of driver that I
              don't have?

          

          
      


        

          
            

              
              Virus-free.
                www.avg.com
              
            

          
        

         

      
      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3406
Date: 03 Jun 2017 20:11:57 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Proper RTC Replacement

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I don't recall floppy drives needing drivers, but I could be wrong.  Usually they are a BIOS-level driven thing which is why they typically can be boot from, otherwise, how would the computer know to look on the floppy for a driver to read the floppy... if it can't read the floppy.

 

 I can get to the config 2260 program which doesn't let me do much with floppies other than change the boot order.

It may be a hardware problem with the floppy drives, or it could be a hardware problem on the computer.  You have an aged piece of equipment there, almost anything could be wrong.  Do you have any photos of the drives outside of their case?

 

 I have posted quite a few new photos and labeled them so you can see what's going on.

 

 I looked at the photos you posted, very nice!  Can you post a photo of the -connector- that goes to the floppy?

 
 I have posted a few pics of the drive connectors.
 

 When you have a floppy drive connected, I assume it shows up as A: in the Windows File Manager.  I also assume you've been using the Windows facility to try and format the drive.  Is that correct?

 
 I have used both Windows and DOS to format the drive or read the drive. It gives me no disk errors like normal unless a disk is inserted upon which it freezes up in DOS and Windows but I can still move the mouse in Windows but not do anything else except for Ctr alt delete which gives me a garbled screen which I have posted.
 

 Have you tried running the format command from the command line?
 c:/>  format a: 

 

 Yes I have tried that.
 
You might even try to see what switches are available by running "format /?" first.

 
 Yes I have tried that too.
 

 But getting back to basics, because I've lost track.  Are you able to even put a floppy in the drive and have Windows see files on it, as-is
 

 No. The only thing Windows or DOS can see is if a disk is not in the drive. If there is a disk, lockdown.
 

 Thank you for your troubleshooting help.
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3407
Date: Sat, 03 Jun 2017 15:14:12 -0600

From: shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Proper RTC Replacement

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Perhaps you answered this already and I missed it. But does the drive even spin the disk?
null



Yahoo! Message number: 3408
Date: Sat, 03 Jun 2017 15:08:43 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Proper RTC Replacement





  
    
  
  
    Great photos.

    

    Okay, so I'm comparing that to a floppy I have with me right now.
    Yours has a 26-pin connector, while mine has a 32-pin connector. I
    was really hoping they were the same, that way you could -try- it in
    another computer, but since the pinout varies by six pins, I
    wouldn't recommend that now.

    

    But with the case off, you should be able to clearly see what is
    moving and what isn't.

    

    However, because of other problems you are having with the operating
    system and Windows... there might be something else wrong on the
    motherboard. It could be corrupted files on the hard drive, it
    could be bad communications to/from the hard drive, it could be bad
    solder joints on a major chip on the MB... a lot more coulid be
    wrong than just the floppy not working.

    

    This is real bugger to troubleshoot, and would be a lot easier if at
    least one floppy was working and could boot an OS from it. Without
    being able to do a deep dive into the OS and potentially replace
    files, you might never know what's wrong.

    

    Without attaching a floppy drive to the computer at all, does the OS
    appear to be operating properly? You've shown the display driver
    error which also makes me wonder if something else is wrong at the
    OS level.

    

    Asa

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
Spokane County ARES/RACES Net Manager
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 6/3/2017 1:11 PM, joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
    

      
      
          

            
I don't recall floppy drives needing drivers, but I
                could be wrong. Usually they are a BIOS-level driven
                thing which is why they typically can be boot from,
                otherwise, how would the computer know to look on the
                floppy for a driver to read the floppy... if it can't
                read the floppy.

            

            


            

            
I can get to the config 2260 program which doesn't let
              me do much with floppies other than change the boot order.

              

              It may be a hardware problem with the floppy drives, or
                it could be a hardware problem on the computer. You
                have an aged piece of equipment there, almost anything
                could be wrong. Do you have any photos of the drives
                outside of their case?

            

            


            

            
I have posted quite a few new photosand labeled them
              so you can see what's going on.

            

            


            

            
I looked at the photos you posted, very nice! Can
                you post a photo of the -connector- that goes to the
                floppy?

              

            

            
I have posted a few pics of the drive connectors.

            


            

            
When you have a floppy drive connected, I assume it
                shows up as A: in the Windows File Manager. I also
                assume you've been using the Windows facility to try and
                format the drive. Is that correct?

              

            

            
I have used both Windows and DOS to format the drive or
              read the drive. It gives me no disk errors like normal
              unless a disk is inserted upon which it freezes up in DOS
              and Windows but I can still move the mouse in Windows but
              not do anything else except for Ctr alt delete which gives
              me a garbled screen which I have posted.

            


            

            
Have you tried running the format command from the
                command line?

                c:/> format a: 

            

            


            

            
Yes I have tried that.

            


              You might even try to see what switches are available
                by running "format /?" first.

              

            

            
Yes I have tried that too.

            


            

            
But getting back to basics, because I've lost
                track. Are you able to even put a floppy in the drive
                and have Windows see files on it, as-is

            


              

            
No. The only thing Windows or DOS can see is if a disk
              is not in the drive. If there is a disk, lockdown.

            


            

            
Thank you for your troubleshooting help.

            


            

          

          
      


        

          
            

              
              Virus-free.
                www.avg.com
              
            

          
        

         

      
      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3409
Date: 03 Jun 2017 22:25:06 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Proper RTC Replacement

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



The driver error started after I tried to project to an external display and stupidly changed the pen compatible display driver to the generic VGA. Now I can't even find the pen driver in the drivers list after I changed that setting and I am still kicking myself for it. The computer boots normally with the floppy drive attached as long as no disk is inserted. Everything appears to be normal until I try to access a disk in the drive.
 

 I just really hope Craig posts the manual soon so that I could try troubleshooting it with that.
 I might open it up if I could get some breakdown instructions.
 Do you guys know if I could use a PCMCIA adapter to compact flash?
 

 Like this one?
 http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sandisk-CF-Compact-Flash-Card-adaptor-CF-Card-to-PCMCIA-PC-Adapter/331911043358?_trksid=p2481888.c100675.m4236&_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160908105057%26meid%3Dde385694be624608844196f16bf8c153%26pid%3D100675%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D15%26sd%3D201940638980&_trkparms=pageci%253A462533b1-48ab-11e7-a208-74dbd18066d2%257Cparentrq%253A700e66f715c0ac8034181f31fffbceff%257Ciid%253A1 http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sandisk-CF-Compact-Flash-Card-adaptor-CF-Card-to-PCMCIA-PC-Adapter/331911043358?_trksid=p2481888.c100675.m4236&_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160908105057%26meid%3Dde385694be624608844196f16bf8c153%26pid%3D100675%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D15%26sd%3D201940638980&_trkparms=pageci%253A462533b1-48ab-11e7-a208-74dbd18066d2%257Cparentrq%253A700e66f715c0ac8034181f31fffbceff%257Ciid%253A1

  




Yahoo! Message number: 3410
Date: 03 Jun 2017 22:33:56 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Proper RTC Replacement

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I am pretty sure one of the drives spins the disk but the same result happens with both of them.



Yahoo! Message number: 3411
Date: Sat, 03 Jun 2017 16:28:19 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Proper RTC Replacement





  
    
  
  
    What do you want to use the CF/PCMCIA adapter for? Is there a card
    slot on that computer?

    

    If that's just a random -other- question.... I used to use those a
    lot when one of our products had a CF slot in it. We'd use the
    adapter in our desktops to work with the CF cards.

    

    Asa

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
Spokane County ARES/RACES Net Manager
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 6/3/2017 3:25 PM, joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
    

      
      
          

            
The driver error started after I tried to project to an
              external display and stupidly changed the pen compatible
              display driver to thegeneric VGA. Now I can't even find
              the pen driver in the drivers list after I changed that
              setting and I am still kicking myself for it. The computer
              boots normally with the floppy drive attached as long as
              no disk is inserted. Everything appears to be normal until
              I try to access a disk in the drive.

            


            

            
I just really hope Craig posts the manual soon so that
              I could try troubleshooting it with that.

            
I might open it up if I could get some breakdown
              instructions.

            
Do you guys know if I could use a PCMCIA adapter to
              compact flash?

            


            

            
Like this one?

            
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sandisk-CF-Compact-Flash-Card-adaptor-CF-Card-to-PCMCIA-PC-Adapter/331911043358?_trksid=p2481888.c100675.m4236&_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160908105057%26meid%3Dde385694be624608844196f16bf8c153%26pid%3D100675%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D15%26sd%3D201940638980&_trkparms=pageci%253A462533b1-48ab-11e7-a208-74dbd18066d2%257Cparentrq%253A700e66f715c0ac8034181f31fffbceff%257Ciid%253A1

            

            

          

          
      


        

          
            

              
              Virus-free.
                www.avg.com
              
            

          
        

         

      
      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3412
Date: 03 Jun 2017 23:57:59 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Proper RTC Replacement

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



There is a PCMCIA slot on the computer. It could be a good sub for a floppy in getting files on or off it.
 I have a bunch of CF cards left over in the attic and I was wondering if that would work with the computer.





Yahoo! Message number: 3413
Date: Sat, 03 Jun 2017 17:25:08 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Proper RTC Replacement





  
    
  
  
    I'd give it a shot. Nothing to lose except the cost of the adapter.

    Asa

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
Spokane County ARES/RACES Net Manager
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 6/3/2017 4:57 PM, joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
    

      
      
          

            
There is a PCMCIA slot on the computer. It could be a
              good sub for a floppy in getting files on or off it.

            
I have a bunch of CF cards left over in the attic and I
              was wondering if that would work with the computer.

            

          

          
      


        

          
            

              
              Virus-free.
                www.avg.com
              
            

          
        

         

      
      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3414
Date: 04 Jun 2017 14:27:45 +0000

From: erix.swanson@...

Subject: Re: R: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 3D printed carriers for Molex socket ROM

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Does anybody have a copy of the molex rom carrier STL file? It doesn't look like it got attached.



Yahoo! Message number: 3415
Date: 04 Jun 2017 22:15:53 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /GRiD 2260 User Guide/GRiD Convertible - Computer User's Guide_Part1.pdf
  Uploaded by : rou021 <rou021@...>
  Description : Part 1: Contents, Chapters 1 and 2


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiD%202260%20User%20Guide/GRiD%20Convertible%20-%20Computer%20User%27s%20Guide_Part1.pdf


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


rou021 <rou021@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3416
Date: 04 Jun 2017 22:16:35 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /GRiD 2260 User Guide/GRiD Convertible - Computer User's Guide_Part2.pdf
  Uploaded by : rou021 <rou021@...>
  Description : Part 2: Chapter 3, 4 and 5.


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiD%202260%20User%20Guide/GRiD%20Convertible%20-%20Computer%20User%27s%20Guide_Part2.pdf


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


rou021 <rou021@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3417
Date: 04 Jun 2017 22:17:53 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /GRiD 2260 User Guide/GRiD Convertible - Computer User's Guide_Part3.pdf
  Uploaded by : rou021 <rou021@...>
  Description : Part 3: Chapters 6, 7, and 8


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiD%202260%20User%20Guide/GRiD%20Convertible%20-%20Computer%20User%27s%20Guide_Part3.pdf


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


rou021 <rou021@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3418
Date: 04 Jun 2017 22:18:32 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /GRiD 2260 User Guide/GRiD Convertible - Computer User's Guide_Part4.pdf
  Uploaded by : rou021 <rou021@...>
  Description : Part 4: Chapter 9, Appendices, and Index


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiD%202260%20User%20Guide/GRiD%20Convertible%20-%20Computer%20User%27s%20Guide_Part4.pdf


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


rou021 <rou021@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3419
Date: 04 Jun 2017 22:34:37 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: Grid 2260 Manual

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



After some delays and hardware issues, I finally got the GRiD 2260 manual scanned, organized, and uploaded. It seems there's a size limit of a measly 10MB for file section uploads, so I also had to split the pdf into multiple parts. I know the folder says 5 parts, but I just realized the fifth was only of the back cover (I didn't think it was worth uploading just that, but I can if anybody wants me to).

More manuals and software are coming over the next few weeks (including a Windows for Pen Computing 1.0 manual). If the time it took to scan today's project is any indication, however, the manuals will be a more difficult and time consuming process than I thought. As such, it'll probably be a slower roll out (hopefully the software will go quicker). Nonetheless, more stuff is on the way.

Chris



Yahoo! Message number: 3420
Date: 05 Jun 2017 00:00:27 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: Grid 2260 Manual

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Thank you!



Yahoo! Message number: 3421
Date: 05 Jun 2017 05:54:48 +0000

From: shawnerz@...

Subject: Files Sizes

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I looked to see if I could increase the files to more than 10MB.
 This is what Yahoo's Help says:

 

 Files and Attachments 
 100MB total storage limit 5MB size limit per file or attachment Everything posted on the "Files" or "Attachments" pages counts towards the 100MB limit. If you exceed the maximum storage limits for either of these features and still want to add more content, you'll need to delete existing items to make room for new ones. 

 I know this is wrong because we can attach 10 MB files and the storage area is 2 GB. As a result, it looks like we cannot go go above a 10 MB limit.
 As a side note, we're only using about 155 MB of our 2 GB file storage limit. So, we are not in danger of exceeding that any time soon.
 -Shawn




Yahoo! Message number: 3422
Date: Mon, 5 Jun 2017 11:44:18 +0200

From: Fabio Gerosa 

Subject: Re: R: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 3D printed carriers for Molex socket ROM

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Hi
I should have somewhere I'll try to repost it here soon.
Regards

Fabio Gerosa

> Il giorno 04/giu/2017, alle ore 16:27, erix.swanson@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> ha scritto:
>
> Does anybody have a copy of the molex rom carrier STL file? It doesn't look like it got attached.
>
>





Yahoo! Message number: 3423
Date: Mon, 5 Jun 2017 13:53:19 +0200

From: Fabio Gerosa 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 3D printed carriers for Molex socket ROM

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Here it is, enjoy :-)





Ciao
Fabio


> Il giorno 26 lug 2016, alle ore 20:23, 'fabio.gerosa206' fabio.gerosa206@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> ha scritto:
>
>
> Hello Athan
> Here is the STL file ready to be 3D printed. My suggestion is print in ABS since the PLA is very weak.
> Let me know and see your results.
> Cheers,
> Fabio
>
>
>
> Inviato da smartphone Samsung Galaxy.
>
> -------- Messaggio originale --------
> Da: "athan.dejong@... <mailto:athan.dejong@...> [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>>
> Data: 22/07/16 21:57 (GMT+01:00)
> A: RuGRiD-Laptop@...m <mailto:RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
> Oggetto: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 3D printed carriers for Molex socket ROM
>
>
> HI
>
> Nice work :)
>
> it would be really great if you share the file ...
>
> Regards,
> athan
>
>
>






Yahoo! Message number: 3424
Date: 05 Jun 2017 12:14:33 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /MOLEX carrier/MOLEX carrier STL 3D file.stl
  Uploaded by : gerosa_fabio <gerosa_fabio@...>
  Description : 


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/MOLEX%20carrier/MOLEX%20carrier%20STL%203D%20file.stl


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


gerosa_fabio <gerosa_fabio@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3425
Date: Mon, 5 Jun 2017 14:15:57 +0200

From: Fabio Gerosa 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 3D printed carriers for Molex socket ROM [1 Attachment]

text/plain; charset=us-ascii



I have upload the STL version in File.
Fabio


> Il giorno 05 giu 2017, alle ore 13:53, Fabio Gerosa gerosa_fabio@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> ha scritto:
>
> Here it is, enjoy :-)
>
>
> <50-39-5288.stp>
>
>
> Ciao
> Fabio
>
>
>> Il giorno 26 lug 2016, alle ore 20:23, 'fabio.gerosa206' fabio.gerosa206@... <mailto:fabio.gerosa206@tiscali.it> [RuGRiD-Laptop] <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>> ha scritto:
>>
>>
>> Hello Athan
>> Here is the STL file ready to be 3D printed. My suggestion is print in ABS since the PLA is very weak.
>> Let me know and see your results.
>> Cheers,
>> Fabio
>>
>>
>>
>> Inviato da smartphone Samsung Galaxy.
>>
>> -------- Messaggio originale --------
>> Da: "athan.dejong@... <mailto:athan.dejong@yahoo.fr> [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>>
>> Data: 22/07/16 21:57 (GMT+01:00)
>> A: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com <mailto:RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
>> Oggetto: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 3D printed carriers for Molex socket ROM
>>
>>
>> HI
>>
>> Nice work :)
>>
>> it would be really great if you share the file ...
>> 
>> Regards,
>> athan
>>
>>
>






Yahoo! Message number: 3426
Date: 05 Jun 2017 23:54:12 +0000

From: erix.swanson@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 3D printed carriers for Molex socket ROM [1 Attachment]

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Thanks! It printed perfectly and dropped right into place. Now I just need to dig up some 512kbit eproms. I had read through the grid-eprom manual and thought it could use 1mbit eproms. Apparently the gridcase plus is the only one with 32 pin sockets, and then only on the internal ones. I'm going to try to build a set of roms for MS-KERMIT, looks like I can get it down to around 1.7mbit (212 ish KB).

My gridcase 3's both have 3 roms on the internal carrier- MS-DOS 2.11, BASRUN 2.0, and ASCOM- a _very_ simple terminal program (20k .COM, 39k .MSG file). Should I dump them and upload here?



Yahoo! Message number: 3427
Date: Mon, 05 Jun 2017 19:50:35 -0600

From: shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 3D printed carriers for Molex socket ROM

text/plain; charset=utf-8



Sure! I'll always welcome Grid files. :-)Thank you,-Shawn
-------- Original message --------From: "erix.swanson@gmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Date: 6/5/17  5:54 PM  (GMT-07:00) To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] 3D printed carriers for Molex socket ROM 













Thanks! It printed perfectly and dropped right into place. Now I just need to dig up some 512kbit eproms. I had read through the grid-eprom manual and thought it could use 1mbit eproms. Apparently the gridcase plus is the only one with 32 pin sockets, and then only on the internal ones. I'm going to try to build a set of roms for MS-KERMIT, looks like I can get it down to around 1.7mbit (212 ish KB).

My gridcase 3's both have 3 roms on the internal carrier- MS-DOS 2.11, BASRUN 2.0, and ASCOM- a _very_ simple terminal program (20k .COM, 39k .MSG file). Should I dump them and upload here?




















Yahoo! Message number: 3428
Date: 06 Jun 2017 02:43:48 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /Gridcase 12xx application roms/ascom.hex
  Uploaded by : erix.swanson@... <erix.swanson@...>
  Description : ASCOM 2.2 terminal program (probably needs BASRUN20)


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/Gridcase%2012xx%20application%20roms/ascom.hex


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


erix.swanson@... <erix.swanson@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3429
Date: 06 Jun 2017 02:44:52 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /Gridcase 12xx application roms/basrun20.hex
  Uploaded by : erix.swanson@... <erix.swanson@...>
  Description : BASRUN20, quickbasic runtime?


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/Gridcase%2012xx%20application%20roms/basrun20.hex


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


erix.swanson@... <erix.swanson@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3430
Date: 06 Jun 2017 02:45:45 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.


  File        : /Gridcase 12xx application roms/msdos-211.hex
  Uploaded by : erix.swanson@... <erix.swanson@...>
  Description : MS-DOS 2.11 bootable rom; io.sys, msdos.sys, command.com, diskcopy.com, format.com, mode.com, numkeypd.com, scancase.exe


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/Gridcase%2012xx%20application%20roms/msdos-211.hex


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


erix.swanson@... <erix.swanson@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3431
Date: 11 Jun 2017 20:56:48 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Proper RTC Replacement

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Well...
 I thought that the drives would never work so I stopped trying for a while. 
 

 While I was looking through the folders on my GRiD 2260 today I found a Norton utility program. I used it to check my C: drive. I had an idea. I turned my computer on standby as it said I could in the manual, then connected my floppy drive. 
 

 The Norton program actually used my drive to start a disk check on the floppy disk in the drive! It's not done as it says it will take an hour to go through all of the sectors but it can use the drive without freezing the computer. Does this mean that it's not a hardware problem?





Yahoo! Message number: 3432
Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2017 09:22:19 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Proper RTC Replacement





  
    
  
  
    Did this ever finish?

    

    Asa

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
Spokane County ARES/RACES Net Manager
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 6/11/2017 1:56 PM, joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
    

      
      
          

            
Well...

            
I thought that the drives would never work so I stopped
              trying for a while. 

            


            

            
While I was looking through the folders on my GRiD 2260
              today I found a Norton utility program. I used it to check
              my C: drive. I had an idea. I turned my computer on
              standby as it said I could in the manual, then connected
              my floppy drive. 

            


            

            
The Norton program actually used my drive to start a
              disk check on the floppy disk in the drive! It's not done
              as it says it will take an hour to go through all of the
              sectors but it can use the drive without freezing the
              computer. Does this mean that it's not a hardware problem?

            

          

          
      


        

          
            

              
              Virus-free.
                www.avg.com
              
            

          
        

         

      
      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3433
Date: 16 Jun 2017 18:47:12 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Proper RTC Replacement

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I canceled it as it was taking forever.
 So herby I have found a solution should anyone have this problem again.
 

 Power on the computer without connecting the floppy drive then put it into standby mode, then connect the drive. It should work if the problem was freezing when trying to access. The drive also works if you soft restart it (Ctr alt delete) and not the power switch.
 

 Unfortunately as soon as I thought all of my problems were solved as it can read the "normal" 1.4 meg disks it appears my windows 10 desktop and XP desktop cannot write to the disks without it showing up as corrupted on the 2260. Sigh... 
 I guess it all comes down to getting that darned Sony F270 to work again.





Yahoo! Message number: 3434
Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2017 12:49:40 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Proper RTC Replacement





  
    
  
  
    Note that XP and 10 will default to a 1.4 format. Are the drives
    capable of 1.4 or are they only 720K? There may be other options at
    the command prompt as well. Of course I might be throwing out a red
    herring too.

    

    I have been able to successfully use 3.5" floppies between my GRiDs
    and my Windows XP, 7 and 10 systems.

    Asa

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
Spokane County ARES/RACES Net Manager
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 6/16/2017 11:47 AM, joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]
    wrote:
    

      
      
          

            
I canceled it as it was taking forever.

            
So herby I have found a solution should anyone have
              this problem again.

            


            

            
Power on the computer without connecting the floppy
              drive then put it into standby mode, then connect the
              drive. It should work if the problem was freezing when
              trying to access. The drive also works if you soft restart
              it (Ctr alt delete) and not the power switch.

            


            

            
Unfortunately as soon as I thought all of my problems
              were solved as it can read the "normal" 1.4 meg disks it
              appears my windows 10 desktop andXP desktop cannot write
              to the disks without it showing up as corrupted on the
              2260. Sigh... 

            
I guess it all comes down to getting that darned Sony
              F270to work again.

            

          

          
      


        

          
            

              
              Virus-free.
                www.avg.com
              
            

          
        

         

      
      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3435
Date: 17 Jun 2017 23:51:13 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: Proper RTC Replacement

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Yes, I am pretty sure that my 2260 can read 1.4 meg floppies as well as 720kb ones. It say that it takes 1.4 meg floppies in the manual as well and it can read the directories of the 1.4 meg floppies that my Windows 10 machine formats. 
 However when I try to read a file off of one of those Windows 10 formatted floppies, it gives me a read error. If I format the disk with my 2260 then try to read the disk with my Windows 10 machine, it tells me the drive is not formatted. 
 

 This is all with 1.4 meg floppies and the default allocation size for formatting.
 Both computers read fine to the floppies that I formatted with my Windows 98 machine before it died.
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3436
Date: 29 Jun 2017 23:36:52 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: GRID OS Floppy Format

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Does anyone know the proper IMD disk write settings to write the 720kb Grid OS image to a floppy? I am only getting a blinking cursor when I try to boot with a floppy that I have burned.





Yahoo! Message number: 3437
Date: 30 Jun 2017 20:40:20 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: GRID OS Floppy Format

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I'll have to double check the settings I use, but it's possible you may need to format the disk beforehand using the GRiD-OS disk formatting utility (Initialize Media). Can you read your current disk from a machine that's already running GRiD-OS or InteGRiD with GBridge? 

It's also important to keep in mind that GRiD-OS can be picky with the machines it'll run on. GRiD-OS 3.1.5 (or later, I'm assuming) won't run on the early GRiD Compass models (110x) and need at least an 113x (I don't know about 112x though). You also generally can't run GRiD-OS on anything later than the 1530 (the 1550sx won't run GRiD-OS or even InteGRiD). What model GRiD are you trying to use with it?

In addition, if you need the newer version of Initialize Media that will also work with InteGRiD on MS-DOS, I can upload it.



Yahoo! Message number: 3438
Date: 01 Jul 2017 00:34:47 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: GRID OS Floppy Format

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Thank you
 

 I am trying to boot a 1520 with the 720kb disk image that you posted.
 

 I don't have the GRiD-OS formatting utility or any machine that is already running GRiD OS.
 If you have the newer version of Initialize media that will work with DOS that would be great.
 I have also ordered some EPROMS for my 1520 as I had the wrong kind. If you had a dumped EPROM that would work with a 1520 I would appreciate it.  The disk must have some special formatting requirements other than the basic IBM DOS 720kb disk. 
 

 The problem started when I recently accidentally formatted the GRiD DOS 3.3 disk that I had created years ago on my now defunct win 98 laptop. For some reason even when I try to burn the image using Win Image for windows 3.1 on my 2260 it shows it as corrupt and the utility in the files section doesn't work on either XP or Windows 3.1
 

 The IMD program does work on Windows 3.1 and so I decided to try and get it to work with GRiD OS instead. I can get a successful write using a default DOS formatted 720kb disk but the 1520 just clears the screen and I get a blinking cursor with nothing happening so I assumed it must be a formatting problem.
 

 Thank you for your help
 

 Joshua





Yahoo! Message number: 3439
Date: 01 Jul 2017 12:16:20 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: GRID OS Floppy Format

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Yeah, GRiD-OS uses a different file system than DOS. GRiD-OS can't read DOS disks and DOS can't read GRiD-OS disks--with some exceptions. The first is if you start InteGRiD and run GBridge, you can then access GRiD-OS disks within the InteGRiD environment. The other is a utility for GRiD-OS that lets you transfer files between the two formats called GRiDTransfer. It's on the GRiD-OS/MS-DOS Utilities disk. ROMs, however, are a slightly different story. The applications and other files for GRiD-OS and InteGRiD are interchangeable for the most part*, so they don't need any utility to access them from either environment.

I'm afraid I don't have any dumped EPROMs right now, but I do have a GRiD MS-DOS 3.2 system disk I can image. I'll try to upload it (hopefully) sometime this weekend along with the Initialize Media utility.

*Since InteGRiD runs on DOS, GRiD software stored on a DOS formatted disk has to adhere to DOS file naming conventions. The filename has to be no more than eight characters and have a three character file extension. If you transfer a file from a GRiD-OS formatted disk to a DOS one using GBridge, it'll automatically rename the file to one compatible with DOS. You can also transfer InteGRiD files over to GRiD-OS as well, but you'll have to rename them manually. InteGRiD programs don't usually have to be renamed and will run as is, but drivers, fonts, and other files may not work unless you rename them.



Yahoo! Message number: 3440
Date: 01 Jul 2017 15:46:50 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: GRID OS Floppy Format

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



So GRiD Bridge will let me format the disk so that I can write the bootable GRiD OS image to the floppy right? So for the IMD program, is there any special parameters that I should use when writing to that formatted floppy? InteGRiD should run on my 2260 running DOS 5.0 right?(It has a 386 processor)
 

 Thank you for the info about GRiD OS and for the future uploads.
 

 Joshua





Yahoo! Message number: 3441
Date: 01 Jul 2017 15:59:59 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.

  File        : /NASA SPOC IMG 1.4 meg.zip
  Uploaded by : joshuaparkour <joshuaparkour@...>
  Description : Bootable 1.4 meg image with SPOC and InteGRiD

You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/NASA%20SPOC%20IMG%201.4%20meg.zip

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398

Regards,

joshuaparkour <joshuaparkour@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3442
Date: 01 Jul 2017 19:35:04 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: GRID OS Floppy Format

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



GRiD Bridge alone won't let you format the disk. GBridge is a utility that you run from within InteGRiD that, once activated, allows you to access GRiD-OS formatted disks inside of the InteGRiD environment. You still need "Initialize Media", which is the actual formatting utility. Both are necessary to create a 720kB floppy disk that works with (and boots into) GRiD-OS. Further, the version of Initialize Media has to be the newer version that's included on the disk image I uploaded. The older versions of Initialize Media won't work as they don't support 720kB floppies. I'll try to get the newer version added when I get the chance.

As for settings, I can't remember the specifics ones I used off the top of my head. Before I uploaded the images, I tested them out by formatting a new 720kB floppy using Initialize Media and writing the image to the disk. I was able to boot GRiD-OS from the floppy on my GRiDCase 3, so I know they should work. I just can't quite remember what the exact settings were. I've been able to get my hands on some more GRiD floppies and other software, so I'll be making and uploading more disk images soon. When I do, I'll have to test write the floppies anyway, so I'll know what they are then. I just don't know when that'll be. In the mean time, you can always go over the ImageDisk help file and try different settings. That's what I had to do for the 5.25" floppy images. Either way, you probably still need the disk formatted for GRiD-OS first.

I have no idea if InteGRiD will work on a 2260. I've found anything newer than a 1530 to be a crapshoot. It won't work on my 1550sx or my 110x Compasses, but I did get it to run on an old Pentium III Gateway PC I had ~15 years ago (it even ran SPoC). The only way to really tell is to just try it out.



Yahoo! Message number: 3443
Date: 06 Jul 2017 18:28:50 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: GRID OS Floppy Format

text/plain;  charset=utf-8




 I was able to run InteGRiD on my old Dell Dimension XPS T450  Pentium 3 machine and run SPOC and GRiD Write, GRiD Paint etc... All I need now is the Initialize Media program that will work with 720kb floppies and I should be golden.
 

 Thank you!





Yahoo! Message number: 3444
Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2017 21:01:21 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRID OS Floppy Format





  
    
  
  
    I've been on vacation and am trying to catch up.

    

    I've got GRiD OS disks that work fine on my Windows machines and DOS
    Disks that seem to work fine on my GRiD computers. I'm no sure what
    the discussion has been about regarding the incompatibilities. Is
    it only certain versions of GRiD DOS that aren't really compatible?
    Or am I misunderstanding something?

    

    If you can boot the GRiD, and drop to a command prompt, you should
    be able to format a floppy and install enough of the operating
    system to boot it. It used to be as simple as format a: and then
    sys a: but I've not worked on my GRiD in a while so I'm not sure it
    can be done.

    

    But I thought I should chime in here because I'd like to understand
    it more myself.

    Asa

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
Spokane County ARES/RACES Net Manager
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 7/6/2017 11:28 AM, joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
    

      
      
          

            


            

            
I was able to run InteGRiD on myold Dell Dimension XPS
              T450Pentium 3 machine and run SPOC and GRiD Write, GRiD
              Paint etc... All I need now is theInitialize Media
              program that will work with 720kb floppies and I should be
              golden.

            


            

            
Thank you!

          

        
      
      


        

      
      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3445
Date: 07 Jul 2017 19:40:44 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRID OS Floppy Format

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Asa, the issue Joshua is having involves formatting a disk for use with GRiD-OS, not GRiD MS-DOS. GRiD-OS, also known as CCOS (Compass Computer Operating System) is a completely different OS from GRiD MS-DOS designed to run on the GRiD Compasses and early GRiDCases. GRiD MS-DOS is just a version of MS-DOS tailored for GRiD laptops. The two use completely different disk and file formats, so they aren't interchangeable (unless you have special software). Formatting a floppy disk from the MS-DOS command prompt will only format the disk to work with DOS. In order to work properly with and boot into GRiD-OS/CCOS, the disk has to be formatted in the GRiD-OS/CCOS format. This can only be done with the GRiD-OS/CCOS utility "Initialize Media" from within GRiD-OS/CCOS itself. It can also be done within InteGRiD using GRiD Bridge since InteGRiD is essentially a virtual GRiD-OS/CCOS environment (it even has the same look, functions, and commands).

GRiD MS-DOS for the GRiDCase is a different matter as it's basically just another version of DOS. In fact, you can use non-GRiD versions of DOS to boot the GRiDCase. You can also use GRiD MS-DOS to boot many non-GRiD, IBM compatible PCs. The GRiDCases were supposed to be 100% IBM compatible, so this makes sense. The same should also be true for all of the later GRiDs. The only real issue is with the GRiD Compass. In order for it to boot into DOS, the Compass requires a special version of GRiD MS-DOS 2.00 or 2.11 (not to be confused with GRiD-OS). It won't boot the versions of MS-DOS made for the GRiDCase or versions for other PCs. It still uses the same file and disk format as every other version of DOS, it just needs certain proprietary system files designed for the Compass. Once booted with a Compass compatible version of MS-DOS, you can use regular DOS disks and software like any other version. I hope I didn't make things too confusing.

And I'm sorry for the delay on getting Initialize Media uploaded, Joshua. I should be able to upload it tomorrow though.

Chris



Yahoo! Message number: 3446
Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2017 13:12:08 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRID OS Floppy Format

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



That is a -great- response.  I learned something valuable today and now know there -is- a significant difference between OS's that can and can't be used with certain models.  I had been under a mistaken assumption they were all compliant to the same basic OS, and they aren't.  Good to know, many thanks for that clear explanation.
:)

Knowledge is power,
Asa

⁣Asa  Jay  Laughton, W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, retired
Sent using Jedi Mind Tricks​

On Jul 7, 2017, 12:40, at 12:40, "rou021@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>Asa, the issue Joshua is having involves formatting a disk for use with
>GRiD-OS, not GRiD MS-DOS. GRiD-OS, also known as CCOS (Compass Computer
>Operating System) is a completely different OS from GRiD MS-DOS
>designed to run on the GRiD Compasses and early GRiDCases. GRiD MS-DOS
>is just a version of MS-DOS tailored for GRiD laptops. The two use
>completely different disk and file formats, so they aren't
>interchangeable (unless you have special software). Formatting a floppy
>disk from the MS-DOS command prompt will only format the disk to work
>with DOS. In order to work properly with and boot into GRiD-OS/CCOS,
>the disk has to be formatted in the GRiD-OS/CCOS format. This can only
>be done with the GRiD-OS/CCOS utility "Initialize Media" from within
>GRiD-OS/CCOS itself. It can also be done within InteGRiD using GRiD
>Bridge since InteGRiD is essentially a virtual GRiD-OS/CCOS environment
>(it even has the same look, functions, and commands).
>
>GRiD MS-DOS for the GRiDCase is a different matter as it's basically
>just another version of DOS. In fact, you can use non-GRiD versions of
>DOS to boot the GRiDCase. You can also use GRiD MS-DOS to boot many
>non-GRiD, IBM compatible PCs. The GRiDCases were supposed to be 100%
>IBM compatible, so this makes sense. The same should also be true for
>all of the later GRiDs. The only real issue is with the GRiD Compass.
>In order for it to boot into DOS, the Compass requires a special
>version of GRiD MS-DOS 2.00 or 2.11 (not to be confused with GRiD-OS).
>It won't boot the versions of MS-DOS made for the GRiDCase or versions
>for other PCs. It still uses the same file and disk format as every
>other version of DOS, it just needs certain proprietary system files
>designed for the Compass. Once booted with a Compass compatible version
>of MS-DOS, you can use regular DOS disks and software like any other
>version. I hope I didn't make things too confusing.
>
>And I'm sorry for the delay on getting Initialize Media uploaded,
>Joshua. I should be able to upload it tomorrow though.
>
>Chris





Yahoo! Message number: 3447
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2017 23:09:42 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRID OS Floppy Format

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Yes, I agree. Great response and I learned something as well!

      From: "Asa Jay Laughton asajay@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Friday, July 7, 2017 2:32 PM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRID OS Floppy Format

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That is a -great- response.  I learned something valuable today and now know there -is- a significant difference between OS's that can and can't





Yahoo! Message number: 3448
Date: 09 Jul 2017 02:15:16 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRID OS Floppy Format

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Awesome job on the explanation!



Yahoo! Message number: 3449
Date: 09 Jul 2017 03:28:24 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.

  File        : /GRiD-OS Disk Utilities.zip
  Uploaded by : rou021 <rou021@...>
  Description : Newer versions of various GRiD-OS disk utilities formatted for use with InteGRiD. Also includes a version of Initialize Media that works with 720kB disks.

You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiD-OS%20Disk%20Utilities.zip

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398

Regards,

rou021 <rou021@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3450
Date: 09 Jul 2017 03:40:31 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRID OS Floppy Format

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I'm glad I was able to help. Some of this stuff is covered in the manuals and other documents, but some of it I've also learned through a bit of trial and error. It's a bit confusing at first and I'm still figuring things out myself. I've actually been thinking about writing a basic GRiD guide or FAQ for the Compass and early GRiDCase stuff. It might be good to get everything organized in one place.

I've finally uploaded Initialize Media to the file section. This is the latest version I have and should also be even newer than the one on the 720kB GRiD-OS disk set I uploaded earlier. Sorry again for the delay. As a bonus, I've also included a few other GRiD-OS disk utilities formatted for InteGRiD (Duplicate Media, Media Partition, Media Repair, and Temporary Disk). Let me know if there are any issues getting these to work.

Over the past few months, I've been able to obtain some more GRiD software and documents. IIRC, I've made images from somewhere around 20 or so floppies recently. I'll try to upload some of them soon, but I was wanting to add portion of them with their respective manuals after I get them scanned. Hopefully this will help keep things better organized. I also intend to upload the software odds and ends I have that aren't on official GRiD floppies. Since it's all scattered across multiple GRiDs, this will take a bit more time. I also found an old CD-R I had with a backup of all the GRiD drivers and utilities from the old Ari Service website. That I should be able to upload tomorrow.

Chris



Yahoo! Message number: 3451
Date: Sun, 9 Jul 2017 05:19:26 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRID OS Floppy Format

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Thank you very much for your uploads, Chris!-Shawn

      From: "rou021@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Saturday, July 8, 2017 9:42 PM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRID OS Floppy Format

#yiv9343838024 #yiv9343838024 -- #yiv9343838024 .yiv9343838024ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;min-height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv9343838024 div.yiv9343838024ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;min-height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv9343838024 div.yiv9343838024photo-title a, #yiv9343838024 div.yiv9343838024photo-title a:active, #yiv9343838024 div.yiv9343838024photo-title a:hover, #yiv9343838024 div.yiv9343838024photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv9343838024 div.yiv9343838024attach-table div.yiv9343838024attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv9343838024 div.yiv9343838024attach-table div.yiv9343838024attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv9343838024 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv9343838024 div.yiv9343838024ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv9343838024 div.yiv9343838024attach-table div.yiv9343838024attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv9343838024 div.yiv9343838024attach-table div.yiv9343838024attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv9343838024 div.yiv9343838024ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv9343838024 #yiv9343838024 #yiv9343838024 #yiv9343838024 --#yiv9343838024ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv9343838024 #yiv9343838024ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv9343838024 #yiv9343838024ygrp-mkp #yiv9343838024hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv9343838024 #yiv9343838024ygrp-mkp #yiv9343838024ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv9343838024 #yiv9343838024ygrp-mkp .yiv9343838024ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv9343838024 #yiv9343838024ygrp-mkp .yiv9343838024ad p {margin:0;}#yiv9343838024 #yiv9343838024ygrp-mkp .yiv9343838024ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}#yiv9343838024

I'm glad I was able to help. Some of this stuff is covered in the manuals and other documents, but some of it I've also learned through a bit of trial and error. It's a bit confusing at first and I'm still figuring things out myself. I've actually been thinking about writing a basic GRiD guide or FAQ for the Compass and early GRiDCase stuff. It might be good to get everything organized in one place.

I've finally uploaded Initialize Media to the file section. This is the latest version I have and should also be even newer than the one on the 720kB GRiD-OS disk set I uploaded earlier. Sorry again for the delay. As a bonus, I've also included a few other GRiD-OS disk utilities formatted for InteGRiD (Duplicate Media, Media Partition, Media Repair, and Temporary Disk). Let me know if there are any issues getting these to work.

Over the past few months, I've been able to obtain some more GRiD software and documents. IIRC, I've made images from somewhere around 20 or so floppies recently. I'll try to upload some of them soon, but I was wanting to add portion of them with their respective manuals after I get them scanned. Hopefully this will help keep things better organized. I also intend to upload the software odds and ends I have that aren't on official GRiD floppies. Since it's all scattered across multiple GRiDs, this will take a bit more time. I also found an old CD-R I had with a backup of all the GRiD drivers and utilities from the old Ari Service website. That I should be able to upload tomorrow.

Chris








Yahoo! Message number: 3452
Date: 09 Jul 2017 05:54:51 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Re: GRID OS Floppy Format

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Thank you for the uploads.
 I will tell you whether I have success using them.
 I opened up my 2260 to see whether I could replace the RTC and bridge battery. The RTC battery is similar to this battery
 http://www.ebay.com/itm/1-x-TL-5902-Tadiran-14250-ER14250-1-2-AA-3-6V-Lithium-Battery-with-Tab-US-Stock-/361813413450?hash=item543dc28e4a:g:6r8AAOSwXeJYHDwf http://www.ebay.com/itm/1-x-TL-5902-Tadiran-14250-ER14250-1-2-AA-3-6V-Lithium-Battery-with-Tab-US-Stock-/361813413450?hash=item543dc28e4a:g:6r8AAOSwXeJYHDwf
 

 and soldered to the motherboard so I decided against it for now. I could not find any batteries similar to the bridge battery even with a Google search so I gave up on it for now.
 

 The hinge design is really intricate and complex so I see why no one has copied it yet but it is really cool. I will upload a few pictures tomorrow if I have time.





Yahoo! Message number: 3453
Date: 10 Jul 2017 03:08:12 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.

  File        : /GRiD Ari Service Files.part2.rar
  Uploaded by : rou021 <rou021@...>
  Description : All of the GRiD files once available on Ari Service Support website. Includes various drivers and utilities.

You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiD%20Ari%20Service%20Files.part2.rar

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398

Regards,

rou021 <rou021@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3454
Date: 10 Jul 2017 06:05:24 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



When you extract that file you get a data error for \update.zip
 

 You might want to try recompressing and reposting if you want it too work properly.
 I could be wrong but it happened twice when I went to extract it. 
 I am using 7z to extract.
 

 Joshua





Yahoo! Message number: 3455
Date: 10 Jul 2017 16:40:45 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Strange. I just downloaded and extracted the .rar (both files need to be present in order to extract the files) and it worked just fine. I didn't have any issues with update.zip either. I'm using WinRAR though. Have you tried downloading them again? If that still doesn't work, I can reupload them.



Yahoo! Message number: 3456
Date: 10 Jul 2017 17:16:24 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Ok, I will try that




Yahoo! Message number: 3458
Date: 10 Jul 2017 17:34:19 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Same problem even though I downloaded it again. Although it could be a problem with my 7z, I doubt it. It is a mature program and I use it regularly to extract RAR with no problems. It could be the compression settings are weird and I just haven't found them yet. It will extract with the error however the update folder is empty and some other files seem corrupted. 
 

 Maybe WinRAR just isn't detecting any errors?





Yahoo! Message number: 3459
Date: 10 Jul 2017 18:13:24 +0000

From: yahoogroup1954@...

Subject: Re: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



The RAR if done with the original Winrar seems to produce crap archives.

Starting with part 1 (not 2) and unraring the whole thing worked for me.

I used unrar on linux.  

i'll try to repack with 7z and post it in a bit for you.

thanks
jim



Yahoo! Message number: 3460
Date: 10 Jul 2017 18:31:10 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Ok thanks Jim
 

 Joshua





Yahoo! Message number: 3461
Date: 10 Jul 2017 18:34:39 +0000

From: yahoogroup1954@...

Subject: Re: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



i tried uploading it twice, don't know if it showed up.  yahoo took forever to post these messages as well.

i tried twice, don't want to flood the thing.  I'll try to email the archive to you from my email feed of the group to your address.

maybe my upload(s) will eventually show up.



Yahoo! Message number: 3462
Date: 10 Jul 2017 21:24:58 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Posting on here can be finicky sometimes. I once made a post that didn't show up for almost 24 hours. I've found if I wait a minute before leaving the page after posting, it goes through without issue. Either way, if there's still trouble with the upload, I can always just reupload everything as zip files.

Chris



Yahoo! Message number: 3463
Date: 11 Jul 2017 01:09:52 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I just posted some photos if anyone wants to take a look.
 I explain them by commenting on them.
 Any help on Sys error 102 would be appreciated.
 

 Thanks in advance
 

 Joshua





Yahoo! Message number: 3464
Date: 11 Jul 2017 16:54:20 +0000

From: openfly@...

Subject: Hey all! Putting together a presentation on a couple space flight gridcase 1530s

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I am looking for added input for a presentation I am putting together on two space flight system modified gridcase 1530s.  I've been pulling data off the units, and even got in touch with one of the grid employees who wrote some of the diagnostic software for em.
 

 I posted about the modified PSU here:  https://space.stackexchange.com/questions/17631/i-am-looking-for-information-on-the-power-connector-used-on-the-space-shuttle-to https://space.stackexchange.com/questions/17631/i-am-looking-for-information-on-the-power-connector-used-on-the-space-shuttle-to
 

 These are some interesting units.  But as you guys are experts on this old grid systems I was wondering if you had any info you'd be willing to share that folks might enjoy hearing about or you think is important.
 

 Example, the guy from grid was telling me stories about how bad the conner disks were... even in the factory they'd give em a rap with their knuckles when they'd lock up to see if they could unlock em.
 

 I joined the group to download some docs on battery replacement for a gridcase 1520 ( stock model ) i am trying to resurrect to run the flight systems software on.
 

 I am currently still trying to recover hard disk data.  We recovered eeprom data.  The disks are proving a bit of a challenge due to the disk not handling modern LBA IDE comms quite right and misinterpreting it for CHS... or so I am lead to believe.
 

 the space flight 1530s Disks do spin... no idea if they read beyond that... but no bad noises yet.  The disk in the 1520 i am recovering does not spin up and is likely locked up in true conner fashion.
 

 Any thoughts on usb ide or ide cards that would read the conners from linux or something easily is appreciated.
 

 Thanks for your time and much love to you guys for all the awesome compiled info in this list.
 

 -Matt Joyce
  




Yahoo! Message number: 3465
Date: Tue, 11 Jul 2017 13:43:49 -0600

From: shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Hey all!  Putting together a presentation on a couple space flight gridcase 1530s

text/plain; charset=utf-8



First off, welcome to the group, Matt!!
I, for one, have a ton of questions, and a couple of answers to post. But, I'm at work and won't be able to properly respond until toight.But I wanted to be sure to welcome you and we would welcome any pictures or data you'd like to post in to the Files area.Thanks! -Shawn
-------- Original message --------From: "openfly@rocketmail.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com> Date: 7/11/17  10:54 AM  (GMT-07:00) To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Hey all!  Putting together a presentation on a couple space flight gridcase 1530s 













I am looking for added input for a presentation I am putting together on two space flight system modified gridcase 1530s.  I've been pulling data off the units, and even got in touch with one of the grid employees who wrote some of the diagnostic software for em.
I posted about the modified PSU here:  https://space.stackexchange.com/questions/17631/i-am-looking-for-information-on-the-power-connector-used-on-the-space-shuttle-to
These are some interesting units.  But as you guys are experts on this old grid systems I was wondering if you had any info you'd be willing to share that folks might enjoy hearing about or you think is important.
Example, the guy from grid was telling me stories about how bad the conner disks were... even in the factory they'd give em a rap with their knuckles when they'd lock up to see if they could unlock em.
I joined the group to download some docs on battery replacement for a gridcase 1520 ( stock model ) i am trying to resurrect to run the flight systems software on.
I am currently still trying to recover hard disk data.  We recovered eeprom data.  The disks are proving a bit of a challenge due to the disk not handling modern LBA IDE comms quite right and misinterpreting it for CHS... or so I am lead to believe.
the space flight 1530s Disks do spin... no idea if they read beyond that... but no bad noises yet.  The disk in the 1520 i am recovering does not spin up and is likely locked up in true conner fashion.
Any thoughts on usb ide or ide cards that would read the conners from linux or something easily is appreciated.
Thanks for your time and much love to you guys for all the awesome compiled info in this list.
-Matt Joyce 




















Yahoo! Message number: 3466
Date: 12 Jul 2017 04:36:20 +0000

From: shawnerz@...

Subject: Group Photo Area

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



All,
 If you haven't done it already, take some time to scroll through the Photo area. There are some impressive pictures of the amount of work Joshua, Dave, Klyball, Bikerbeer, Yuri and others have done to resurrect their Grids and keep them running.
 My feeling is that if/when Matt takes his Grid apart, he will see the common failure that is pictured in Bikerbeer's pictures.
 If you have the time, I recommend checking out the pictures.
 Enjoy,
 -Shawn




Yahoo! Message number: 3467
Date: 12 Jul 2017 14:47:14 +0000

From: openfly@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Hey all! Putting together a presentation on a couple space flight gridcase 1530s

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I started an Album and threw in some photos I had already posted to flickr.  There will be more soon. 

 Putting together a presentation... I've been deep down some research rabbit holes the past few days.
 

 I can dump some roms as well.




Yahoo! Message number: 3468
Date: 12 Jul 2017 14:48:44 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.

  File        : /NASA PGSC ROMs/U25.bin
  Uploaded by : openfly@... <openfly@...>
  Description : One of two diagnostic roms in NASA PGSC system

You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/NASA%20PGSC%20ROMs/U25.bin

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398

Regards,

openfly@... <openfly@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3469
Date: 12 Jul 2017 14:49:36 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.

  File        : /NASA PGSC ROMs/U26.bin
  Uploaded by : openfly@... <openfly@...>
  Description : one of two diagnostic roms in NASA PGSC system  GRiD Case 1530 Flight System

You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/NASA%20PGSC%20ROMs/U26.bin

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398

Regards,

openfly@... <openfly@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3470
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2017 05:47:33 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Hey all!  Putting together a presentation on a couple space flight gridcase 1530s

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Impressive set of pictures there, openfly! It's amazing the Grid's still work after all these years!-Shawn

      From: "openfly@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2017 8:47 AM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Hey all! Putting together a presentation on a couple space flight gridcase 1530s

#yiv2459416541 #yiv2459416541 -- #yiv2459416541 .yiv2459416541ygrp-photo-title{clear:both;font-size:smaller;min-height:15px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;width:75px;}#yiv2459416541 div.yiv2459416541ygrp-photo{background-position:center;background-repeat:no-repeat;background-color:white;border:1px solid black;min-height:62px;width:62px;}#yiv2459416541 div.yiv2459416541photo-title a, #yiv2459416541 div.yiv2459416541photo-title a:active, #yiv2459416541 div.yiv2459416541photo-title a:hover, #yiv2459416541 div.yiv2459416541photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;}#yiv2459416541 div.yiv2459416541attach-table div.yiv2459416541attach-row {clear:both;}#yiv2459416541 div.yiv2459416541attach-table div.yiv2459416541attach-row div {float:left;}#yiv2459416541 p {clear:both;padding:15px 0 3px 0;overflow:hidden;}#yiv2459416541 div.yiv2459416541ygrp-file {width:30px;}#yiv2459416541 div.yiv2459416541attach-table div.yiv2459416541attach-row div div a {text-decoration:none;}#yiv2459416541 div.yiv2459416541attach-table div.yiv2459416541attach-row div div span {font-weight:normal;}#yiv2459416541 div.yiv2459416541ygrp-file-title {font-weight:bold;}#yiv2459416541 #yiv2459416541 #yiv2459416541 #yiv2459416541 --#yiv2459416541ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv2459416541 #yiv2459416541ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv2459416541 #yiv2459416541ygrp-mkp #yiv2459416541hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv2459416541 #yiv2459416541ygrp-mkp #yiv2459416541ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv2459416541 #yiv2459416541ygrp-mkp .yiv2459416541ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv2459416541 #yiv2459416541ygrp-mkp .yiv2459416541ad p {margin:0;}#yiv2459416541 #yiv2459416541ygrp-mkp .yiv2459416541ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}#yiv2459416541

I started an Album and threw in some photos I had already posted to flickr.  There will be more soon.
Putting together a presentation... I've been deep down some research rabbit holes the past few days.
I can dump some roms as well.








Yahoo! Message number: 3471
Date: 17 Jul 2017 18:53:50 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



That's strange. I can confirm that version of Initialize Media works through InteGRiD on my GRiDCase 3, so it should still work in theory. I doubt the files I uploaded are corrupted either (though I can't rule it out yet; I'd have to download and test them).

I just checked my manuals, however, and found the listing for error code 102:


 "102: Invalid sector on disk
-----------------------------
What happened:  A command tried to read from or write to a nonexistant sector on a disk.

What to do:  Try the last operation again; if the error persists, run the MediaRepair utility (see Appendix                      F)."



I'd recommend trying another disk, using different computer, or running MediaRepair. I can also snap a few pictures of Appendix F (which covers MediaRepair) if you want. 

BTW, I'm also going to reupload the Ari Service stuff as zip files shortly.

Chris



Yahoo! Message number: 3472
Date: 17 Jul 2017 19:34:28 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I took down the .rar files to replace them with .zip versions, but I keep getting an error message after I upload the new ones. I'm not sure what's going on with the file section. I'll try again a little later.

Chris



Yahoo! Message number: 3473
Date: 17 Jul 2017 20:29:48 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Hey all! Putting together a presentation on a couple space flight gridcase 1530s

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Thanks for the uploaded stuff, Matt! It's all pretty fascinating. I'd love to check out those ROMs, but I don't currently have a ROM burner though.

Unfortunately, I don't have much to add about the SPoC GRiDs as I don't really know much about them. There's a very brief mention of the history of them in the readme with the version of SPoC we have in the files section. It mostly covers the Compass versions though. Apparently, one of the modifications the early Compass versions received was the replacement of their modems with cooling fans. The early Compasses didn't come with any fans at all from the factory and relied on passive cooling through the case. The fact that the majority of the boards were sandwiched together and crammed into the back half of the computer didn't help with cooling either (the components were at least spread out better in the GRiDCases). The 113X series did come with an internal fan as a standard feature though, but I don't know if NASA added further cooling modifications to those as well.

The early SPoC GRiD Compasses were also TEMPEST versions, or at least the displays were. One thing peculiar I noticed about the all of TEMPEST GRiDCases (even up through the 15XX series) is that they used the amber electroluminescent displays like the Compasses instead of the standard plasma or LCD ones. From what I've seen, none of the non-TEMPEST GRiDCases used EL and none of the TEMPEST models used plasma or LCD. I wonder what it was that made the EL displays ideal for TEMPEST GRiDs? 

I noticed one of the pictures you posted from a manual or something lists an EL display. The 15XX EL displays are also lot bigger than the ones on the Compasses and early GRiDCases. Pictures of your actual GRiDs show some unusual looking displays with out any brightness or contrast sliders, so they're likely EL. I'm curious what the displays look like powered up.

BTW, have you been able to power up the GRiDCases?

This presentation sounds interesting. I hope you'll share some more of your research, documents and ROMs/software. I'd love to know more about them!

Chris



Yahoo! Message number: 3474
Date: 18 Jul 2017 00:58:54 +0000

From: openfly@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Hey all! Putting together a presentation on a couple space flight gridcase 1530s

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I will make a megadump at some point... but regarding displays on the gridcase... 

 https://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/19920016867.pdf https://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/19920016867.pdf

 

 one of many wonderful and kinda hilarious finds.  this is nasa's post flight report on which display the PGSC models should use.  they quite literally flew them to find out.  And they chose the EL in the end based on astronaut input.
 

 I have not been able to power these units up.  As far as I can tell the PSU modifications were extensive.  I am trying to fix a 1520 stock model to run the roms / disks.  It's display is pretty hosed.  
 

 hell of a read.  The SPOC appears to have initially been used ( as seen in the tracking software ) to solve for dead reckoning being the only option the astronauts had for figuring out their position relative to earth.  Additionally there was a software package written to provide runbooks based on known error codes.
 

 Later the PGSC would have a much more expanded scope of use taking over scientific and satellite deployment payload integration work.
 

 Apparently rockwell international designed a serial integration bus for the shuttle that fit in the modem bay of the SPOC ( and likely what I see in the gridcase's i have is a similar unit ) that allowed it to interface with the shuttle.  In fact there's a research paper that discusses a multiplexer cable that could be used to patch the PGSC systems into the communications system of the shuttle if needed...
 

 https://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/19910007733.pdf https://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/19910007733.pdf

 

 ref for rockwell international modem work ... is from museum of computer history hour and a half special on GRiD systems... amazing watch:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQgoAQq7bP4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQgoAQq7bP4
 

 More to come of course.  =P  I just got a dip 28 test clip... hoping to pull the bios roms next.
 

 -Matt
 





Yahoo! Message number: 3475
Date: 18 Jul 2017 01:08:04 +0000

From: openfly@...

Subject: Re: Hey all! Putting together a presentation on a couple space flight gridcase 1530s

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



https://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/19900011351.pdf https://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/19900011351.pdf  also fun has info on app design for the grids.



Yahoo! Message number: 3476
Date: 19 Jul 2017 19:47:30 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.

  File        : /NASA PGSC ROMs/SN1045-EL-ROM-BIOS-EVEN.bin
  Uploaded by : openfly@... <openfly@...>
  Description : bios rom chip 1

You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/NASA%20PGSC%20ROMs/SN1045-EL-ROM-BIOS-EVEN.bin

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398

Regards,

openfly@... <openfly@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3477
Date: 19 Jul 2017 19:47:53 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.

  File        : /NASA PGSC ROMs/SN1045-EL-ROM-BIOS-ODD.bin
  Uploaded by : openfly@... <openfly@...>
  Description : bios rom chip 2

You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/NASA%20PGSC%20ROMs/SN1045-EL-ROM-BIOS-ODD.bin

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398

Regards,

openfly@... <openfly@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3478
Date: 19 Jul 2017 20:12:51 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.

  File        : /NASA PGSC ROMs/SN1045-EL-ROM-BIOS-EVEN (1).bin
  Uploaded by : openfly@... <openfly@...>
  Description : not corrupted binary for even chip

You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/NASA%20PGSC%20ROMs/SN1045-EL-ROM-BIOS-EVEN%20%281%29.bin

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
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Regards,

openfly@... <openfly@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3479
Date: 19 Jul 2017 20:13:12 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.

  File        : /NASA PGSC ROMs/SN1045-EL-ROM-BIOS-ODD (1).bin
  Uploaded by : openfly@... <openfly@...>
  Description : not corrupted binary for ODD chip

You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/NASA%20PGSC%20ROMs/SN1045-EL-ROM-BIOS-ODD%20%281%29.bin

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
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Regards,

openfly@... <openfly@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3480
Date: 20 Jul 2017 02:50:52 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I think I figured out what was going wrong when I tried to upload the new version of the Ari Service files. It looks like Yahoo has reduced the file size limit in the uploads section from 10MB to 5MB (10MB was bad enough!). I had to split the contents of everything into three zip files. They've now been added to their own folder. Let me know if it finally works without a hitch.

Chris



Yahoo! Message number: 3481
Date: 20 Jul 2017 02:55:53 +0000

From: rou021@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Hey all! Putting together a presentation on a couple space flight gridcase 1530s

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I didn't know that about the displays or other mods. That's pretty interesting. Thanks again for the links and uploads!

Chris



Yahoo! Message number: 3482
Date: 20 Jul 2017 14:44:56 +0000

From: rz221ebay@...

Subject: Re: Looking to buy any GRiD in any condition except LCD-based.

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Hi vladimirhadzic, no other responses since March so we should talk if you are still interested.



Yahoo! Message number: 3483
Date: 23 Jul 2017 22:29:13 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Looking for GRiD ROM Images

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Does anybody have any Bootable GRiD OS or GRiD Dos 3.3 ROMS binarys that they have dumped that will work with a 1520?





Yahoo! Message number: 3484
Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2017 21:58:10 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Looking for GRiD ROM Images





  
    
  
  
    I have a GRiDcase with MS-DOS v3.2 on it. Not sure if you can us
    that since it's not GRiD OS and it's v3.2.

    

    Here is the ROM:

    http://w7tsc.org/photogal/picture.php?/33/category/8

    

    And here is the model:

    http://w7tsc.org/photogal/picture.php?/99/category/8

    

    Since it's MS-DOS, I'm guessing there isn't any need to pull an
    image of it.

    Asa

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
Spokane County ARES/RACES Net Manager
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 7/23/2017 3:29 PM, joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop] wrote:
    

      
      
          

            
Does anybody have any Bootable GRiD OS or GRiD Dos
                3.3ROMS binarysthat they have dumped that will work
                with a 1520?

              

          

          
      


        

          
            

              
              Virus-free.
                www.avg.com
              
            

          
        

         

      
      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3485
Date: 24 Jul 2017 18:28:13 +0000

From: openfly@...

Subject: Re: Looking for GRiD ROM Images

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



hrmm i have a 1520... no app roms in it.  I can probably pull the bios for you when next i am at the workshop. 






Yahoo! Message number: 3487
Date: 24 Jul 2017 18:41:17 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Looking for GRiD ROM Images

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



I am looking for a binary image 64kb in size that I can burn on to a 27C64 EPROM chip that would fit into the slots on the front of the computer that would be bootable into DOS 3.3/3.2 or preferably GRiD OS. Any other application ROMs would be great as well.



Yahoo! Message number: 3488
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2017 20:24:01 -0700

From: Asa Jay Laughton 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Looking for GRiD ROM Images





  
    
    
  
  
    If you want to see if that will work, I'll need to have someone tell
    me how to get it off the chip.

    

    Asa

    
Asa Jay Laughton - W7TSC, MSgt, USAFR, Retired
Spokane County ARES/RACES Net Manager
******************************     
http://w7tsc.org
http://www.teampanteraracing.com

    

    On 7/24/2017 11:35 AM, joshuaparkour@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]
    wrote:
    

      
      
          

            
Thank you Asa

            
I will see if it will work.

            


            

            
Joshua

            

          

          
      


        

          
            

              
              Virus-free.
                www.avg.com
              
            

          
        

         

      
      
    

  






Yahoo! Message number: 3489
Date: 29 Jul 2017 18:20:56 +0000

From: joshuaparkour@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Looking for GRiD ROM Images

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



It appears that it is soldered to the board. 
 

 If you have a GRiD that isn't working or one that you don't mind ruining by accident go ahead and carefully melt the solder to each pin in turn then remove the chip. I wouldn't advise doing this to any GRiD that you want to keep unless you are really good with the solder gun. You would have to have a eprom burner/reader that you would then insert the chip into and the software that likely comes with it would create a binary image that could be burned to other eproms. 
 

 I have a eprom burner/reader already setup with software that I could read the chip for you should you decide to go ahead and try to remove it. You don't have to remove it if you don't want to and I would advise not removing it unless as I said before it is broken or you have a lot of experience removing and replacing small amounts of solder.
 

 Here is a quick tutorial on removing them that I found on the web.
 http://m44.wikia.com/wiki/File:Removing_a_Soldered_PLCC_EEPROM_without_expensive_tools http://m44.wikia.com/wiki/File:Removing_a_Soldered_PLCC_EEPROM_without_expensive_tools

  




Yahoo! Message number: 3490
Date: 02 Aug 2017 17:54:11 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.

  File        : /GRiD-OS Programming/Common Code Reference.pdf
  Uploaded by : ianfinder <ianfinder@...>
  Description : 

You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiD-OS%20Programming/Common%20Code%20Reference.pdf

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
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Regards,

ianfinder <ianfinder@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3491
Date: 02 Aug 2017 17:54:16 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.

  File        : /GRiD-OS Programming/Device Drivers.pdf
  Uploaded by : ianfinder <ianfinder@...>
  Description : 

You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiD-OS%20Programming/Device%20Drivers.pdf

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
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Regards,

ianfinder <ianfinder@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3492
Date: 02 Aug 2017 17:54:35 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.

  File        : /GRiD-OS Programming/ISAM.pdf
  Uploaded by : ianfinder <ianfinder@...>
  Description : 

You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiD-OS%20Programming/ISAM.pdf

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
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Regards,

ianfinder <ianfinder@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3493
Date: 02 Aug 2017 17:55:15 +0000

From: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com

Subject: New file uploaded to RuGRiD-Laptop




Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the RuGRiD-Laptop
group.

  File        : /GRiD-OS Programming/Program Development Guide.pdf
  Uploaded by : ianfinder <ianfinder@...>
  Description : 

You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RuGRiD-Laptop/files/GRiD-OS%20Programming/Program%20Development%20Guide.pdf

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
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ianfinder <ianfinder@...>





Yahoo! Message number: 3494
Date: 06 Aug 2017 01:03:27 +0000

From: jgmario9501@...

Subject: Will the 1530 bios update work for the 1520?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Hello I was wondering if the 1530 BIOS update for HDDs will work for the 1520. And if not will drives other than the one in the machine work?




Yahoo! Message number: 3495
Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 01:27:36 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Will the 1530 bios update work for the 1520?

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Hello Mario and welcome to the group.
I do not know what "1530 BIOS update for HDD's" is. I know of a BIOS configuration utility (1530conf.exe). But, I am unaware of a BIOS update that allows the 1530 to work with more hard drives.
Also, there is a BIOS configuration utility called 1520conf.exe. But both utilities do not allow more hard drives to work with the Grids.For now, we are all stuck using the original Conner hard drives. :(
I hope this answers your questions.-Shawn

      From: "jgmario9501@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Saturday, August 5, 2017 7:03 PM
 Subject: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Will the 1530 bios update work for the 1520?

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Hello I was wondering if the 1530 BIOS update for HDDs will work for the 1520. And if not will drives other than the one in the machine work?








Yahoo! Message number: 3496
Date: 06 Aug 2017 02:16:14 +0000

From: jgmario9501@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Will the 1530 bios update work for the 1520?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Whoops I meant the 1530ROM.ZIP 



Yahoo! Message number: 3497
Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 02:37:40 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Will the 1530 bios update work for the 1520?

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Mario,If you're asking "will the files contained in the file 1530rom.zip work with the 1520?" then the answer is no.The 1530 is a '386 and the 1520 is a '286.I hope this answers your question. If not, feel free to ask it a different way.Thanks,-Shawn

      From: "jgmario9501@... [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Saturday, August 5, 2017 8:16 PM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Will the 1530 bios update work for the 1520?

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Whoops I meant the 1530ROM.ZIP 








Yahoo! Message number: 3498
Date: 06 Aug 2017 02:42:55 +0000

From: jgmario9501@...

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Will the 1530 bios update work for the 1520?

text/plain;  charset=utf-8



Oh ok thank you for your answer. I am trying to figure out if i can use a SD to IDE adaptor in it. That is why I was wondering if it would work. 





Yahoo! Message number: 3499
Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2017 03:26:37 +0000 (UTC)

From: Shawnerz 

Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Will the 1530 bios update work for the 1520?

text/plain; charset=UTF-8



Sorry, no. In both models, the BIOS queries the hard drive on power up. If the hard drive is not on the list in BIOS, the Grid will not boot from the hard drive. Depending on the model and version of BIOS, there are 3, or 6, or 8 specific models of Conner hard drives that are supported.We (another user Phil, and I, and maybe others) have edited the list and entered the CHS (cylinder, head, sector) data for more modern hard drives. It has been unsuccessful. We got lucky with one model of a Conner hard drive, but I think that was a fluke.My plan is to put a logic analyzer on the IDE lines between the motherboard and hard drive and monitor the differences between the Conner hard drive and others that do not boot. Hopefully, that will yield some clues.I bought this board: http://store.digilentinc.com/analog-discovery-2-100msps-usb-oscilloscope-logic-analyzer-and-variable-power-supply/ to use as logic analyzer. 
But I have other projects more important that this right now.
Another mystery is the checksum. On top of the BIOS EPROMs, the simple Hex-16 checksum is printed on a label. But, that checksum value does not appear in the BIOS code. If you make a change to the BIOS code, (which results in a change to the checksum value) and burn it in to another set of EPROMs, the computer will not boot. 
To get around that, I made changes to the text header at the beginning of the file in order to get back to the original checksum. It would be nice to understand how the checksum value is computed and stored in the BIOS code.
I just hope it's not some weird 2's complemented, left-shifted 5 times and XOR-ed with a date value result. ;-)
-Shawn 


      From: "jgmario9501@yahoo.com [RuGRiD-Laptop]" <RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com>
 To: RuGRiD-Laptop@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Saturday, August 5, 2017 8:42 PM
 Subject: Re: [RuGRiD-Laptop] Will the 1530 bios update work for the 1520?

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Oh ok thank you for your answer. I am trying to figure out if i can use a SD to IDE adaptor in it. That is why I was wondering if it would work.